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#846806 04/22/21 2:01 pm
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Kevin E Offline OP
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Hi all,

Once I get my bike back together the engine will be almost brand new, apart from the obvious bits like the casings and covers.

I intend to run it in using Morris Golden Film Running In Oil, after which I will use the Golden Film SAE 20W-50 oil for the engine.

Will it be ok to use the same oil in the gearbox, or should I go with an SAE 50 monograde oil?

What are your thoughts and does anyone have any recommendations for the gearbox oil.

Thanks,

Kev E

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Gear Oil for the Gear Box. Any 80W-90 or similar will do. 20W-50 is correct for the engine.

Lannis


It's easier to fool people than to convince them they have been fooled.
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Ive used EP90, or EP 80- 90 gear oil, for 30 years with zero problems. it takes 7/8ths of an imperial Pint.
This is what BSA ask for in the Manual. Do not use engine oil in the gearbox, it wont do any harm, but it will be better with real gear oil which is formulated with cats piss so that it doesnt squeeze out under the tooth point loads. The smell also helps pin point leaks.

Morris GF20 -50 is good oil for the motor.

Automatic transmission fluid, ATF, keeps the clutch happy and greatly reduces cold start stickyness.


71 Devimead, John Hill, John Holmes A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
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Originally Posted by Kevin E
Hi all,

Once I get my bike back together the engine will be almost brand new, apart from the obvious bits like the casings and covers.

I intend to run it in using Morris Golden Film Running In Oil, after which I will use the Golden Film SAE 20W-50 oil for the engine.

Will it be ok to use the same oil in the gearbox, or should I go with an SAE 50 monograde oil?

What are your thoughts and does anyone have any recommendations for the gearbox oil.

Thanks,

Kev E

Yes yes yes, all apart from the gearbox oil. On later bikes BSA Spec’d EP90 for the bikes, since the engines are all the same where it matters you’ll find you won’t have any issues with it. If you have a few extra pennies to hand, I always liked adding Lucas Oil additive, that stuff that sticks to the gears, it reduces wear and more noticeably makes it a real slick box.

Another note, running in oil is under rated, but remember it’s often SAE 30, you can get some 20-50 but not Morris, I just got myself some 10-40. Oil gets thinner as it gets hotter so “shorter” runs are ideal whilst it’s running in (for me a short run is about 30miles) clock up your 300 miles on running in then ditch it and put the 20-50 in.

... do you have a filter?

Last edited by Allan G; 04/22/21 7:28 pm.

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68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

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Kevin E Offline OP
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[quote=Allan G]

Yes yes yes, all apart from the gearbox oil. On later bikes BSA Spec’d EP90 for the bikes, since the engines are all the same where it matters you’ll find you won’t have any issues with it. If you have a few extra pennies to hand, I always liked adding Lucas Oil additive, that stuff that sticks to the gears, it reduces wear and more noticeably makes it a real slick box.

Hi Allan, is this the stuff you mean?

I don't have any modern type filter on the bike currently, just the stock gauze filters in the sump and oil tank.

Cheers,

Kev E

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Originally Posted by Kevin E
[quote=Allan G]

Yes yes yes, all apart from the gearbox oil. On later bikes BSA Spec’d EP90 for the bikes, since the engines are all the same where it matters you’ll find you won’t have any issues with it. If you have a few extra pennies to hand, I always liked adding Lucas Oil additive, that stuff that sticks to the gears, it reduces wear and more noticeably makes it a real slick box.

Hi Allan, is this the stuff you mean?

I don't have any modern type filter on the bike currently, just the stock gauze filters in the sump and oil tank.

Cheers,

Kev E

That’s the stuff, I like to put it in the gearbox... when I can find it, it’s not cheap for a bottle of the stuff but it does last forever..... providing you don’t misplace the bottle.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

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Kevin E Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Allan G
That’s the stuff, I like to put it in the gearbox... when I can find it, it’s not cheap for a bottle of the stuff but it does last forever..... providing you don’t misplace the bottle.

Thanks again Allan, I just had a look at some reviews on it and a YouTube video showing the difference on how it makes the oil stick to the gears. What a difference.

I've ordered a 1Lt bottle from Amazon, £17.69 with free 1 day delivery (Prime).

Yes it's a little pricey but I've always been of the opinion that you should put the best fluids you can buy inside the motor. It is after all it's life blood and unquestionably the single most important component in there.

I see they recommend 25% - 50% for the gearbox. Which side do you tend to go to, low or high?

Cheers, Kev E

Kevin E #846912 04/23/21 12:28 pm
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25% would be fine, the EP90 is decent oil in the first place. You are just ensuring that gears etc get coated on their first rotation. Also I don't know if using more than 25% on a dog box would limit the ability for the sliding gears to fully seat in the mating gear.

I've yet to actually put it in with the engine oil.


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68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
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Quote
I don't have any modern type filter on the bike currently, just the stock gauze filters in the sump and oil tank.

I would seriously think about fitting a filter in the return line and an alloy sump plate with a magnet on the drain plug as these will help extend the engine life, especially if you have a plain timing side main bearing.

Agree with all the oil recommendations above, personally I use classic 20W50 which you can get from Halfords, even Wilco sell a version which is exactly the same but a bit cheaper. For the gearbox I just use EP 80W90 or similar gear oil, I dont think it makes much of a difference as long as its EP gear oil. The clutch gets the same oil as the engine and it has worked well in my A65 and other bikes with wet clutches.

Be prepared for wet sumping if the bike hasnt been ridden for a few weeks, its all well and good to spend money on expensive engine oil only to find its all drained in to the sump, hence the recommendation for a sump plate with a drain plug. If it has wet sumped you can then drain the oil and avoid smoky startups.


1968 A65 Firebird
1967 B44 Shooting Star
1972 Norton Commando
gunner #846933 04/23/21 4:10 pm
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Originally Posted by gunner
Quote
I don't have any modern type filter on the bike currently, just the stock gauze filters in the sump and oil tank.

I would seriously think about fitting a filter in the return line and an alloy sump plate with a magnet on the drain plug as these will help extend the engine life, especially if you have a plain timing side main bearing.

Agree with all the oil recommendations above, personally I use classic 20W50 which you can get from Halfords, even Wilco sell a version which is exactly the same but a bit cheaper. For the gearbox I just use EP 80W90 or similar gear oil, I dont think it makes much of a difference as long as its EP gear oil. The clutch gets the same oil as the engine and it has worked well in my A65 and other bikes with wet clutches.

Be prepared for wet sumping if the bike hasnt been ridden for a few weeks, its all well and good to spend money on expensive engine oil only to find its all drained in to the sump, hence the recommendation for a sump plate with a drain plug. If it has wet sumped you can then drain the oil and avoid smoky startups.

Hi gunner, thanks for the input.

I’ve had an alloy sump plate and magnetic drain plug on the bike since I owned it from back in the early 80’s. I was considering fitting an external oil filter but I’m just not sure. I’ve owned and ridden old British twins and singles since I was too young to do it legally (that would be off road) and I’ve never had any bother with anything related to engine oil. I’ve never even had any problem with wet sumping, unless I’ve had a bike stood unused for months. If I haven’t run them up for a long time it’s a 5 minute job to drain the sump before starting.

I am still thinking about an oil filter though and if I can come up with a decent mounting solution I will probably fit one. In the meantime I will stick with regular oil changes. It’s stood me well for 50 years or so smile

Cheers, Kev E

Kevin E #846999 04/24/21 12:10 pm
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Agreed, regular oil changes are definitely worthwhile even if you have a filter fitted.

I've found the easiest way to change the oil is to use one of the vacuum oil extractors intended for cars, there's even a 12v electric type available. Its just a matter of getting the engine warm and then sticking the extractor hose in the oil tank and sucking all the oil out. One advantage is that the extractor hose reaches the bottom of the tank where a lot of debris can build up, so most of this can be extracted as well.

Fitting an oil filter on an A65 is not exactly easy as you have mentioned due to space. I'm using a Norton type filter fitted above the gearbox which is probably not the best place. You can get a slimmed-down type that uses a Trident filter and is small enough to fit behind a frame rail. I don't know if there is one specifically for the A65 but they are available for A7/A10's on eBay, not cheap though at over £100.

Last edited by gunner; 04/24/21 12:10 pm.

1968 A65 Firebird
1967 B44 Shooting Star
1972 Norton Commando
Kevin E #847086 04/25/21 11:11 am
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Agreed on all the above, except use a gearbox oil (EP 90 or 80W90) that has no higher a rating than GL4, as the EP additive in GL5 grades can cause corrosion to the gearbox bearing surfaces - SRM advised me on this years ago and I've read it elsewhere several times since.

Opie Oils website has plenty to choose from. I use Castrol Classic EP90 myself but there are plenty of others available.

If you're looking to fit an oil filter on an A65, Paul Goff offers a kit which mounts a Norton Commando filter from one of the rear engine mountings. Not too difficult to do and well worthwhile. It's quite inconspicuous and offers easy filter changes too.


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Kevin E #847089 04/25/21 11:24 am
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Quote
EP additive in GL5 grades can cause corrosion to the gearbox bearing surfaces - SRM advised me on this years ago and I've read it elsewhere several times since.

Early GL5 additives were based on sulphur and these did attack yellow metals eg bronze but only above 100C, todays additives are not sulphur based but as a further check read the bottle/specs as they will normally say Yellow metal safe.


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