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#895244 11/12/22 10:43 pm
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[Linked Image]

I think this type of metal tank center mounting is a thing of beauty. 9 different pieces.

Just saying

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/13/22 12:58 am.

Gordon Gray in NC, USA........White man broke the code

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8 pieces? Don't see them (but then I've never used one of these fashionable road-apple devices)... could you show how it all works?

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Gordon: I am with you on this one. It is very clever without being too heavy and it isolates the tank quite well from the frame.

Gordo


The roadside repairs make for the best post ride stories.
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Originally Posted by Steve Erickson
8 pieces? Don't see them (but then I've never used one of these fashionable road-apple devices)... could you show how it all works?

Steve.......I'm as sharp as a tack... blush...Sorry, there are 9 different pieces.

[Linked Image]

The cap has three pieces. Cap, bushing (rubber) and spacer.

[Linked Image]

It's a bit of a bugger to get all three to cooperate.......so I didn't take it apart. If someone wants pics of those three separately, I can do that ( if someone else doesn't post one first)

[Linked Image]

I forgot to count the washer on the nut.... it's a special bit that fits the shouldered nut.

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/13/22 1:26 am.

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Tres chic. It certainly is pretty classy...

How many engineer/designers muddle-forked over this, while happily continuing to give us those miserable 68 footpeg mounts for 69?

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I've never been able to make this work with that spacer over or under the big rubber O-ring; with the spacer in there, the fore and aft trim pieces don't fit right in the cup. Everything seems to fit fine without the spacer, and the ends stopped breaking off the trim pieces.

Also, it's important that the nut tightens against the sleeve and pins the sleeve to the frame. This should not be a problem if you have all the correct parts (including the correct rubbers under the tank). If the sleeve is too short, the cup will be stressed and will break away from the chrome ring.


Mark Z

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and that my friend. is an indicator of the downfall of Brit bike dominance. too many parts to do a simple job

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mine broke 44 years ago and a friend brazed it for me. its been fine ever since.

didnt have the ring over thr doughnut when i bought it and i never knew they existed until now

mine doesnt bottom out, or at least ive never tightened it until it did. maybe thats why it works.


i'm old enough to remember when patriotism meant not trying to overthrow the government.
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I tried taking a photo of a damaged cup but just couldn't get the details. Basically it had been ripped apart. Someone probably left the spacer out having no idea what it's purpose was.

Mitch makes a valid point. But there's just something about this one I admire.

I've seen several kinds of bodges. Some were crude but worked and others given enough riding time.....could cause the tank to fail.

Mark........I've never used the trim (yet). Never had any that was worth showing off. I have a tank that I would love to add trim to but have no idea what it came off. I'm 99% sure it wasn't a unit single. I'll post a pic of it and maybe someone can tell?? It's the metal "sculpted" tank....one of the larger ones ( not exactly sure how much fuel it holds) with a filler cap I'm not familiar with. The tunnel is much wider on this tank. I had to add 1/4" of material to each side of the frame bumpers for it to fit a unit single's frame (BSA). The stock unit single metal tank rubbers seem to fit fine.

Since I'm rambling on about tanks.....I was having Tab Classics make me a tank......turns out Mark Purslow was one of the fabricators that worked in the shop. He died at this years IOM TT. Sad to loose someone that unexpectedly. I understand it's a small shop and it has been tough on them ....but they are bouncing back. Good on em.

to be continued

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/16/22 11:33 pm.

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I like the solution, but have constant problem with threaded part sticking up to much above the nut, preventing rubber cover to seat comfortably in it's place.. Perhaps should use some washers under the spacer to rise all the assembly a bit?
But my tank is home market 4 gallon for a twin

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Originally Posted by Adam M.
........But my tank is home market 4 gallon for a twin

Wouldn't happen to have a photo of it you could share?

The bolt length won't change with adding washers under the spacer......just where the nut stops.??????? That's a question as much as a statement.

My tank I'm trying to ID....
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image][Linked Image]

I have the small and larger 69 unit single sculpted steel tanks on the shelf. All I can say is this tank is bigger. I got bad habit of not liking to run out of gas so I keep it filled up. Last trip I was getting nervous as I was getting close to 200 miles so I chickened out and gassed up. So I've never reached reserve. ( I've run on reserve for a bit just to be sure it's still working). Bike gets almost 70mpg.

I don't recognize the filler cap.......anybody?

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/16/22 11:02 pm.

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*NOTE: Gordon, I posted the following before seeing the above photos.*

"I tried taking a photo of a damaged cup but just couldn't get the details. Basically it had been ripped apart. Someone probably left the spacer out having no idea what it's purpose was."

By "spacer", I assume you mean the sleeve that goes over the bolt. Been there, tried DYI solutions and ruined a couple of cups before biting the bullet and sourcing the correct parts. By the way, that extra washer goes at the bottom of the sleeve, and is important to make up the correct length.

"I have a tank that I would love to add trim to but have no idea what it came off. I'm 99% sure it wasn't a unit single."

What bike are you using this on? If the tank doesn't have a ridge down the center, it will not accommodate the trim strips. My knowledge is confined to '67 twin cyl. chrome tank. Without trim strips, I would think the cup with the "spigots" fore and aft would look odd. Tanks without chrome trim had a different sort of mount, some where the rubber plug pushes directly into the tank.

Commentary: With all the mounts "correct" (including having a proper bushing in the bottom "strap"), I've ridden for many years without breaking anything. HOWEVER... Even though I have the proper molded rubber behind the tank badges, and even though I used rubber O-rings under the heads of the single mounting screws, I'm starting to see a small spider crack around the screw on one side. Lovely as the Lucite badges are, I guess I understand why BSA went to the die-cast badges.

Last edited by Mark Z; 11/13/22 7:01 pm.

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Gordon, could that be a '69 A65 FS home market tank? Monza filler caps were used on later A65 chrome tanks, but over to the side.

I don't think that center trim piece is correct for that tank.


Mark Z

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Originally Posted by Mark Z
Gordon, could that be a '69 A65 FS home market tank? Monza filler caps were used on later A65 chrome tanks, but over to the side.

I don't think that center trim piece is correct for that tank.

I just looked at photos of '69 Firebird Scramblers, and the tanks look like the one in your photo - trim strip rear only, Monza cap in center. I can't see the tops of the tanks, but I would bet there's only one "spigot" on that center trim piece.


Mark Z

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Originally Posted by Mark Z
Originally Posted by Mark Z
Gordon, could that be a '69 A65 FS home market tank? Monza filler caps were used on later A65 chrome tanks, but over to the side.

I don't think that center trim piece is correct for that tank.

I just looked at photos of '69 Firebird Scramblers, and the tanks look like the one in your photo - trim strip rear only, Monza cap in center. I can't see the tops of the tanks, but I would bet there's only one "spigot" on that center trim piece.

I was wrong; I finally found a photo of the top of a tank; the center chrome piece has two spigots, fore and aft, just like my '67 chrome tank. The FS in question is listed as a "concourse restoration", so I have to believe it's correct.

By the way, I was able to source the trim strips for my '67 tank, either from British Cycle Supply or Walridge Motors. That was a while ago though, and I don't know if the '69 FS bit is the same.


Mark Z

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Road apples.... laughing

I just got through doing something I should have done a LONG time ago.....I've been going on a quick measurement across the bottom of the tank.

I convinced myself that my mystery tank was MUCH bigger that the one on my other B44R. Measuring it this way it is only 1/8" wider than my sidecar tug's tank. I wonder if the color scheme gave off an illusion (to me) of being larger than it actually is?

Here's the tank off my sidecar tug......thought to have come off a 69 B25

[Linked Image]

Measures at the widest part of the tank.....which is not the bottom.....12 1/8"

Here's what is thought to be a 1969 B25 tank

[Linked Image]

Measuring .....12 1/4"

Here's one of the larger sculpted metal tanks

[Linked Image]

Measuring 13 1/4"

My mystery tank measures the same as the B25. So it is only 1/8" wider than the other tank I've spent time behind......with a different color scheme??? Keep in mind these are replacing the stock (for me) fiberglass tanks that are only 11"+- wide.

SO......the B25 trim might work....I got one of those to try. ONLY real mystery is that filler cap.......is it an aftermarket item or was it part of a particular model?????

Yep.........went though all of that but didn't get a photo of the mystery tank getting measured......you know what it looks like though.

PLUS..........the sidecar rig doesn't get gas mileage like the bike the mystery tank is on.......that bike has high gearing (19/47) and gets close to 70mpg. Sidecar tug's gearing is much lower......gas stops are a lot closer.

Excuses, excuses, excuses............

PS....I didn't take any other measurements this time around. Maybe later, tunnel width, overall length and height? To see if there's any other differences.

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/16/22 11:03 pm.

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Gordon, the red and white paint scheme also suggests a '69-'70 Firebird Scrambler home market tank. Didn't you say the channel is wider than your B25 tank?

The filler cap looks stock. Later A65 chrome tanks ('69, '70, not sure about '68) had flip up caps like that.


Mark Z

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Originally Posted by Mark Z
Gordon, the red and white paint scheme also suggests a '69-'70 Firebird Scrambler home market tank. Didn't you say the channel is wider than your B25 tank?

The filler cap looks stock. Later A65 chrome tanks ('69, '70, not sure about '68) had flip up caps like that.

Firebirds have been seen all red with knee grips and also with chrome panels from original (I had one with the chromed panels also). The channels should be same for A65 and B series. they are quite wide even compared to some of the A65 tanks and have rubber mounts to suit.

The last tank in primer is a 70 A65 Lightning tank. - that should have chromed panels also.

The cap is identical to one Gary E has on one of his 67 or 68 off road A series bikes? (Im sure he will chime in?), the commonly used cap had a square button and was probably easier to press with a gloved finger. the type pictured was often used on some cars - so I beleive.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (now rebuilt)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

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Okay the mystery tank is a repaint but looking at the bottom it “could” be copying the paint job under it?

I need to do some more measuring and post a photo of the two tanks I use on my Roadsters to see if someone else is fooled by the color scheme????

I’m probably not going to check the capacity because it’s just not something I want to do right now. I have too many other things to take care of. But at least for the pictured tanks I will take more measurements (I have more tanks but I think these are a good sample)

Mark……since the mystery tank is the same width as the B25….that kinda throws a wrench in things. That tank is actually referred to as the “small” tank in the unit single world. I’ll report back with more comparisons between the 4 I have handy.

Thank you guys for the replies

PS, I’m no Twins/Triples man so I don’t recognize that filler cap…..but I’m happy to hear it’s a common BSA bit?

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/14/22 1:08 pm.

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Originally Posted by Mark Z
*NOTE: Gordon, I posted the following before seeing the above photos.*

"I tried taking a photo of a damaged cup but just couldn't get the details. Basically it had been ripped apart. Someone probably left the spacer out having no idea what it's purpose was."

By "spacer", I assume you mean the sleeve that goes over the bolt. Been there, tried DYI solutions and ruined a couple of cups before biting the bullet and sourcing the correct parts. By the way, that extra washer goes at the bottom of the sleeve, and is important to make up the correct length.



Commentary: With all the mounts "correct" (including having a proper bushing in the bottom "strap"), I've ridden for many years without breaking anything. HOWEVER... Even though I have the proper molded rubber behind the tank badges, and even though I used rubber O-rings under the heads of the single mounting screws, I'm starting to see a small spider crack around the screw on one side. Lovely as the Lucite badges are, I guess I understand why BSA went to the die-cast badges.

Mark……I agree 100% with you about using the correct parts. Yes the “spacer” I’m referring too is the one that goes into the buffer and the bolt passes through it. It’s an important part IMO. But it’s something that I’ve seen left out or replaced with something completely different. IMO you need the correct bits for it to work as designed. Which probably doesn’t matter for a bike that will only see a dozen miles a year.

The single screw plastic badge (teardrop) is my favorite……but reproductions are not nearly as nice as original. I made the mistake of picking up a set of made in India badges in black and gold……parts of the gold disappeared after a month or do. I got no clue where it went…..musta dissolved???? It was more of a cheap yellow brass color anyway. I’ve never been a fan of the larger 2 hole metal badge……..but I’m stuck with using them.


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Originally Posted by Mark Z
Didn't you say the channel is wider than your B25 tank?

The filler cap looks stock. Later A65 chrome tanks ('69, '70, not sure about '68) had flip up caps like that.

Mark……I haven’t actually measured the tunnels/channels (but I will) I have 3 different tank buffers…..with three different thicknesses. I had to add material to the ones on the mystery tanks frame. I’m thinking the buffers on there were the middle width buffers?

So in my muddled mind that made me think the tunnel was wider. My guess is……all the tunnels could be the same.

I go back to a time when someone off the board had emailed me that there were actually 4-5 different versions of the scalloped tank and he in fact had an example of all of them. I wish we’d had done more sharing back then and had photos and measurements of his collection. I’m not sure that my 1/8” difference in width is an actual different tank or just a manufacturing tolerance?

But I’m on a roll so I’ll measure up the ones I have here.

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT……..when trying to fit a new choke (air) cable and you are focused on how it runs from the lever around the speedo and through the triple…..keep in mind it has a metal wire running through it and it “could” touch the positive side of the battery. IF it does….even though you’re holding the outer sheath it WILL still get hot. The section that gets super heated is going to end up inside the carb. IF that section of the cable fails……the air valve closes and you will have no choice but to pull the carb top to get at it…..which in my case means seat and tank must come off.

For Sale……brand new, never used choke cable. Pay no attention to the discoloration at one end. Thought to have come from the Steve McQueen collection. $200 plus shipping and handling.

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/16/22 11:05 pm.

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Anyone have a screwdriver "from the Steve McQueen collection", for less than $1,000 bucks?

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Lazy day at work yesterday and that carried over at home. So I didn’t take any photos or measurements. I’ll try to do better tonight.

Irish Swede……sir, I’ll look but think all my Steve McQueen Collection screwdrivers are WAY over $1000. I have one that the guy I got it from used to be neighbors to a fellow who’s cousin used to deliver pizza to a shop next door to Mr McQueen’s. He swears this screwdriver was Mr McQueen’s personal off road screwdriver and he would never leave home without it. I could be talked out if it but it’s gona cost $$$$. BUT….if you’re interested I have THE valve core out of the front tire of the bike that made the famous jump……got outbid on the rear’s core. $800 plus shipping and handling. Please allow 4-6 weeks for delivery.

Last edited by Gordon Gray; 11/15/22 12:07 pm.

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One on the right comes off my sidecar tug. One on the left (aka the mystery tank) is off my road bike. Both are 1967 B44R Roadsters. They have never shared a tank. I would have bet the one on the road bike was bigger. But I was wrong.

Better gas mileage, not paying attention to which tank buffers I was using.....I got excuses but in the end I was still wrong. Both of these look BIG compared to the stock fiberglass tank.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

There are differences in measurements, as much as a 1/2" in places. But I'm going to write that off as manufacturing tolerances?

They're the same tank with slightly different filler caps. I'd still like to know what the road bike's tank came off of.

IMG_0175.JPG

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They are both A 65 Fire bird tanks
The B44 tank does not have 2 carb cut aways underneath cos it aint got 2 carbs
Very common to find them on B44 roadsters because the std tank is just too small for any serious trip .
Riding is no fun if you are consistantly looking for a fuel station .


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