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Hi, I am currently performing a "rolling restoration" on my 1964 A65 Rocket and cant figure out how the speedometer and rev counter should be fitted to my forks(early dropped type top yoke).
According to the book "BSA Unit Construction Twins, the complete story" written by Mathew Vale, the speedo and rev counter should be mounted individually on triangular brackets, so I have purchased 2 off triangular brackets (part number 42-9292)which fit on the top of the forks. It is obvious that the speedo and rev counter dont fit directly to these brackets, so I have also bought 2 off brackets 65-9111 which bolt to them and of course all the accompanying bolts, spacers etc. I also have the metal pods in which the speedo and rev counter fit, but when I offer up the clocks to the 65-9111 brackets although the mounting holes line up there is no hole in the brackets to allow the speedo drive to pass through, nor is there enough material on the brackets to allow me to drill this hole.
Can anyone please explain how the clocks are mounted using these brackets, am I still missing something ?
A photo would be much appreciated.


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Which gauges do you have?

As far as I understand it, the triangular brackets that mount to the fork top nuts are for mounting chronometric gauges. If you have magnetic gauges, you need the alloy dual gauge mount 68-9140 and metal gauge cups 68-9141.


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Originally Posted by Alex
Which gauges do you have?

As far as I understand it, the triangular brackets that mount to the fork top nuts are for mounting chronometric gauges. If you have magnetic gauges, you need the alloy dual gauge mount 68-9140 and metal gauge cups 68-9141.


+1

I tried finding a photo earlier but couldn't find anything correct or clear enough. AFAIK and from photos I have seen the 64 would have come with chronometrics, the T shaped plate bolts on to the triangular plate and this T shape place also mounts to the speedo - Chronometrics have the bulb and cable location off to the side, magnetics have a central cable feed.

If you post a photo of your top yoke and clocks Im sure we can help you out better.


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Thanks Alex, many thanks for your reply. At sometime in its life, my bike has been owned by someone who has stripped off a lot of the original equipment, replaced it with "stuff that will fit" ( whether it works or not) and then sold the bike on. The clocks and fittings are part of the missing stuff. The bike was originally manufactured with chronometric clocks, but due to the cost, I have replaced them with replica Smiths magnetic units.
My first attempt at solving the fitting problem was to buy the alloy bracket 48-9140 as suggested, however, this bracket does not fit to the early "dropped" fork yoke, only ( it seems), to the later flat type ( where it bolts directly to the yoke),so it was returned to the supplier. I do have the gauge cups however which do as you say, fit the alloy bracket. The early "dropped" top yoke is correct for my bike, but I cant figure out how the clocks were fitted originally.

Someone did lend me a chrono speedo to try, but if I can remember correctly the speedo drive came out of the centre of the speedo just the same as the magnetic one, so I think even if I was lucky enough to get a pair of chrono units I would still have the problem.

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Hi Alan, many thanks for the reply. If the chrono clocks had the speedo drive offset to one side, that would explain a lot. I will have to investigate that further.
Currently I am using the OIF "tennis bat" brackets ( which were on the bike when purchased), these do the job, but I want to have the correct brackets if possible.
Originally the bike would have been supplied with chronometrics, but BSA did swap over to magnetics later in 1964 but still retained the old type top yoke.
I dont know how to upload a photo to the forum, but if you can send me your e-mail address I will send you a picture of my top yoke ( with clocks attached) and a picture of the bottom of one of the clocks.Best regards, Henry

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I believe the rockets with magnetic gauges mounted the alloy bracket atop the handlebar clamps. The front two bolts are therefore about 1/2" longer.


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My 1964 Rocket has the Chronometric's mounted the same as that on Gold Stars. A triangular plate clamped by the fork top nut, and then another bracket from the plate on which bolts the speedo in a centre line.
The 1965 LC I have, has the dropped top yoke, and magnetic instruments. The alloy plate is bolted to the front bolt of the handlebar clamps.

I will go and get some photos in a bit.



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These 2 photos are of my A65LC with the alloy plate mounting magnetic clocks
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


These 2 photos are of my A65R with the two steel plates (bottom one is home made) mounting chronometric clocks
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

This photo is of an LC with magnetic clocks on individual mountings, he says it came from the factory like this.
[Linked Image]


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Got my doubts there. That tacho didn't appear till 1970 and the 3 screws underneath are in a different position to the grey ones. The metal cup would have required modifying in order to fit properly.


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68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

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Thanks guys, that HAS proved to be very helpful, particularly the
photos. I must admit that Brian from Lightning Spares in Manchester suggested bolting the alloy plate to the handlebar clamps using longer bolts, but I wasn't sure how it would look, or if it would blank off the key access for my steering lock. I would love to see the underside of the set up on that Lightning, those brackets do look as though they could be original. I am probably going to finish up with a set up that isn't quite as it should be, but you have given me some ideas and as always, your help is very much appreciated.

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Henry if you don't care about it being original, the quickest way to get what you have working is to buy a set of aftermarket adapters that bolt directly to the triangular brackets. I believe Unity Equipe and a number of others sell them.


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Thanks Alex, I didn't know about them. That's a great idea.

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Early 64 bikes would, IMO (for what that is worth) have the individual mount clocks. The alloy bracket mounting to the front handlebar clamp bolts (there was a small spacer between the clamp and alloy bracket) was a running change as the magnetics started to be used.

Some early pictures of LC's show the seperate clock mounts. Later pictures show the alloy plate mount.. So your friend may well be right about the seperate clocks on the LC.


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Hi Rich, thanks for the info. You are right, the alloy plate was used with the magnetic clocks, however, If I go down the route of fitting one to my handlebar clamps I wont be able to get the key in my steering lock (I think, when used with the dropped yoke originally there may have been provision to allow the lock to be used, however modern reproduction ones are of a later type that don't have this).
What I have decided to do is use the 65-9111 type mounts as fitted to the chronometric clocks with the addition of a plate welded alongside the "finger" of the bracket. This will allow the clocks to still be mounted central to the bracket, but with a slot cut into the central area of the brackets finger to allow the drive cable to fit, the welded plate replacing the centre area of the finger.
It should work ok and the modification will be invisible as it will be hidden under the clocks.

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Yes, the correct plate has a hole where the steering lock goes.

[Linked Image]


A smattering:
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'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
sixtyseventy Lightboltrocket road racer...and many more.
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Thanks Alex, that Lightning Clubman looks amazing.............. if only !!!
Looking at the mounting plate, it does look thinner than the reproduction cast ones available here in the UK. I am told that it is no longer possibly to get the ones with the steering lock hole.

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Watch fleaBay, the early type alloy mounting plate with the hole show up from time to time. Also, the 66 plates show up with the recess for the hole but not machined thru. Should be easy enough to get one modified.


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I am bringing this up again as I face the same problem: 1964 A65R, both chronos missing. Does anybody have photos of their genuine mountings, as well as what type of chronometrics would be correct for this model?

Thanks in advance!

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Look at my 1964 A65 Rocket photo's on the 1st page.
They show the Chronometric dials and their mountings.


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Something about bolting the gauge mounting plate to the top of the handlebar clamps just looks clumsy. I know BSA did it from 1965 or '66 to 1970, but that doesn't excuse the make-shift looks of it.

And, with Clubman handlebars, doesn't this mounting shove the gauges into your face?
Why not make a special plate that will mount both gauges together, and the plate mounts to the
fork's big chrome top bolts? It worked for Gold Stars and Road Rockets.

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So if that is the genuine mountings, how does the steering lock work then? And as you state that the bottom ones are hand-made: were those originally mounted to the fork top covers rather than the handlebar clamps?

And another question I am struggling with: when did Small Heath change from chronos to magnetics? Because the Rocket I received came with Grey Face kph (no tacho) and the alloy plate. As the bike originally was delivered to D. Louis (the German importer at the time) I am wondering if this one was delivered with grey faces rather than chronos..?


Thanks for clarification again

Last edited by HoraceWorblehat; 09/23/16 8:31 am.
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@ Irish Swede - I am not into making it somehow work - I want to restore it to its factory setup.

Last edited by HoraceWorblehat; 09/23/16 8:30 am.
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Horace, my original 1963-64 BSA parts book for A-65 and A-50 shows the cast aluminum plate mounting the gauges on top of the clamps, as in the picture above. Plate part number is 68-9140.
The books can't always be trusted, but that is what it shows.

The proper fork crown for Rockets is listed as number 68-5049.
If you are using this crown, the cast aluminum plate must have the hole in it to access the fork lock (the lock location was changed in 1966) but the lock for the aluminum gauge mount is SPECIAL, as it is much taller than the "standard" lock. Part number for that special lock is 68-5050.

Oddly enough, the parts book also shows the old-style A-10/Gold Star set-up with the two triangular gauge brackets which mount to the fork's top bolts. Perhaps BOTH types were used in that year?

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Both type mountings were used. I have a pic in a mag I need to scan showing early mounting on an early Clubman. Most pictures show the aluminum plate.

68-5050 fork lock can be VERY difficult to find. And usually priced to match.

I have never seen a "definitive" answer on when magnetics started. IMO, very early 64 bike likely had chronos, then magnetics took over fairly quickly.

UPDATE! - for Rockets and the US TR models, chronometrics were fitted thru engine S/N A65C 367

Last edited by Rich B; 09/25/16 11:34 am.

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Thank you for the valuable information so far.

This is the mounting and speedo that came with the bike:
[Linked Image]

This does not look like it was foreseen to mount a steering lock at all. Could it be that this does not belong to this bike at all? This is the one:
[Linked Image]

Last edited by HoraceWorblehat; 09/26/16 5:07 am.
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