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#680766 01/10/17 12:45 pm
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Hello, I have just acquired a Rickman Cafe Racer Oil in Frame frame. It is dated about 1972 and I am going to get the frame modded to accept a T150 engine. So ...... my question is should I take this opportunity to fabricate an oil tank and convert from O in F. My thinking is this would give the system more oil, good for T 150 as a bit prone to overheating. Also a friend has this setup and spent some time tracing an oil leak which turned out to be a stress fracture. Any comments on whether this is a good mod. Thanks Richard

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I see no reason to eliminate two of the greatest benefits of the Rickman oily frame: 1) A large heat sink that does a great job keeping oil cool and 2)elimiating the added weight of an oil tank. Not only will your oil likely run hotter if you switch to another oil tank but you will have to add the weight of the additional oil. To make up for the added weight, you'll have to extract more power from the engine....which will make it run hotter. Saving weight is a good thing

There are only two reasons to have more oil capacity: 1)give the oil more time to cool before it is returned to the engine and 2) more time between oil changes. The first is unnecessary with the rickman frame and the second is just a minor inconvenience and IMHO not worth defeating the advantages of the OIF system.


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'53 Gold Flash
'67 Royal Star
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Originally Posted by richardvy
My thinking is this would give the system more oil, good for T 150 as a bit prone to overheating.




So how much oil does the frame hold?


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Originally Posted by Boomer
Originally Posted by richardvy
My thinking is this would give the system more oil, good for T 150 as a bit prone to overheating.




So how much oil does the frame hold?


Bill B...


Street metisse frames hold about 2-1/2 quarts.


A smattering:
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'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
sixtyseventy Lightboltrocket road racer...and many more.
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Hi Richard,

Firstly, welcome to the Forum.

Originally Posted by Alex
Street metisse frames hold about 2-1/2 quarts.

About the same as a 'dry frame' Triumph (including triple) tank.

Originally Posted by richardvy
T 150 as a bit prone to overheating.

Old wives' tale without factual basis.

Hth.

Regards,

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Thanks for advice, the only thing still playing on my mind is my friends frame with a leak. Richard

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Porsche had an air gauge tap on its aluminum 917 frames for pressurizing to check for cracks. Think of it as a safety feature.

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There are numerous threads here on OIF Triumph & BSA frame leaks, and those bikes feature a simple, large diameter tube to hold the oil. I would be very leery of a multi-tube OIF. That said, I don't think I've ever heard of any problems with Rickman frame leaks.

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presumably the oil filler is a standard size?

buy a new cap and fit an air inlet, LIGHTLY pressurise the frame and submerge it or paint every weld with a bubble generating liquid. I doubt that they will spontaneously leak mid tube. I'd also guess that the welding was better than standard Triumph frames.

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Originally Posted by AngloBike
presumably the oil filler is a standard size?

buy a new cap and fit an air inlet, LIGHTLY pressurise the frame and submerge it or paint every weld with a bubble generating liquid. I doubt that they will spontaneously leak mid tube. I'd also guess that the welding was better than standard Triumph frames.


The filler tap is the same as a late triumph/BSA primary inspection cap. It needs the tiny vent hole, otherwise the frame becomes pressurized in operation preventing oil from returning (ask me how I figured this out :blush). The easiest way to pressurize the frame would be to use the oil feed or return since they are simple hose connections. All the other hoses would also need to be connected like the level indicator and return flow indicator.

While the Rickman frames are very strong, they do have their limits. Since a lot of them have seen abuse from racing and they are somewhat corrosion prone if left out in damp conditions, they are not immune to damage and leaks.


A smattering:
'53 Gold Flash
'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
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Not sure how they have survived the test of time but when new Rickman frames were beautiful things.
The welding was exquisite.
Friend of mine had a Rickman triple a few years ago---looked the bees knees.

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Originally Posted by AngloBike
I'd also guess that the welding was better than standard Triumph frames.

Mmmm ... as Rickman was most successful in sports where people deliberately hurl perfectly good motorcycles at the scenery at high speed, that's probably a pretty good guess ...

Regards, wink

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Rickman motocross frames had problems with American motocross of the mid 70's. They would break at the steering stem braces because of the more exuberant American jumping. Donny Elmer of FMF racing broke a few.

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FWIW, every time I come across a Rickman/Trackmaster etc frame for sale(or any frame for that matter) I have to ask myself WHY ?

Peter


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Why? Because they're very good...


A smattering:
'53 Gold Flash
'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
sixtyseventy Lightboltrocket road racer...and many more.
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Originally Posted by wilksville
FWIW, every time I come across a Rickman/Trackmaster etc frame for sale(or any frame for that matter) I have to ask myself WHY ?

Peter



Why what? A hand made custom lightweight purposeful race frame or just any frame?


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Alex, Boomer, I ask Why they are for sale and not a complete bike being ridden. WHY would you break or part out a Rickman or similar ??
I would'nt..... unless there was something wrong with it.
So thats why I ask myself why.

Regards Peter


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Hi Peter,

Originally Posted by wilksville
Why they are for sale and not a complete bike being ridden. WHY would you break or part out a Rickman or similar ?

Ime one of the commonest reasons is ignorance, in the nicest possible way - we sometimes forget that, while we might have experience and knowledge of a particular niche or wrinkle, others have no inkling.

Case in point - I would dearly love a Rickman 1+1. If you know what that is, you know they're rocking-horse poo when Rickmans are ten-a-penny. But I've seen three of 'em being parted out because not only did the owner not know what they had, neither did anyone 'experienced' that they'd asked cry - by the time I get to 'em, the common CR bits have gone, leaving just what the owner has been told are "custom" bits, that have been cry or are about to be skipped. Trouble is, a project I don't have either the time or money for is acquiring the "common" CR bits to turn the special 1+1 bits into a complete bike. frown

Regards,

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So what is a Rickman 1&1? I tried googling it and only came up with an interview with an actor!

Ed from NJ

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Hi Ed,

Originally Posted by edunham
what is a Rickman 1&1?

grin Although it might also be known as a "Rickman CR 1+1" ...

[Linked Image]

... note less-radical riding position than the common-or-garden CR, longer seat (hence "1+1" smile ).

http://www.classic-motorrad.de/classifieds/classic-bikes/classic-bikes-in-koping_i5520.

Hth.

Regards,

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Thanks Stuart. Looks like a different seat, lower rear sets and a different fairing (or maybe it's just the angle of the wind shield), and maybe a different tank? I just looked at a couple images on the net and all showed passenger footrest hangers, so I am guessing no changes to the frame? It looks like it would not be too difficult to make one out of a regular CR if you had the special bits.

Ed from NJ

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Nice looking bike, surprised they didn't sell a lot of them.


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Hi,

Originally Posted by edunham
different tank?

Mmmm ... afaict, shorter tank, longer seat taking up the space left by the shorter tank, flatter 'bars, the rider sits more-upright?

Originally Posted by edunham
different fairing (or maybe it's just the angle of the wind shield),

Not sure about that particular fairing, I've also seen a different ('sports-touring'-type?) one.

Originally Posted by konon
Nice looking bike, surprised they didn't sell a lot of them.

I'm not absolutely certain but I believe it was quite a late development of the CR in Rickman's history, around the same time they were also selling the one-piece body, and Rickman weren't the only maker in the very small 1970's niche market of frame kits for large Jap-bike engines. smile

Regards,


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