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#713292 - 10/31/17 1:52 am 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier?  
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kevin roberts Online content
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ohio, usa
i'm finally getting around to my long-neglected 1969 Tbolt, the one that's been sitting for ages. heavens, look at the dust:

[Linked Image]

i bought it as a very nice and complete non-runner. the PO said it would go, but would run the battery down. and when i hooked a battery to it, i could see why, because whenever the Boyer is connected the ignition is ON, whether the key is on or not. so that will be simple, probably he bypassed the ignition switch. or maybe not. he also wrapped the stock harness tightly in tape, and then added conductors for the Boyer sending coils and various other improvements without taking the old stuff out, and then wrapped em together again. so there are bare blade connectors sticking out everywhere.

but what exactly is this rectifier? i can't remember ever seeing one like this. the zener is up front and seems to be hooked up.

[Linked Image]

the electronics are potted in with something like looks more or less like amber, yellow and clear. it's got a number, if that means anything:

[Linked Image]

horn works, though. it and the commando are the only machines i have with functional horns.



Into the distance a ribbon of black
Stretched to the point of no turning back
A flight of fancy on a windswept field
Standing alone my senses reeled
A fatal attraction is holding me fast how
How can I escape this irresistible grasp?
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#713296 - 10/31/17 2:22 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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Mark Z Online content
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Owego, NY, USA
The rectifier has the same dimensions and wiring as my Tympanium, but mine is potted with black epoxy. Whatever it is, I doubt that the zener diode should be hooked up. Sounds like an overhaul of the wiring is in order.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
#713299 - 10/31/17 2:41 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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KC in S.B. Online content
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Looks like the Tympanium I had in hand today, (trying to trade it off). Mine has Lime Green translucent potting. I wonder if the color changes were done on purpose by the company? maybe a date code or something?
And Kevin,...... There's something seriously wrong in those photos. Your oil tank does not have a cracked / broken mounting tab! Must be a low mile bike!?!


Down to 1 BSA, 2 Triumphs, 2 '56 Chevys
#713302 - 10/31/17 3:08 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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Tridentman Online content
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I had one of those on a bike I bought a few years ago--I think a Triumph triple (memory fades over time--even quicker as I get older!).
It is an early version of the Tympanium rectifier/regulator--- and worked fine.
Two yellows to alternator output, red to positive, black (brown?) to negative.
Not sure when these solid state units were introduced but the yellow ones are some of the first I think.
I am sure JH can tell us if he sees this thread.
HTH

#713305 - 10/31/17 4:47 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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NickL Online content
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That's a tynpanium regulator/rectifier unit.
The're ok so disconnect the zener, you don't need it anymore.
OR leave the zener in, it just won't do anything.



#713339 - 10/31/17 12:52 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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Hi kevin, that Tbolt should bonnie up well, might be worth checking the ignition coils have been swapped for 6 volt items if a Boyer is fitted.


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
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The poster formerly known as Pod
#713349 - 10/31/17 1:57 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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bodine031 Online content
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What all have said BUT BOGUS wire connections!!

#713388 - 10/31/17 6:31 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: bodine031]  
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Tympanium is just a rectifier, you still need the Zener diode which is a voltage regulator.

#713392 - 10/31/17 7:03 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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sure does match the typaniums. so they came in yellow, green, and black potting? hookup is pretty simple, but there's no telling what the PO did, so i'll have to trace it all out. the old online PDFs do say that it regulates up to ten amps, so that would be good for whatever the old rotor can still do. interesting that the old zener wouldn't interfere, nick, but come to think of it there isn't any reason why it should. i ran dual zeners on my morgo for years. if i'm lucky the messed-up part s of the wiring will be close to the surface and outside. there's extra after-market snap connectors and blade connectors hanging loose in a bunch of places. and a wire nut or two.

i bought this ages ago without it running. made sure it turned with compression and had four gears. everything else looked good. appears to have a newer speedo and 1970s pipes. missing a grab rail. somebody's put allen-heads on the covers, and that's fine with me.

got to go measure for oddie studs now, have a couple bits missing. gavin, i'll see to the coils. i imagine they're still 12 volts, based on the remainder of the electrics. i think i gave away my only 12-volt dual tower coil, and the only 6 volt units i have are dual-tower for running a Boyer with 4 plugs. but coils are easy.

lol. no, KC the oil tank mounts look pretty good.


Into the distance a ribbon of black
Stretched to the point of no turning back
A flight of fancy on a windswept field
Standing alone my senses reeled
A fatal attraction is holding me fast how
How can I escape this irresistible grasp?
#713422 - 10/31/17 10:12 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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There might be a Tympanium rectifier/regulator but the one in the picture is not.

#713436 - 11/01/17 1:20 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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I took a look at my Tympanium and it is in fact green. I don't know why I thought it was black, sorry.

Larry, what makes you think the unit in the picture is not a rectifier/regulator? All the Tympaniums I've seen are both, and this one looks just the same except for the color of the epoxy.

Well it's easy enough to determine, once the wiring is fixed. Just disconnect the zener, put a volt meter across the battery, and rev the engine. If the voltage does not exceed around 14.5, then you don't need the zener.

If the zener is not needed, I would disconnect it, just for simplicity, and to eliminate one potential component failure.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
#713438 - 11/01/17 1:29 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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It's interesting that the Tym........ Doesn't seem to be concerned about heat disapation? Sparks and Pods have fins, like the Zener mount does. If It's a Regulator, I'd think it would be getting hot doing that! Probably a good idea to mount it someplace where it is on a heat sink, and not just 2 sided tape. Do these not get hot?


Down to 1 BSA, 2 Triumphs, 2 '56 Chevys
#713440 - 11/01/17 1:46 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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KC, I think the thick aluminum body dissipates the heat pretty well. I agree though that it should be bolted to another piece of metal, preferably aluminum, as is mine. I've never felt it during operation to see how warm it gets.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
#713445 - 11/01/17 4:06 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: LarryLebel]  
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Originally Posted by LarryLebel
There might be a Tympanium rectifier/regulator but the one in the picture is not.



OH YES IT IS........................................... Look at the centre 3 solder pads, they are the Thyristor/SCR connections.

Last edited by NickL; 11/01/17 4:08 am.


#713447 - 11/01/17 6:30 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: NickL]  
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Well, I have a tymp, different coloured potting to this illustrated, though, but bloody well looks identical ! A long story. But I'll tell you buggers this, when it comes to electronics, Nick really knows his stuff !Read his previous stuff when the old bugger is being serious ! Is reading and comprehension a lost art these days ! As I understood it, at the time, a tymp was a regulator/rectifier. Therefore, no Zenor required. Worked for me, until the long story bit ( wiring fault ) !

#713462 - 11/01/17 12:50 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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John Healy Online content
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620401 is Tympanium's part number for their regulator/rectifier. As Nick said it is a Tympanium.


#713470 - 11/01/17 2:59 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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All regulators should be mounted on a heat sink. Preferably with thermal paste. The excess energy is converted to heat and if it does not have anywhere to go the unit will heat up and probably fail eventually.

#713485 - 11/01/17 6:03 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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i'll see about prying it up and screwing it to an aluminum plate. right now it's held on with double-sided something.


Into the distance a ribbon of black
Stretched to the point of no turning back
A flight of fancy on a windswept field
Standing alone my senses reeled
A fatal attraction is holding me fast how
How can I escape this irresistible grasp?
#713498 - 11/01/17 7:34 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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GrandPaul Online content
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Kev, horn on the 441 works fine!

off topic, but how's it running now?

(by the way, nice TBolt)


GrandPaul (does not use emoticons)
Author of the book "Old Bikes"
Too many bikes to list, mostly Triumph & Norton, some BSA & European
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#713504 - 11/01/17 9:15 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: Mark Z]  
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bodine031 Online content
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Rolled out the T-100 rigid chopper to go for a ride. It has a green potting compound Tympanium that I installed in 1998. Bought from the nice folks at British Cycle Supply. It is mounted on a piece of aluminum that's mounted to the frame.

#713591 - 11/02/17 3:41 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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whatever it is, i'm going to try to run it.

paul, the horn on the 441 worked for a day or two, then quit. i assumed i pulled a wire loose under the tank, so i'll go looking when i get a spare moment. i sheared the woodruff key in the clutch, so that slowed things down.

only BSA would build a single cylinder motor with four (FOUR) different sizes of 1/8-inch woodruff keys.

anyway, i can generally get it started now, but it's very picky about piston position and too much fuel. it will always start up if i roll it down a hill (luckily, it's downhill both ways from my house) but gargles a little until it clears the combustion chamber of my attempts at kicking. so i'm practicing.

the Tbolt really is pretty.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

but i'm bemused at the wiring. the PO cut all the connections off short so he could install after-market spade connectors at every junction instead of bullets, so the harness is too short at lots of places, and his lousy connectors are falling off. along with the extra connectors sticking out at random spots, it makes it a bit hard to figure out what's going on. but the majority of the wires are still OEM, so i can at least see what the circuits are. i'm tempted to just throw it out and either re-wire from scratch or buy a repro harness.

easier and cheaper to just re-wire, i imagine, which is what i've always done, but putting in an old-style harness might be interesting.



Into the distance a ribbon of black
Stretched to the point of no turning back
A flight of fancy on a windswept field
Standing alone my senses reeled
A fatal attraction is holding me fast how
How can I escape this irresistible grasp?
#713723 - 11/03/17 3:56 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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That's a typmanium unit. Usually the epoxy is green... perhaps the sun has made it turn yellow! My favorite is the Podtronics unit: https://www.classicbritishspares.co...egulator-rectifier-single-phase-cbs-4035

#713768 - 11/03/17 10:51 pm Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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shoot, i don't know. the PO got it from his father and stored it in his garage for 12 years without riding it, as he couldn't keep it from running the battery down. doesn't look like it was stored in the sun with the seat off. generally red pigments fade before yellow, so maybe it did start out as green.

waiting on some ewarts parts right now. the old clear fuel line was hard as a rock. had to hacksaw it off to unscrew the petcocks.


Into the distance a ribbon of black
Stretched to the point of no turning back
A flight of fancy on a windswept field
Standing alone my senses reeled
A fatal attraction is holding me fast how
How can I escape this irresistible grasp?
#713786 - 11/04/17 2:16 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
Joined: Aug 2001
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Mark Z Online content
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Mark Z  Online Content
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"i'm tempted to just throw it out and either re-wire from scratch or buy a repro harness."

Yes, it sounds like the current wiring should go. (I think I suggested that in my first reply.)

With a Boyer and a Tympanium, if you buy a repro harness, you'll have wires you don't need (no condensers, no zener diode), and some wrong lengths due to things being located a bit differently.

Wiring from scratch is gratifying, if you embrace it and do a good job. There's a plethora of different sorts of connectors out there these days, and threads here with various suggestions. Get or draw a schematic, choose materials, and have some fun!

FWIW, if you decide to use OE-type snap ("bullet") connectors, they can work if they're new and you use dialectric grease on 'em. The problems with old ones is that the metal inserts get corroded and weak. These connectors and wire terminals are available at British Wiring, also wire in all desired colors, and poly sheath of various diameters. If you go this way, I'd strongly suggest the crimp-on terminals, which requires the purchase of a special crimper.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
#713797 - 11/04/17 11:08 am Re: 1969 A65T-- what's this weird rectifier? [Re: kevin roberts]  
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Blown Income Online content
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Originally Posted by kevin roberts
whatever it is, i'm going to try to run it.

paul, the horn on the 441 worked for a day or two, then quit. i assumed i pulled a wire loose under the tank, so i'll go looking when i get a spare moment. i sheared the woodruff key in the clutch, so that slowed things down.

only BSA would build a single cylinder motor with four (FOUR) different sizes of 1/8-inch woodruff keys.

anyway, i can generally get it started now, but it's very picky about piston position and too much fuel. it will always start up if i roll it down a hill (luckily, it's downhill both ways from my house) but gargles a little until it clears the combustion chamber of my attempts at kicking. so i'm practicing.

the Tbolt really is pretty.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

but i'm bemused at the wiring. the PO cut all the connections off short so he could install after-market spade connectors at every junction instead of bullets, so the harness is too short at lots of places, and his lousy connectors are falling off. along with the extra connectors sticking out at random spots, it makes it a bit hard to figure out what's going on. but the majority of the wires are still OEM, so i can at least see what the circuits are. i'm tempted to just throw it out and either re-wire from scratch or buy a repro harness
easier and cheaper to just re-wire, i imagine, which is what i've always done, but putting in an old-style harness might be interesting.



Kevin

The T bolt looks really nice, a suggestion though. Flip the front fender stay fork bracket over to close the overly large fender to tire gap.


1955 BSA Bantam D1 Plunger
1956 BSA A10RR Street and LSR Bike
1961 BSA C15S
1966 BSA spitfire
1969 Triumph T100C
1970 Triumph TR6R
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1974 Triumph T150V

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