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#706454 08/27/17 11:23 pm
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Have bro- and sister-in-law and also nephews and nieces in Houston. They're flooded out due to Hurricane Harvey. Others were hit worse.

Rose's nephew sent photos of his yard. Looks like a great lake. Ironically, the are sprinklers in the yard? Guess what they're doing?

Praying for any of you out that way.

Rich and Rose


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Thanks for the thoughts. Just outside Houston proper, we have had 25+ inches and it's still pissing down. Water is up in the front yard but holding it's own. Lot's of place in deep trouble in town. My daughter is respiratory therapist working at hospital, rotating shifts and sleeping on a cot. Went in on Friday and it may be end of week before she is relieved. Current forecast has the storm center moving back offshore then heading straight for Houston by Wed. Someone just sent me this.
Borrowed wording, but this puts it in perspective:
For my non-Houston friends- to help you understand the devastation: Houston is huge. The greater metropolitan area is circled by the Grand Parkway - which is 170 miles long. That makes the area of the circle inside the Grand Parkway over 2200 sq. miles. 2200 square miles of densely habited, urban and suburban, areas is flooded.
Imagine if the entire state of Delaware, with twice the population of Manhattan, was under water.
That's Houston.
It's still raining.

Last edited by htown; 08/28/17 2:14 am.

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Jeeeze! I can only imagine! Hoping you get out of this ok, ... our thoughts are with you.
Don


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In recent years, with urban sprawl, many cities are finding they're in trouble with inadequate drainage due to over-development. Developers and planners can only do so much, then the power of water comes horribly to the fore.

My nephew and his wife lost all they had, living in an RV in Port Aransas. The ENTIRE PARK was wiped out, 100% loss. THANKFULLY, no loss of life there (at least none reported thus far in Port Aransas) .

This is one hell of a storm; be safe you Houstonians...

Last edited by GrandPaul; 08/28/17 1:14 pm.

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My folks lived in the north west Houston suburbs from 1975 until their deaths. Spring TX address & a Tomball phone number.

Houston and that area has zero "zoning". Free reign was given to developers. It is not unusual to see a factory, plant or industrial complex beside a school, a strip mall, and a subdivision. Used to be there were farms mixed in too but those have no doubt all been consumed by the land grabbers by now. (my dad died in 2010 so thats the last I was down there).

There are local creeks (bayous) and rivers, and pretty much all stormwater has been diverted into these. The small bayous were all dredged out to handle stormwater overflow. All bigger rivers were dammed to make massive lakes- sometimes more than one lake per river. All storm water from all over Houston and the north suburbs drains into either the Houston ship channel (dredged out Buffallo Bayou), or Galveston Bay and eventually the Gulf Of Mexico. If not directly into the Gulf. Houston is a large city covering a pretty big area but the outlying suburbs are incredible and run outward for at least 50 (or further) miles in all directions! So it is ALL concrete, strip malls, streets, rooftops, and you name it.An unimaginagineable number of square miles with literally all solid surfaces, with only the local bayous for the rain to go into. The entire stormwater "management" system is heavily taxed every time it rains, let alone under dire circumstances.

Houston proper is low lying anyway- It's on the coastal plain. The communities and towns south of Houston between the city and the Gulf or the Bay are really low. Just a few feet above sea level. The south west outlying areas used to be all rice farms, to give another example of how low it (or how pervasive water) is. Daily showers & rainfalls which can be extensive- like inches and inches at a time- will typically flood the lower streets and intersections for a few hours. Considering all the above, there is a lot that goes into the problems they have down there- many factors that serve to make an already big problem even worse. For those who have never been there, there is no way you can even begin to comprehend the size or the sprawl-

or the mess it is under typical conditions.


Hope you who live in Houston or Loo-weez-ee-anna get thru it safely, with as little personal loss as possible.

Last edited by ricochetrider; 08/31/17 3:56 pm.

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Originally Posted by ricochetrider


For those who have never been there, there is no way you can even begin to comprehend the size or the sprawl-

or the mess it is under typical conditions.


Hope you who live in Houston or Loo-weez-ee-anna get thru it safely, with as little personal loss as possible.


Roger all that!

Riding the old BSA up US250 last month through West Virginia, through the towns of Mannington and Metz and Littleton to Hundred ... there had just been a flood from a line of thunderstorms along Pyle's Fork and Fish Creek that flooded all those towns for 30 miles along there. The National Guard was still in there cutting out trees and trying to haul junk away.

The thing I noticed was that for miles, there were piles of soaked furniture piled along the shoulder of the road for pickup, hundreds and hundreds of them. Whole housefuls of furniture that has to be dumped ... and then replaced.

This was in a sparsely populated area where maybe 800 people had water up in their houses. It's just hard to imagine multiplying that by a factor of TWO THOUSAND or so, and trying to see HOW they are going to haul and dump all that stuff somewhere, and HOW is everyone going to replace all that? Insurance won't do everything - and so many folks are underinsured.

Those of us who are still dry should find an efficient charity who can get gift cards into people's hands so they can get back on their feet after all this ...

Lannis


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My wife worked for a FEMA mapping contractor in the 80s. She did the final quality control on a lot of the maps for Houston and has said for years it was one of the biggest risk areas she saw.

None of this is a surprise to her.

Problem I see, is that people are going to want to get back on thier feet with taxpayer help exactly as things were before. Absent serious efforts to mitigate the actual problem (elevate, move) this will happen again. Same for New Orleans. Who thought building homes below sea level next to the Mississippi River was a good idea?


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Zimm,

New Orleans was a settlement founded in 1718, probably atop an existing native settlement. The native people were fluid, so able to move as the river bottom shifted and the river altered its course- as rivers do. The more permanent "white" settlement/town/city progression is NOT fluid. AT ALL. The arrogance of humankind is well documented, and the power of Nature to instantly destroy all human effort in a single small stroke is also well documented if not largely ignored.


Houston began much later, in 1837. As far as I know as a cow town then went on to become home of famous Texas "oilmen" with many oil refineries with some shipping tossed in as a side business. Houston is 50 miles or more inland so a shipping channel and port had to be engineered in- it is not naturally occurring. Houston's big move away from oil came in the oil glut and bad oil times in the late 70s and early 80s.
Having had an association there since 1975 and having lived there twice, I have seen many changes in Houston.

Texas, for those who don't know this, always maintained its "independence" from the USA. There is now and always has been a big secessionist movement there. Many a Texas politician has vehemently voted against federal aid for hurricanes and other natural disasters, like in hurricanes Katrina & Sandy to provide but 2 examples.

The proverbial shoe is on the other foot now, tho.
Isn't it.


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Originally Posted by ricochetrider

Texas, for those who don't know this, always maintained its "independence" from the USA. There is now and always has been a big secessionist movement there. Many a Texas politician has vehemently voted against federal aid for hurricanes and other natural disasters, like in hurricanes Katrina & Sandy to provide but 2 examples.

The proverbial shoe is on the other foot now, tho.
Isn't it.


Not such a cool thing to score "nyah nyah I told you" political points on the back of a tragedy like this .... And we don't know that the ones who voted against federal aid then aren't voting against it now ....


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The one that voted against the Sandy aid is our village idiot, Ted Cruz. He's backing up faster now than a crawfish. Actually it's a race with Joel Osteen.

Last edited by htown; 08/31/17 8:06 pm.

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Well, you guys turn it into politics. I'm sending money to the helpers ....


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I mentioned the facts without pointing fingers. The air is filled with news of this very fact. It's a public matter - and history- that certain politicians whose homes are in tornado, flood, and hurricane zones have voted consistently against federal relief for others. But sit tight, shut up, and accept assistance when the poo hits the fan at home.

It is pure and simple, hypocrisy.

No politics involved on my part simply stating that fact of the matter.
Same as I pointed out another well known fact- that developers and city/public officials, unbridled, have also added much to the state of disaster in their plundering of the locale.

This is by and large undisputed. It is fact. One cannot go so far as to dilute the truth in the name of political correctness or avoidance.

Last edited by ricochetrider; 08/31/17 8:21 pm.

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Originally Posted by ricochetrider
I mentioned the facts without pointing fingers. The air is filled with news of this very fact. It's a public matter - and history- that certain politicians whose homes are in tornado, flood, and hurricane zones have voted consistently against federal relief for others. But sit tight, shut up, and accept assistance when the poo hits the fan at home.

It is pure and simple, hypocrisy.

No politics involved on my part simply stating that fact of the matter.
Same as I pointed out another well known fact- that developers and city/public officials, unbridled, have also added much to the state of disaster in their plundering of the locale.

This is by and large undisputed. It is fact. One cannot go so far as to dilute the truth in the name of political correctness or avoidance.


Thank you sir.


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Originally Posted by ricochetrider

No politics involved on my part simply stating that fact of the matter.


"Stating the facts of the matter". A simple way of not calling it "politics". I could state some facts that would surprise you. But it's not my job.

In the end, Luke says it better than I can ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qDt1WDzhmU

Lannis


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I'll also say that I feel this is pertinent in a discussion about one of the biggest natural disasters (as it happens a hurricane) of all time- certainly in our lifetime in the USA- or I wouldn't have mentioned it.


"It is no measure of health, to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."


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