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Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97374
07/29/06 4:47 pm
07/29/06 4:47 pm
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
T
triumph.t140 Offline OP
BritBike Forum
triumph.t140  Offline OP
BritBike Forum
T
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
Hello. It's me again.

I'm trying to set my electronic Ignition (BB) and I've forgotten my original setting. (1981 T140)

Memory tells me it's 22 degrees BTDC.

Is this right and (sorry for being so stupid) does this mean 22 degrees BEFORE top dead centre or AFTER top dead centre?

Thanks in advance (geddit)

Steve

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Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97375
07/29/06 5:19 pm
07/29/06 5:19 pm
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
RF Whatley Offline
BritBike Forum member
RF Whatley  Offline
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
Steve -
Your bike should fire at 38 deg BTDC at full advance. BTDC stands for "before top dead center". That's right; engines fire before TDC while the piston is still rising.

There should be a scribed line and pointer on your primary side at that position. So you simply remove the cover to see the pointer, hook up your strobe lamp, crank the bike, and make the pointer and line match at 5000 RPM and above. With an electronic ignition that's about the only way you can do it.

Hope this helps! bigt


Don't hide 'em, Ride 'em !!

RF Whatley
Cornelia, GA

"Shop Boy" at Rodi British Bikes
Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97376
07/29/06 6:48 pm
07/29/06 6:48 pm
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
T
triumph.t140 Offline OP
BritBike Forum
triumph.t140  Offline OP
BritBike Forum
T
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
Thanks RF

I'm very gratefull for the info.

I must have a very odd Bonnie. When I line up the pins and magnets so they coincide with the pointer and scribed line on the rotor the bike will not start.

However, if I line them up at TDC the bike starts... (it splutters a lot and there are plenty of kick backs but it does start) with a bit of adjustment around that area I can get it to tick over (if I keep it high) but beyond that it dies when I try to pull away.

It's doubly frustrating because for a few minutes she purrs like a kitten and I get so excited. I love Bonnies and I hate bonnies.

Then I start thinking... maybe it's the carbs but I've stripped and cleaned them. They're a little worn but nothing drastic. I think I'll get a pair of new plugs tomorrow and see if that makes a difference.

How is Atlanta? I've hired bikes from there before. Ridden out to Nashville and down to Florida. I love that city.

Thanks again for the help. I keep you all informed.

Steve

Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97377
07/29/06 8:48 pm
07/29/06 8:48 pm
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
RF Whatley Offline
BritBike Forum member
RF Whatley  Offline
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by triumph.t140:
I must have a very odd Bonnie.

I love Bonnies and I hate bonnies.
Steve –
Although personally less painful, one should resist the temptation to ascribe a failure of the machine solely on the machine. IMHO you’ve made 2 very common oversights and once these are corrected your T140 will run like a top. wink

1) Most owners are not aware, but there are two (2) marks on the alternator rotor. When you strobe time, then only the correct mark comes into view. But when setting the crank position by hand you have to be very careful which mark you use. eek

One mark is used by both cylinders. When you find the correct mark, you can put some machinist's dye or use an all-purpose marker on there so you'll know which one it is next time.

2) Now, to the real problem... Please retrieve the Boyer installation instructions from the bottom of the parakeet cage and this time read ALL the instructions. bigt


Don't hide 'em, Ride 'em !!

RF Whatley
Cornelia, GA

"Shop Boy" at Rodi British Bikes
Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97378
07/30/06 12:32 am
07/30/06 12:32 am
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,708
Virginia, USA
SBoyd Offline
BritBike Forum member
SBoyd  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,708
Virginia, USA
""I must have a very odd Bonnie. When I line up the pins and magnets so they coincide with the pointer and scribed line on the rotor the bike will not start.
However, if I line them up at TDC the bike starts... (it splutters a lot and there are plenty of kick backs but it does start)""

1. Are you sure you have BB? I think your bike came with the desireable Lucas EI so it would seem odd for someone to change it.

2. If you have Boyer Bransden, the simptoms that you describe can be caused by the trigger wires being reversed. (ie. Engine starts at an odd timing setting, but hard to keep running and will not propell the bike.)

Mr. Whately is correct in all he said, but you need to first get it running in a stable manner in order to strobe it.


Stop the insanity.
Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97379
07/30/06 7:00 am
07/30/06 7:00 am
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,429
Melbourne Australia
Tiger Offline
BritBike Forum member
Tiger  Offline
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,429
Melbourne Australia
Strobed a Boyer for a friend this morning and on the strength of two samples [his bike and mine] I can say that the dot through the hole initial setup method as described in the Boyer instructions will give you advanced timing.

At the risk of sounding like Richard's parrot :

You have to strobe a Boyer.

There is no mechanical AA [praise be] to lock up at full advance for static timing, also the wide span advance curve [5K RPM] of the Boyer will not usually give the audible preignition warning of the std mech AA/points setup.

Scenario for an untimed Boyer :

Out in the hills, pull in to refuel and load up with either good, stale, or substituted gas, then you decide to run the bike hard, 6000 to 6500 RPM on maybe 45 deg full advance ?

Several things could go wrong, burning a hole in a piston the most likely.

Excessive ignition advance flogs the bottom end pretty hard too, just like a knackered mech AA but worse.


1969 TR6R
7.62 x 51 is not a maths puzzle.
Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97380
07/30/06 10:43 am
07/30/06 10:43 am
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
T
triumph.t140 Offline OP
BritBike Forum
triumph.t140  Offline OP
BritBike Forum
T
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
JEEZ...!

Thanks chaps.

I'm off to get a better strobe gun. Mine only goes up to 3000.

And some plugs

You've all been very kind. (The original ignition parts were replaced by points before I got the thing). It's baking hot here (London) and working in the burning sun on an oily bike with a kick start is proving a trifle... irritating.

I'll let you know how it goes. And thanks again.

Steve

Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97381
07/30/06 11:28 am
07/30/06 11:28 am
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,429
Melbourne Australia
Tiger Offline
BritBike Forum member
Tiger  Offline
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,429
Melbourne Australia
I have heard it is hot in the UK.
You need the Aussie male hot weather survival rig [when not actually riding].

Very baggy shorts, halfway to knee length, no underwear whatsoever.

Loose old cotton teeshirt with your choice of politically incorrect logo.

Australian Army [or pattern] "Giggle hat", this being a soft cotton thing of irregular shape which covers the ears.

Lots of SPF 30 sunscreen on all otherwise exposed parts of the body, backs of the knees and such particularly.

COLD beer, we are talking icy beer, Fosters is muck, find some VB and an Esky [the Kiwis call the latter a "chully bun" laugh

Drink lots of water.

Rig some overhead shade, a scantily clad Floozie with a parasol is ideal, albeit distracting.

All jokes aside please do not get sunburned, we are mostly whitefellas down here in Australia and skin cancer is horrible.


1969 TR6R
7.62 x 51 is not a maths puzzle.
Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97382
07/30/06 12:24 pm
07/30/06 12:24 pm
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 9,044
Scotland
kommando Online content
BritBike Forum member
kommando  Online Content
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 9,044
Scotland
Its just pleasantly warm up here, plenty of water and no power cuts either bigt . Not boasting of course :rolleyes: .

Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97383
07/30/06 6:21 pm
07/30/06 6:21 pm
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
RF Whatley Offline
BritBike Forum member
RF Whatley  Offline
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by triumph.t140:
It's baking hot here (London) and working in the burning sun on an oily bike with a kick start is proving a trifle... irritating.
Poof boys, the lot. Eh, Tiger? Why we don't even bother working on the machines until it gets to be 95F !! laughing

I must say though that I prefer working in the shade of a set of 44DD's rather than a flimsey parasol! :rolleyes:


Don't hide 'em, Ride 'em !!

RF Whatley
Cornelia, GA

"Shop Boy" at Rodi British Bikes
Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97384
08/01/06 1:29 pm
08/01/06 1:29 pm
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
T
triumph.t140 Offline OP
BritBike Forum
triumph.t140  Offline OP
BritBike Forum
T
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6
London
Vroom vroom!

Hi folks. I took my life in my hands and rode the T140 the five miles to Hackers Bike Shop where they set the timing with a strobe gun. (mine is a cheap one which doesn't work well enough and I couldn't put the neighbours through any more noise).

Now she runs lovely.

Thanks for all your help. I just have a few things to do before I get the MOT test and I'm back on the road... Just as it's started raining for the first time in six weeks.

Need to replace the electrical oil seal on the primary side, rerout the speedo cable and find a way of sealing where the mufflers meet the downpipes and I think I'm there.

Vroom vroom baby. Vroom vroom.

Thanks again.

Steve

Re: Setting BB Elec Ignition on T140 #97385
08/02/06 5:07 pm
08/02/06 5:07 pm
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
RF Whatley Offline
BritBike Forum member
RF Whatley  Offline
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,138
North Georgia, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by triumph.t140:
Vroom vroom baby. Vroom vroom.

Thanks again.

Steve
Can the sweet talk big fella, and fax us a beer!

laughing


Don't hide 'em, Ride 'em !!

RF Whatley
Cornelia, GA

"Shop Boy" at Rodi British Bikes

Moderated by  John Healy 


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