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Allan G, BSA_WM20, Chip H, Gordon Gray, mondtster, NickL, Rohan
Total Likes: 14
Original Post (Thread Starter)
#848099 05/05/2021 12:19 AM
by Mark. L
Mark. L
Is a JASO MA2 oil ok to run in a 1970 Bonneville?
Liked Replies
#848333 May 7th a 12:48 PM
by BSA_WM20
BSA_WM20
The very best oil for a British motorcycle engine is whatever you just took out very regularly.
The golden rule with BSA's is
Change the oil
Change the oil again
Then change the oil because you can not remeber if you changed the oil.
We had a member with a bugered timing side bush that would not hold oil pressure lower than 2000 rpm.
He put another 80,000 on that bottom end before he sold the bike still with the same buggered botom end
How did he do it ?
well he changed the oil every time he ran the bike then when he had a couple of gallons of "slightly used oil " he put that in his truck .
Even the cheapest cut back supermarket oil bought now days is better than what was used in the engine when it was new .

In modern times , BSA engines wear more from oil starved starts because the bike has not been run for the last 6 months than they do from using the "wrong" oil.
I mostly run my bike on Lawnmower oil as I get it really cheap so can happily change it after every rally , should enough stay in the engine to require changing.
Have had lots of members that worked for local government, botanical gardens, trucking companies that all use deisel oil cause they could "borrow" it from work for free at lunch time .
Again their bikes did not blow up cause they used the wrong oil .
3 members like this
#848134 May 5th a 12:29 PM
by John Healy
John Healy
Please disregarde the previous post. You want to use JASO MA2 in your T140. It has a wet clutch. JASO MA2 was fomulated for ANY motorcycle with a wet clutch. Read what oil maker Amsoil has to say about it.


https://blog.amsoil.com/whats-the-difference-between-jaso-ma-and-jaso-ma2-oil/
1 member likes this
#848213 May 6th a 06:31 AM
by Rohan
Rohan
Aero engine oils don't have zinc in them, for a VERY good reason.
Anything with a metallic content to it is VERBOTTEN in aero oils
- or it can leave a metallic ash build up in the combustion chambers.
Not good when your life depends on that engine to keep on keeping on.

So aero oils use more expensive additive(s) to do the same job.
And a raft of other additives as well.

Mere terrestrial engine oils use the zinc version, since its cheap cheap cheap...
Unless it has a caatalytic convertor, which is a no no no.

Aeroshell used to advertise their engine oils in 1930s motorcycle publications.
More from a racing standpoint, since aero engines and motorcycle racers mostly
both have their throttles wide open most of the time..

Aeroshell synthetic would make sense in (older) motorcycles, in the right conditions,
but its $$$ per quart, and motorcycle oils are generally cheaper.
https://www.flightstore.com.au/assets/full/15W50QT.jpg
Diesel oils are cheaper again - and do an equivalent job or better on the ground. ?

'70 weight' is pretty nominal - isn't that what they recommend for worn engines (not aero engines note)
25w/70 depends on what temp you measure the viscosity at to get any meaningful comparison ??
1 member likes this
#848327 May 7th a 10:51 AM
by triton thrasher
triton thrasher
No-one I can see is chiming in with experience of mechanical failures which they know were caused by a shortcoming in their oil.

I’ve done many miles on most types of oil. Nearest things to problems I have seen were:

SAE50 mineral oil that was so thick on a cold morning that it would not flow fast enough from the tank. Oil pressure suddenly dropped as revs rose.

10W/40 mineral oil that burnt and leaked faster than 20W/50.

El Cheapo no-rating 20W/50 oil, used for breaking in, which became very thin and runny by 300 miles. Looked like it was no longer a multigrade.

None of these things caused any visible damage.

That’s in a 650 with E3134 profile nitrided cams.
1 member likes this
#848369 May 8th a 12:24 AM
by GeoffLLLL
GeoffLLLL
"Aircraft engines are big slow revving machines with large clearances.
Plain bearings and mild cams. Remind anyone of anything ?"

Even a BSA M20 rev's harder than most aero engines by about two times.

There is just no real comparison between aero engines and old British bike engines as far as JASO ratings and the function of ZDDP is concerned.
1 member likes this
#848417 May 8th a 03:17 PM
by MarksterTT
MarksterTT
Originally Posted by Dibnah
Aero engine max rpm: I previously looked at using Avgas in a Brit single; piston speed and flame front speed being key factors. Most Lycomings aero engines rev up to about 3500rpm at take off. Most petrol aero engines drive the prop directly, which means that the speed of the prop tip restricts engine rpm.

The " Best Oils For the Norton Commando " webpage refers to a straight 60 oil; I'm surprised that would flow effectively through the bearings from cold.

Would a modern diesel engine oil safely clean the sludge trap on a Triumph?

Typo? Direct drive lycomings max rpm for most 2,750, a lot of homebuilders will turn them 3,000 rpm with fixed pitch prop to get a little more rpm/hp for take off/climb. Like running a bike with a one speed transmission...all compromise.

Mixture of 100LL with pump hi test is my go to break-in fuel, a little lead on the valves and a greater detonation margin doesn't hurt...my opinion of course.
1 member likes this
#848585 May 10th a 06:17 PM
by Andy Higham
Andy Higham
The vast majority of modern motorcycle engines use flat tappets, usually an inverted bucket with a shim on top or underneath. Others use a radiussed tappet on a rocker
1 member likes this
#848538 May 9th a 11:44 PM
by NickL
NickL
Well, i change the oil and filter on my bikes every 5000 miles whether they need it or not.
Just use old SG crap 20/50.
Seems to be ok for the thrashing i give 'em.

Given the choice , i'd make it compulsory for everyone to use 'R' in all road vehicles as
it would just be such a pleasant aroma everywhere, better than roasting coffee even.
1 member likes this
#849416 May 20th a 03:29 AM
by NickL
NickL
Ha, i said ridden like an m20.

Yes a big mileage, but i can't see it being due to the oil alone.
If he changed it every 1500 miles it probably cost him more than
rebuilding the engine twice and changing it every 5000.
That gear is $100 a gallon.
Cruising along motorways at steady speeds is ideal motoring for any engine.
Was the motor all standard? Alloy rods etc?
Not downing it or anything but just sticking mobil 1 into a bike doesn't change
everything. I've known plenty of blokes blow up motors using all sorts of oils!
1 member likes this
#849515 May 21st a 12:33 AM
by Rohan
Rohan
Originally Posted by NickL
Rohan, you say that bloke changed his mobil 1 every 10k miles? On a norton?
So, he just bought a mk3 commando and put mobil 1 in it and rode it 88k miles,
changing the oil every 10k.?

Thats what he said. All the other routine servicing too - wheel bearings, cables etc. Dunno if that includes clutch or not.
He was an oil industry exec, with Duckhams to begin with - so in on the birth of multigrades. He was in the NOC, and
he and his wife toured and turned up to Norton rallies all over Europe, for quite some years. Hobot met up with him someplace.
He showed pics of it, all over the place, it still looked like new, obviously well kept.

Some other folks have done big mileages on their Nortons too. Jim Comstock on his fuel injected old Commando
writes on the Access Forum about such stuff - he did the oil testing.
Ludwig with the P11 and touring Commando from Belgium also.

There is a Vincent about that did 500,000+ miles for its owner. Only 3 engine rebuilds. Mineral oil too.
"If it never cools down it never wears out".

I've been in a taxi (Fairlane) that had 840,000 miles on the clock. Hereabouts, taxis have to be pensioned off after 4 years.
It had been maintained to keep the rest of it in fine fettle.
"If it never cools down it never wears out".
1 member likes this
#850087 May 26th a 11:26 PM
by Rohan
Rohan
Originally Posted by dave jones
What a horrible engine!

Thats pretty normal for pre-multigrade oil pre the detergent era.
Nick is right, cleaned up perfectly. Note that the bearing is already cleaned, I was curious as to its survival
Thats EXACTLY why you don't just pour modern oils into older engines WITHOUT CLEANING THEM. !!!!!!!!!!


You should see inside an engine that been run on old style Castor-based oil,
EVERYTHING is coated in a strange yellowy rubbery sticky coating.
Its impossible to wash off, its impossible to blast if off (and you wouldn't want to anyway with internal components)
quite difficult to scrape off and where its baked on its really baked on.
And probably still in perfect condition underneath.
And you sure wouldn't want to add modern oil into that ...

Oils ain't oils, Sol ...
1 member likes this
#850109 May 27th a 01:21 PM
by Allan G
Allan G
Originally Posted by Rohan
Hence post #2 on this thread ....

Originally Posted by Rohan
Oh No, Another OIl Thread !

Even still, you were drawn to the dark side and got caught up in it laughing
1 member likes this
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