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T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? #720337
12/29/17 6:47 am
12/29/17 6:47 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Palmerston North, New Zealand,
Hi all,
My T160 Primary Duplex Chain is about to give up and I cannot get a replacment.
I am advised I should convert it to the "Triumph-Classics.Com Triplex conversionon OR use a Belt Drive conversion.

After reading endless web reports ive about decided to go with the Triplex route as I hear the belt drives keep snapping but have found very little feed back on the Triplex chain conversion, which leaves me a bit up in the air.

Can anone advise me on these primary drive conversions for a T160 and which is the best way forward on this ?


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
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Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #720339
12/29/17 7:06 am
12/29/17 7:06 am
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Posts: 3,845
ca, us
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DMadigan Offline
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ca, us
You should join TR3OC (Trident Rocket 3 Owners Club).
No experience with either but with a belt (unless run in oil) you also need a belt pump drive and sealed pump.

Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: DMadigan] #720347
12/29/17 8:30 am
12/29/17 8:30 am
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Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Palmerston North, New Zealand,
Cheers David will get o to them.
I would also like to use this opportunity to thank you for your help this year and wish you a Very Happy and Wonderfull Safe New Year 2018.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #720349
12/29/17 9:02 am
12/29/17 9:02 am
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,236
Scotland
S
Stuart Online content
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Stuart  Online Content
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Hi,

Originally Posted by wheller151
Can anone advise me on these primary drive conversions for a T160 and which is the best way forward on this ?

Fwiw, if I was going for one, I'd go for chain.

Originally Posted by DMadigan
You should join TR3OC (Trident Rocket 3 Owners Club).

While I wouldn't dissuade any triple owner from joining the TR3OC as a general thing, if you're expecting to get information from internet forums, Triples On Line has wa-aa-ay more - there, look for posts by "romac", he's in Oz and makes a primary chain conversion.

Just as a matter of interest, unless it's missing, what's up with the existing standard primary set-up?

Hth.

Regards,

Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: Stuart] #720352
12/29/17 9:38 am
12/29/17 9:38 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Hi Stuart
thanks for this and will follow up.

Reason im asking about this, is the duplex chain I have on my T160 is worn out and as the bikes done over 65000 miles now so I think this may be the best way of keeping her on the road.
All the suppliers I have down here tell me this chain is no longer available so I am sort of being forced into converting to a Triplex or a Belt Drive unless you know of a supplier in the UK.?.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #720356
12/29/17 9:54 am
12/29/17 9:54 am
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 9,549
Scotland
kommando Offline
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Have a word with Andy the Chainman before he retires next year as he may know of a source for the chain.

http://www.the-chain-man.co.uk/


You may need to ring, emails are not his strong point.

Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #720357
12/29/17 10:04 am
12/29/17 10:04 am
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,236
Scotland
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Stuart Online content
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Hi,

Originally Posted by wheller151
the bikes done over 65000 miles

Mmmm ... yeah ... it's probably is knackered ... smile

Originally Posted by wheller151
All the suppliers I have down here tell me this chain is no longer available

Mmmm ... 'tis available ... just not in a length to bolt on a T160 ... frown If you look on/search the TOL forum, you'll see contributions by "andychain", he's aka http://www.the-chain-man.co.uk/; obviously it won't be cheap from GB but, if the sprockets are still usable, could be cheaper than than a complete conversion to 1/2"-pitch chain? Btw, if you try to contact Andy, bear in mind that he might not answer 'til early in the New Year?

Hth.

Regards,

Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: kommando] #720360
12/29/17 10:22 am
12/29/17 10:22 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Palmerston North, New Zealand,
Cheers and will give him a call


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #720382
12/29/17 3:03 pm
12/29/17 3:03 pm
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,500
melbourne florida
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bodine031 Offline
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melbourne florida
Baxter Cycle, Mitch Klemph's are vendors here & www.tripletecs.com may be able to help

Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: kommando] #720421
12/29/17 9:46 pm
12/29/17 9:46 pm
Joined: Jul 2017
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Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Cheers and will follow up.
Have a great New Year kommando.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: bodine031] #720422
12/29/17 9:48 pm
12/29/17 9:48 pm
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Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Cheers bodine031
Will check it out and thanks for the lead.

Happy New Year


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #720437
12/30/17 12:27 am
12/30/17 12:27 am
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 95
Texas, USA
R
Ray Elliott Offline
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Texas, USA
This is an excellent video on the triplex conversion. I've not done one but will after I finish about 30 other projects.


Ray Elliott
---
A65, A70, A75, T120, T140, T150, T160
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: Ray Elliott] #720443
12/30/17 1:11 am
12/30/17 1:11 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
W
wheller151 Offline OP
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Hi Ray
amazingly I have just got off the phone to this guy and am arranging for the job to be done mid January.
He is also going to refurbish and set up the clutch inhis work shop for me so im pretty happy with all this.

The conversion basicaly makes the primary drive the same as a T150 set up, and at$380 bucks plus chain and sprokets so im very happy now.

Will report back when all the work has been done and its on the bike again.

Happy New Year 2018.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #720444
12/30/17 1:16 am
12/30/17 1:16 am
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 95
Texas, USA
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Ray Elliott Offline
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Texas, USA
Great news. I'm anxious for the report!

Happy 2018!


Ray Elliott
---
A65, A70, A75, T120, T140, T150, T160
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: Ray Elliott] #724360
02/05/18 11:36 am
02/05/18 11:36 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Palmerston North, New Zealand,
Hi Ray
I bought the triplex conversion kit from Triumph Enthusiast in Australia.
Shipping was pretty cheap and I sent them my clutch spider cush drive to have new rubbers fitted.
I also bought the conversion shims as my cush drive spider thrust bearing face was badly pitted and made a nasty noise even with new thrust bearing fitted.

All the parts arrived with no problem.

David Wright the guy at Triumph Enthusiast was really good to work with and sent lots of vidieos on how to fit all the spacers and even a vid on how set up the clutch.

I put in a new clutch and a new plus % 20 clutch spring. (Orange markings) I then fitted the new shims from the kit to the cush drive.


I was sceptical about how the calculation worked for the engine sprocket shims that would be needed to aligne the sprockets.
So I got hold of an old primary cover and cut it down so I could use a straight edge across the top between the two sprokets like is done on a Bonney.
To ensure the engine sprocket and the new triplex clutch sprocket lined up properly I re did the process several times, mounting the bearing and spacers in the cutway cover plate slightly diffrently to prove the method .
Doing this also boosted my confidence and took away my sceptisim completly. (This method of making and using the cover plate is in the workshop manual by the way.)

I do know it is crittical to get this sprocket alignment to less than 10 thou of an inch.

I can now report that the caculation method was a tiny bit off, and after doing the sums it came out that I needed a 17 tho shim in the sprocket.

Using the cutaway primary outer case method that I made, I fitted the bearings and shims and rechecked all.
The actual alignment using a tool steel stright edge across both sprockets came out at just 6 thou of an inch.
This gave an 11 thou discrepancy between the two methods.

I then used a 10 thou shim on the engine sprocket and was very happy with the result, with the actual alignment coming out on mine at plus 6 thou and minus 4 thou.
Thats a pretty excellent sprocket alignment in my book.

Even if I had not used the cutway primary case that I made, it would still have been within acceptable tollerances with the 10 thou shim.
I can say now with confidence that either way worked out within tollerance on my bike.

All the parts fitted perfectly and I just had to buy a new T150 triplex chain and engine sprocket.
I put it all back together and fully tested every thing, and can report its most excellent and I am now a very happy chap.
I dont know why Triumph did not fit a Triplex chain from the begining.

One thing I did find is that the clearance between the new triplex chain in board edge and the end of the oil pump locking nut is very close, and after the chain got loosened up a bit it made slight contact with the nut making a bit of a weird noise.
I fixed this by simply by removing the nut and filing about 3mm of the nut making it a bit thinner.
Put it all back together and the clearances with the oil pump are now all good.

Cost wise including shipping all the parts and including the triplex conversion , shim pack conversion, plus spacers, engine sprocket and Triplex chain it all came to about $600 New Zealand.
If you did not mess around like I did rechecking everything and just did the job, you could easy do this Triplex coversion in two or three hrs including having a few cupps of tea.

Hope this little report helps anyone else who was in the same situation as I was.
My T160 with the new Triplex conversion is running fine and is much nicer to ride now.

For refrence and if anyone wants to contact the makers of this Triplex conversion kit, here is his email.
David Wright. EMAIL -- madabouttriumph@gmail.com.
Hes based in Australia.
There is a vid allready on this thread for you to watch on this conversion first.
Happy riding guys and gals.


Last edited by wheller151; 02/07/18 4:34 am.

T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: Stuart] #724600
02/07/18 4:46 am
02/07/18 4:46 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
W
wheller151 Offline OP
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Hi Stuart
just to advise I fitted a triplex conversion made my Dave Wright in Aussy.
There is a vid of it on this thread and I wrote a report on how it went on same thread if you have any intrest..
Bikes as good as new now and am amazed this simple idea was not used by Triumph from the start.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: kommando] #724601
02/07/18 4:48 am
02/07/18 4:48 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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I fitted a Triplex conversion in the end.
Bikes as good as gold now.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: DMadigan] #724602
02/07/18 4:52 am
02/07/18 4:52 am
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Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Hi David
after a lot of phone calls and emails I ended up fitting a Triplex Drive conversion kit.
Bikes as good as gold now.
Cheers and thanks for your help.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #724603
02/07/18 4:56 am
02/07/18 4:56 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Many thanks for your help on this.
After lots of emails and phone calls I ended up fitting theTriplex Conversion from Dave Wright in Aussy.
Workes a treat and the bikes as good if not better than new.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: bodine031] #724605
02/07/18 5:07 am
02/07/18 5:07 am
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Palmerston North, New Zealand,
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wheller151 Offline OP
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Hi mate
thanks for your input here.
After a lot of phone calls and emails I decided eventualy to fit a Triplex Chain conversion kit from Dave Wright in Aussy.
Workes perfectly and im very happy with the result.


T140v 1977 Export American Spec.
T160 Trident
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #733395
04/28/18 3:22 pm
04/28/18 3:22 pm
Joined: Apr 2018
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N.S.W. Australia
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wheller, you said "I dont know why Triumph did not fit a Triplex chain from the begining."

They did on the T150 and The A75, and got somewhat burnt. As you say, sprocket alignment is critical, and there was also a story going around that there was a fault in the sprocket machining.

I can't say what the cause was, but broken chains were not uncommon on those models in the '70s.

My 18 month old T150 broke its chain in early '71 (twisted the crank between the sprocket and oil pump drive gear and I had to cut it off with a hand held hacksaw blade). I wrote to Triumph in England seeking redress, and they answered, but the short answer was "no". I still have the reply in my Trident workshop manual (somewhere).

A bloke I knew broke the chain on his A75 and it bent the end of the crank. We straightened it in the bike (in his lounge room) with a sledgehammer! It ran just fine for years.

My point is that maybe Triumph decided that a duplex chain might be less critical and therefore less troublesome on the T160.

Regards, Phil.


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1969 Triumph Bonneville
currently 6 other non-Brit machines
past history includes 11 Brit and 13 non-Brit machines.
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Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #733426
04/28/18 9:27 pm
04/28/18 9:27 pm
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Andy Higham Offline
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Back in the day a few racers fitted two single row chains on the outer teeth of triplex sprockets. It was nearly as strong as a triplex chain but could tolerate misalignment due to shaft flex without breaking anything


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Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #733442
04/29/18 3:59 am
04/29/18 3:59 am
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 15
N.S.W. Australia
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Good idea Andy. My chain broke at idle, but it had previously had a sound flogging. I recall that 9,000rpm in 1st was good for 60mph.
Phil.


1954 Norton Dominator 88 café (current project)
1969 Triumph Bonneville
currently 6 other non-Brit machines
past history includes 11 Brit and 13 non-Brit machines.
Some impressive and some just silly.
Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: Andy Higham] #733450
04/29/18 7:16 am
04/29/18 7:16 am
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Scotland
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Stuart Online content
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Hi,

Originally Posted by Andy Higham
Back in the day a few racers fitted two single row chains on the outer teeth of triplex sprockets.

Norman Hyde used to offer that for the T160. Aiui, problem on a road bike was keeping both chains tensioned correctly for any length of time with the original single tensioner. With the availability of the various duplex and triplex conversions, two single chains are probably more trouble than they're worth.

Regards,

Re: T160 primary conversion. Belt or Triplex? [Re: wheller151] #733470
04/29/18 11:58 am
04/29/18 11:58 am
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Running from demons in WNY
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It has to be misalignment and perhaps the tensioner killing the triplex chains....Harley Sportster to this day uses a #35 three strand primary chain. It has slightly smaller rollers and pins than the British three strand.. The Sportster primary chain isn't a problem even on later Buells rated at 100 HP...


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