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#900709 01/19/23 8:27 pm
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p400 Offline OP
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Not having visited for about a year, got an email telling me automatic Brit Forum reup, I thought I would start a thread on my current project.
Since there seems to be a lot of posting without graphics or pictures (critical for any Bike posting), I wanted to se how easily pics are posted as well.

Partially reassembled at this point in 2023 with the reason for 2021 disassembly being replacement of main bearings and crankshaft.

20230112_Asembly1.jpg
Last edited by p400; 01/19/23 9:35 pm.
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This B Rapide did not need full restoration, so the RFM is complete from past work and assembles quite nicely.

I am out of cyl base gaskets ET102 and that is holding up piston/cylinder install.

20230119_Assembly2.jpg 20220729_EngAssm1.jpg
Last edited by p400; 01/20/23 2:45 pm.
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The rods look familiar. I assume they are attached to Maughan flywheels. It’s a shame those bits are hidden away out of sight.

In the first photo… that triangular piece holding the PD10/1… I’m assuming that is so you can adjust the chain tension prior to putting the cover on?

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Originally Posted by Cyborg
In the first photo… that triangular piece holding the PD10/1… I’m assuming that is so you can adjust the chain tension prior to putting the cover on?

Actually PD10/1 is so loose that you cant do that. I simply use this piece as it is included with Spares tool, sprocket toothy thing. after primary cover is on and PD10/1 is held inboard and outboard then I can tighten, however I am waiting on a V3 Neal Videan tension blade. Planning ahead does not seem to be in my future.

Last edited by p400; 01/20/23 4:36 pm.
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That makes more sense. I could use one of those toothy things. I was tempted to try casting one out of Cerrobend, but just looked up the price on theVOC Spares site. Surprised they are that cheap.

I have a B and the hole for the PD10/1 was pretty sad looking. Had to be sleeved.

I bought one of those blades from Neal, but haven’t installed it yet. Seems like they are a good idea.

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Still waiting on gaskets for cyl base, but need to make progress. Rings checked for end gap and installed, pistons installed.
Priority mail says out for delivery on gaskets.

20230120_DailyProgress1.jpg
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Do not recall seeing match stamps on other Vincent head/cyl, maybe it was my machine shop, but here is what I am seeing.

20230120_CylHeadMatchMarks1.jpg 20230120_CylHeadMatchMarks2.jpg
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I’ve seen lots of different stampings, but none that jived like that. Not that I can draw any conclusions because everything came to me in baskets. Likely added by a previous owner when they were lapped in?…or like you say… the machinist did it.

I’m sure it just the angle and lightning in the first photo, but it looks like the machinist took off about.090” too much.

Ps… what are you using for a ring compressor?

Last edited by Cyborg; 01/20/23 7:34 pm.
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The "O" and "OO" stamps are probably later marks. The Factory used a larger font "A", "U" and "S" on the jacket flange for fine grading.

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Gaskets did arrive, oiled them, slid them on past piston/rings, oiled cyl and rings, compressed rings, slid the cylinders on.

Why didn't I install the the pushrod tube seals? probably fear of popping them into a cylinder.

Ring compressor tool cal van ring compressor #14400 (maybe now #641), it works for me, not happy about ease of band removal after installed cylinder, but works for me .

The wood sticks 0.915 x 0.696 x 6.0" are the most important, under the piston, on top of the base gasket.
Cut to size, sanded smooth, urethane clear to oil proof.

20230120_DailyProgress2.jpg
Last edited by p400; 01/22/23 2:29 am.
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Your work looks very thorough so I suppose you've done this before, but if not I, and no doubt others on this Forum will be glad to share a treasury of useless information with you. As my old Welsh uncle Dai used to say; "press on remorseless!" Have you lapped in the head joints?

Last edited by hardarser; 01/21/23 12:22 am. Reason: Further question.
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finished today realizing I need to revise the exhaust lifter pieces to D specs.
Yes, The head/cyl fit is finished to my specs. Lapping complete.

20230120_DailyProgress3.jpg
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Not happy with the exhaust lifter opening , need parts ordered on Monday, hope in stock.
Waiting on primary blade and pushrod tube seals as well.

Installed starter pieces and electrical hook up at solenoid under battery.

20230121_DailyProgress1.jpg 20230121_DailyProgress2.jpg 20230121_DailyProgress3.jpg 20230121_DailyProgress4.jpg
Last edited by p400; 01/21/23 8:02 pm.
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Hi P400,
I read an article/ account of where a Vincent owner got into all sorts of trouble when the starter button stuck on while he was testing in the garage
I think the bike was also in gear??
The tin bodied buttons commonly used are not great quality to say the least.
It is well worthwhile (essential) to add a second switch on the starter control circuit as a safety and security feature, preventing unwanted activation by small boys etc..
When I fitted an electric leg to my BSA 650 I bought a two wire push button on ebay, I earthed one side of the solenoid, ran the live through a fuse to the push button then to the hidden switch and back to the solenoid.
This way an earth fault will blow the fuse rather than engage the starter
Alternatively a key switch could be used instead of the hidden security switch

John

Last edited by chaterlea25; 01/21/23 9:18 pm.
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While updating the valve lifter I suggest getting an updated ET169 with a seal. Coventry sells them under part number ET169SP. It uses a Norton valve seal instead of the two rubber washers.

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Received new V3 parts from Steve Hamel, primary blade and seals.
Installed primary cover, adjusted primary tension, all seems fine.

Plopped the heads on for visual check, began reviving the period side float pre mono carb pair.
I need to retrain or refresh soldering tiny cable ends onto cables.

20230124_DailyProgress1.jpg 20230124_DailyProgress2.jpg
Last edited by p400; 01/25/23 1:31 am.
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If readers haven't seen it yet, there is a marvellous website called "Amelia Squariel". Seeing that job of soldering just reminded me of it. If you ever wanted to know details concerning British bikes it is worth a visit.

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Did you remember to install your wine cork before putting the primary cover back on?

Depending on where you ordered your ET225 and ET161/1 from, there is a small chance you might run into a problem. I bought the two pieces separately and found out that the manufacturer had change production. Initially they were being produced with 4.5 mm threads, but we’re subsequently changed to 4mm without advising the vendors. The Spares company sells them as a set. Their site still says they are 4.5mm, but they are actually 4 mm. Not that it matters when you are buying it as a set. Maybe you have them already….

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Thank you hardarser, I have a friend restoring, actually reassembling an Ariel for his dad apart since the 70s.
Cable info was helpful.

Thank you Cyborg, I did install a full wine cork at each end of the KS shaft bore. I did see Spares selling the pair of ET161/ET225.
I did order the pair altho I am not happy waiting for Royal Mail.

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North of the 49th, I’m not sure how much of the problem is the Royal Mail or our customs. The initial ET225 took 4 weeks…Coventry was out of them at the time. I ordered the ET225 from VOC, but it didn’t fit my new ET161/1, so they sent me a kit, which was nice of them, but delivery took another 4 weeks. I hate doing the timing chest in fits and starts. Installing the updated bits obviously isn’t rocket science, but it was a PITA.

No doubt you are up to speed with cable soldering, but just in case you aren’t happy with the flux you are using… I tried this stuff and it definitely works better than any paste I have ever used. I should probably invest in an electric solder pot.

PS… If you are using 2 corks, that tells me you have full confidence in the electric leg and are going sans kick starter. That saves you some machining though. I’m going without K/S as well. Spend the money I saved on a Roadside Assistance card.

[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]E92FD588-AB21-438D-B93C-A6FC04A2635F by First Last, on Flickr

Last edited by Cyborg; 01/25/23 9:31 pm.
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Clutch assembled and installed, I dropped the starter out to allow tightening clutch assembly.

New pieces for ex valve lifter on the way.
I remembered the ET171 from1947 was a smaller cable end bore requiring filing a new cable end smaller to fit,
New ET171 should solve that issue.

I have not soldered a cable in 8 years, so I am open to suggestions, training, videos, etc.
Yes Stay Clean flux I remember but have never purchased or used.
I have an eBay China solder pot, never used.
Dont know what to fill it with.

I have an old choke cable to repair or solder a new end on. do I need to dip this old cable end in acid?

I have four more cables to make up to install Mk1 AMAL as alternate fuel system.

20230125_DailyProgrss1.jpg 20230125_DailyProgrss2.jpg 20230125_DailyProgrss3.jpg
Last edited by p400; 01/26/23 1:55 am.
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Er, why I mentioned Amelia Squariel is that you'll never find a more thorough dissertation on CABLES AND CABLE MAKING anywhere, notwithstanding Cyborg's excellent contribution. Go back to the page and click on "Cables"; and as my old sixth-grade teacher used to say, "READ, MARK AND INWARDLY DIGEST!" Cheers from Australia. Incidentally, the large idler gear boss and shaft appears to be an original alloy with steel shaft two piece item. If so it is, after 70 odd years, untrustworthy. Replacement with a two piece all steel item is wise. Likewise if you have an alloy large idler gear some supplied in the Seventies were bad. Better off with a steel gear.

Last edited by hardarser; 01/26/23 11:45 am.
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Another word of warning… (that’s pretty much all you’re going to get around these parts) If you are buying a new ET171 and switching to a lip seal instead of the two rubber rings, you may find the surface of the ET171 is not up to the task. I just received one, (ordered because I discovered the last one in the bin was too short) and instead of the rod being threaded into the cable end thingy, it was brazed in. After brazing it looks like they used an angle grinder to remove the excess. If I was using a lip seal, I would have to clean up the sealing surface for it to work properly.
If you are still going to use the 2 rubber rings, I would install them on the ET171 and check the fit into the distance piece. The new rings are way way too tight… to the point where the spring can’t apply a reasonable amount of force (if any) on the rings. In order to reduce the amount of oil escaping the ET171 has to squeeze the rings up against the ET168 hard enough to hold in all the huffing and puffing going on in there. The rings ( in my opinion) don’t need to be a tight fit in the tube. I chucked my ET171 in the lathe and reduced the diameter of the rings until they were a slip fit in the tube. If done carefully, you could do it in a drill with sandpaper on a hard flat backer. It will likely only work with new rings that don’t have any oil on them and a clean ET171 or the rings will just turn on the shaft when you apply the sandpaper I also took a slight skim off the face of the ET168, so the rings had a smooth place to seal against.
As for the huffing and puffing, one of the locals here did a lot of testing with breather timing. He found that he got much better results with timing that was later that what is normally recommended.
When you adjust your new link between the lifters, you’ll wish you had 3 hands. I did mine prior to installing the pushrod tubes, so I was able to hold the follower down on the base circle of the lobe with my finger while setting the clearance on the ET69F. You can stuff a pushrod in there, but you need to keep pressure on it…. hence the need for 3 hands. It will become painfully obvious unless you’re a lot more flexible than I am.

Ps… for the cables, I slide the cable end onto the cable and then use a home made “ bird cage tool” to flare out the end of the cable. Then it gets dipped into the flux and then into the solder pot… trying not to accumulate too much solder.

Last edited by Cyborg; 01/26/23 5:49 pm.
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Just received my lifter bits today.
I have the Same issue you have with new ET165AS. I ordered to find out if threads/length/ differ from OEM. And also to pair with new seal unit . Not sure of next solution with these parts, need to wait till ET225 set arrives.

20230126_DailyProgress1.jpg 20230126_DailyProgress2.jpg
Last edited by p400; 01/26/23 11:37 pm.
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In theory… Assuming the ET225 kit is coming form VOC Spares, you’ll be good to go and you can return that ET166/1 in the photo because now it is surplus.
Once you can guesstimate the travel required for the ET165AS, you can probably clean up the grinding marks so the seal will seal. That one doesn’t look as rough as mine, but hard to tell for sure. I don’t know if the stock of ET165AS in the UK is the same, but even if they are different, you have to deal with the wait time. Apparently Royal Mail was hacked recently and it was causing delays with overseas shipping. Not sure it it’s back up to speed yet. If you do order from them, you could email Michelle and arrange it to be sent by courier. Whoever they are using seems to get things here in reasonable time. Weird thing is, it’s the mailman who delivers it and collects the blood money if any is due.
Those D breather caps come in handy for the indicators and I find it much easier to follow what going on when using digital versus analog gauges spinning in opposite directions.

Last edited by Cyborg; 01/27/23 12:40 am.
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