Britbike forum Forums British Motorcycle specific Brands Bsa bulletin board turns out to be a 64 lightning rocket RUNS!!!!!

Hi guys,

My father is on vacation in the usa right now, searching for lost jaguars. While inspecting an etype he found a bsa 1970 lightning standing behind it. I do not know the exact shape the bike is in, but it seems pretty complete except for the rpm meters and the airfilter cover on the left. The engine seems to be stuck, but we don't know for sure cause we couldn't get it out, it was covered with cardboard boxes and stuff. I'll try to get more information. the guy wants 500 dollars for the bike, but shipping it to the netherlands will bring the price up to about 1400 euro's
Whats the worth of a bike like this? there is probably no rust on it, cause arizone is so dry.

thanks,
Tobias from the netherlands

International shipping costs are usually more than the cost of a non-running bike, unfortunately

If your father is shipping Jags from the US to the Netherlands, couldn't you just squeeze the Lightning in there as well? My experience has been that the crating and fixed costs at my end are more than the actual sea freight, and shipping within the USA can can be expensive as well.

Tobias, there are not many bikes on sale in Holland at the moment, but I do not think the shipping cost will make it profitable to send a 500 USD basket case over. But you may be lucky and have a running bike for 1400 USD. Parts and spares will not be a problem here. A good looking, good running 1970 Lightning will sell here for between 2500 and 3000 Euro's.
Check Marktplaats, or the sales ads on www.motorfietsweb.nl

Succes.

I'd have to agree with the consensus so far, there's no way a Lightning with a locked-up motor is worth 1400 of anyone's Euros. Not even 1400 dollars.

For five hundred dollars, I'd drive two hundred miles and pick the bike up. But triple that adding shipping? No way.

If it could be shoved in beside a Jag for no extra money that might be OK.

Coming from Europe to the US, the customs and tax are minimal. I know that going from the US to England, the customs and VAT are horrendous, don't know what they might be coming to you ....

Lannis

Hi guys,

I just bought it! My father and i will take the front suspension and rear triangle off the motorcycle, then we will try to fit it in a jag (hopefully this will bring the shipping costs down to zero). We managed to arrange an ''alabama'' title, which makes sure there will be no problem with customs, and rdw.

I think the bike looks suprisingly good for it's age, just a lot of dust.
How long does a restoration take? i'll still have 2 more years untill I'm allowed to drive a motorcycle (yes im 16 years old)
at least i just finished my zundapp!

Maybe something from your youth ger?

Very nice zundapp young fella. I restored a 70 bsa t-bolt...That bsa is worth whatever you want to put into it.And what exactly you want it to be like when its done, now if you want it to be as nice as the , zundap. you can figure safely a good some more on each bike you decide to re-do.

I paid 375.00 for a basket case, with a chopper front end on it,but good sheet metal, engine, trans,All chrome and rubber and wheels were more money When i got done, i estimated to low..and no matter what they tell you, everybody does this.
It came out ready for a show and an award. but $4000.00 more invested.

I like nice stuff, no junk for me.so you might get it done cheaper.Do to your taste when its done. hth

Haha, no... I did not have Zundapp money in the nineteen sixties, Tobias. I had something with a Sachs engine in those day's.
Congratulations with your purchase.
Wise decission (spelling?) to ship it inside a Jaguar.

Parts and spares will not be a problem here. There are several reliable parts suppliers in this country, and several people who know about these bikes. And if they do not know they ask on Britbike.

Enjoy it! :bigt

BUY IT BOY if you like it, the heck with everybody else. YOU will find everything you need on here , i did, but also had an ACE up my sleeve for parts.When my dad said no, to whatever, it made me want that item more,When he died on his death bed, he toldm ; Robert he sez:. thats me if you weren't listening, The first new bike he "bought" for me, and all these years he said; son you have worked miracles with all the vehicles you dragged home.Dads usually think you are bananas as you pull in the driveway with nothin but parts ...wassup GER..

You are WELL on your way, I must say. When I was 16, I had a 60cc Benelli that looked very much like that Zundapp of yours, although I bought mine almost new and didn't have to do any restoration. (I had a job as evening janitor at my high school - swabbing locker rooms, waxing hall floors, cleaning toilets, and washing blackboards wasn't very glamorous, but by gosh I had my own money, and a bike!!).

That Lightning is going to be a lot of fun, I can tell now!

Lannis

Tobias,

What are the engine and frame numbers, or at least the prefixes?
The tank and front end look much more like 1965 Lightning Rocket than 1970 Lightning. Likewise the Monobloc carbs.

That is a *much* rarer bike outside the US, so I think you have an excellent buy there - especially if you can ship it effectively for free.

As for shipping, you might need to go a little further than you have proposed.
Remove the front forks. It probably best to take the wheel out of the forks as well.
Take the fuel tank off, wrap it in bubble wrap and put it in a strong cardboard box. It would be a shame to dent or scratch it in transit
Take the rear mudguard off and remove the rear wheel.

The bike will then fit in the Jag easily.

Good luck with it. It looks like a great machine. If it was mine I wouldn't do a cosmetic restoration, just give detail it and source the missing cycle parts. You should rebuild the engine, though.

Tobias:
well done on your purchase. Its great to see young guys taking an intrest. You may find that it is a bit earlier than a 70 though. A few of the things that are pre 70 are half width front brake, headlight shell, tank , enclosed rear suspension, monoblock carb. I would guess that it could be 65-67?. You would need to go off the frame numbers for accurate date

BUT if you have it registered (or what ever the paper work is called in that part of the world) as a 70 DONT whatever you do sturr up a hornets nest with the narrow minded revenue gathering authorities by telling them it is an eariler model than the paper work says. That could complicate the import/export process BIG TIME.

Get the paperwork through as a 70 and know what you have....what do others think about this point??


It could turn out to be a 70 frame with older stuff bolted on who knows.

Good luck

Hi Tobias, I agree with Shane in Oz, that looks like a 1965 Lightning Rocket, ( ask me how I know) It also looks like it has 6 volt electrics which is entirely possible for that year, have fun putting it back together . Johnny.

The engine is '67-on, and '67 was the last year of the Monobloc carbs, so I'm guessing '67 for the engine. Yes, the fuel tank and headlamp are older than that. Can't see the rear wheel very well, but the chainguard and clutch cable routing are also pre-1970, and there is no crossover or cross-brace on the header pipes (pre-1967). Numbers WOULD be interesting...

Tobias, If you make that bike look as good as your Zundapp then you cant go wrong. That will be a sweet bike when you are done with it.
Keep us posted with photos of your progress!
Wade

Ok guys,
Im gonna try putting as much information in this post as I can find.
Engine nr. A65 D 92*
Frame nr. A50 B 15**
i don't know wether it's necessary to hide some of the frames numbers..

extra pic's:





unfortunately the title has already been requested, so i can not change anything about that
I'm very curious what kind of bsa it turns out to be!

A65D engine is possibly a 65 Lightning rocket, they had A50 B frame numbers.
A later 67 on finned cover , you have.
Should have twin clocks, speedo and tach.
Cool bike,should clean up well.

Tobias sez:

"Engine nr. A65 D 92*
Frame nr. A50 B 15**"

I would read it as a 64 L/R engine. 65 LR engines started @ S/N A65D1742, the frame is a 64 also, as 65 frames started A50B4001.

Nice find, early L/R's are not that common. And they can drive you nuts on some of the bits as BSA made a lot of changes during the short lifespan of the L/R.

Rich, to ease my conscience, as I told him part are plentyfull...
What parts are hard to find for LR's of that era?

Ger,

Without consulting the parts book, I am going to rely on memory...which is a scary thought in itself .

The 64/65 L/R's used at least 2 different frame P/N's, 3 or 4 different rear mudguards, 2 different tanks, 2 different rear number plate/tailight fairings, at least 2 if not 3 different side covers, and a whole host of brackets, hardware etc to match all of the above combinations. I am not even sure the parts books document all the variations with any accuracy.

Add the forks use different length stanchions than any other heavyweight BSA, different fork crowns, etc, the early A65's are a minefield for parts availability. You can find stuff, you can find stuff that will work, but you may not end up with a bike that is accurate to how it left Small Heath.

Don't take my comments as being negative, I find this vintage BSA unit twin far more fascinating than the later bikes which had become one basic specification bike with some bits changed to suit a different "model" ( I think I angered a few last week with my comment about "tarted up Lightning's") .

By comparison, the 64/65 dual carb bikes are far more varied and far more difficult to figure out. And then add the single carb bikes based upon the original release Star Twins (but not the T/R's, which are included with the dual carb bikes) and you have another major set of bits to sort out.

I just hope Tobias sticks with this project and builds a nice representation of an L/R. I have become a fan of the L/R's, Spitfire Hornets, Cyclones, LC's, and 65 Lightnings from that era and enjoy seeing any of those models on the road again.

You are not that old, Rich... :bigt


I don't. I was just worried about my credebility after I said parts were available. They are, but probably not accurate enough to build a accurate showroom model. Still the early A65's, as this one deserves to ride again, even if it's not 100% exact.
The taillight and grab rail on my BSA are Triumph but I do not tell anybody and nobody has ever noticed... HUSHSHSHS




Tobias if you happen to read this:

I've got a book by Mathew Vale, titled: BSA Unit Construction Twins The Complete Story.

This book contains many photo's explaining differences between the different model years. It's still sold here or if you are in the neigbourhood come and have look (as I'm not allowed to say come and make copies).

Hi guys,

Thanks so much for all the information! so wow.. it isnt a 70 lightning but a 64/65 lightning rocket! I've found some pictures of a 65 l/r and they do look pretty much alike! one difference, the cilinder head on my bike seems to be ''ribbed''(is that the right word?excuse my english :whistle) instead of slick like the one on the picture. Are lightning rockets rare or something?
For the parts, they are not my main concern, every year my father visits boulieu (or something like that) which is one of the biggest swap meetings in england for everything that is english. I would enjoy going with him (as I always do concerning petrol head things). I just can't wait to take that whole bike apart and see how it comes out after a thorough cleansing.
I'll need to get some books i guess, with information how to restore these twin carb monsters. Is there a haynes manual for bsa?
Ger, I live very close to eindhoven where do you live? is there a dutch bsa owners club?

cheers!

I'm in Berkel just above Rotterdam. There is an owners club. I'm not a member though. I'm not a person to be a member of a club, with all respect for those who are.

Ger........ i won't dwell on this but a minute. I started a kar club 35 years ago, and its still going strong, i wanted to quit the club.so they made me an honarary member, no dues, no attending meetings, i jus can't seem top get out of this club stuff. back to things at hand!!

My wifes fault

It's something inside myself, Bob. I do not feel at ease in groups larger than six or seven people and in a public place like a bar or a restaurant I like to sit as close as possible to the door. Some may now say: you teached... Yes, but when I teached I was in front of the group. Not in it. Maybe shrinks have a name for it, but I'm fine with it so I don't care.
But I know allready I'll mis the Dutch BSA rally and that's something I do regret, as many BritBikers will atend.

Have a nice evening Bob.

Ahhhh yes Tobias. You will be the "Cat's Meow". You have a couple of choices. Complete restoration will probably go around $4000 US. Make it a nice original runner for about $1500 US if you can take it apart and rebuild it yourself. I would go for the nice runner, but it is up to you, your talents, and money. It looks like a 67 to me. Finned rocker cover was 67, but Monobloc carbs were last on 66 models. However, there were lots of early in year and end of year bikes where parts for the previous or succeeding years were used. No way to be sure. But you have got yourself an A65 Lightning and your gonna have to fight the girls off.

Mr Mike