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#889832 09/02/22 8:01 am
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dave j Offline OP
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Is JASO MA-2 oil less likely to cause clutch slipping than the normal api sf 20 or 30 oil or is it just better than car oil?
Dave

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dave j #889838 09/02/22 10:31 am
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With separate primary setups, most blokes prefer auto transmission fluid,
the old type. Jaso would be fine but more expensive as to whether it would
be any better, i'm sure there are views both ways.

dave j #889909 09/03/22 5:23 am
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Mine shares oil and I use a JASO MA-2 oil, Valvoline synthetic motorcycle 20W50. It works fine with the clutch. I think the key is the lack of friction modifiers, as found in car oil.
I guess if I had an older separate primary I might try transmission oil, but type F is getting hard to find and expensive here.


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dave j #889914 09/03/22 7:18 am
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Which bike is it?

I find running in oil works great in clutches. Though if it’s a 3 spring triumph/bsa clutch then you’ll want to make sure that the clutch itself is upto spec with the correct springs otherwise they don’t hold/grip too well, regardless of the oil used.


Life is stressful enough without getting upset over the little things...

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68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
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dave j #889917 09/03/22 7:53 am
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Thanks for the replies. The bike is my 67 Triumph 650. The clutch is marginal but ok. I have discussed changing it on here but never got round to it as it works ok. I am mostly wondering if JASO MA-2 is an improvement over the 60s spec 20 oil rather than car oil. I suppose I should just try it!

Dave

dave j #889945 09/03/22 3:16 pm
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I’ve always wondered if the focus is the chain lube or the clutch? I tried transmission fluid twice, leaks can’t really see an advantage, went back to the book 20wt.
In one bike, auto transmission fluid turned the rubber parts gooey!


Down to ‘69 T120R now a Tr6R tribute bike
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dave j #889961 09/03/22 4:51 pm
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My preference would be to try and match the oil that the manufacturer originally recommended with whats available these days.

From what I can understand based on info at This Website, the original JASO MA-1 spec was introduced in 1998 and the JASO MA-2 spec in 2006.

Its worth reading the different JASO specs carefully, and from what I can make out JASO MA-1 spec is suitable for bikes with separate engine and gearbox oils. JASO MA-2 is for bikes with catalytic converters.

The website mentions that JASO MA-2 oils have a higher friction modifier content than JASO MA-1 oils, so on that basis I would stick with the JASO MA-1 oil.

Personally, I just use classic 20w50 classic car oil in both engine and clutch without issue, my current favorite is Motul classic 20W50 which has a high zinc content and works fine in the engine and primary see This Link.


1968 A65 Firebird
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dave j #890014 09/04/22 4:16 am
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My bikes always run shared oil setups.
This has been my 'go-to' product for years:
https://www.bunnings.com.au/valvoline-5l-xld-classic-20w-50-engine-oil_p0066162

dave j #890019 09/04/22 7:06 am
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On the bikes with closed primaries I run ATF in them simply because it is pink.
The gearbox oil is green & of course engine oil becomes black very quickly os mystery drips can be identifed easily


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dave j #890039 09/04/22 4:37 pm
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When I used motor oil in the primary on my A65, after one or two riding seasons I would get a cooked-on oil residue on my clutch discs, which would cause the clutch to both slip AND stick on sitting. I would then scrub the discs with kerosene, and they would be ok for a month or so, but would then revert to slipping and sticking, and the only solution was to replace the discs. Then I started using ATF (type F), and no more cooked-on oil residue; in fact, I can't remember when I last replaced clutch discs. I've also noticed the clutch runs cooler, for instance, if I have to idle in gear for more than a few seconds.

If there's a flip side to this coin, it would be that the more viscous oil is better for the primary chain. I have no data to support that assertion one way or the other.


Mark Z

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dave j #890210 09/07/22 7:07 am
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Thanks. It seems that the JASO MA-2 oil is the same as the originally specified oil in regard to clutch action. For some reason I have also had the idea that atf is not so good for the chain as pondered on by Mark Z. I don't know where I got this idea from because no one has ever said that their chain has worn out because of it.

Dave

dave j #890274 09/08/22 8:33 am
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Apparently type F as used by some Fords is a problem


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Originally Posted by BSA_WM20
Apparently type F as used by some Fords is a problem

Type F is the one I most often see recommended.


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If you think about what goes on in an automatic transmission. Gears and bearings that need to be lubricated and clutches that need to transmit drive.
Substitute chain for gears and it's not very far from a primary drive


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BSA_WM20 #890333 09/09/22 4:33 am
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Originally Posted by BSA_WM20
Apparently type F as used by some Fords is a problem
OLD Fords. Even my '97 Ford van uses Dextron.
I used to use type F in my forks. These days proper fork oil is easy to find and probably cheaper.
I honestly can't say if it makes any difference in the primary, I've only had shared oil bikes, and the dry clutch in my Trident doesn't care.


"Gosh, it's not a 1/4 20, must be metric."

72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"

dave j #893247 10/15/22 1:15 pm
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Just read this and since it's a month I'll chime in anyway. It is my understanding that type F was designed for auto transmissions that had "band' style clutches (the old ford -o- matic) and type A is meant for multi-plate clutches (old hydra-matic) It was and old hot rod trick to use type F in trannys designed for type A to have less slippage and positive engagement... Gary


67 BSA A65L, 67T120R, 71 Hodaka 100B, 72 HD Aermacchi 350SS "cafe racer" 60 HD Duoglide, 77 HD FLH, 79 HD FXEF, 12 HD FLHTC
dave j #893248 10/15/22 1:46 pm
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type F fixed the on-off clutch in my Commando. had some other ATF in there, and the clutch was so grabby it stalled the bike.


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