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Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? #677071
12/09/16 5:01 pm
12/09/16 5:01 pm
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 716
Out There!
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Nick Offline OP
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Nick  Offline OP
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Out There!
Buddy of mine in Japan (a former gamble racer) has a 4-valve Weslake single engine around which he wants to build a classic racer.
Anyone have any info or parts for these rare birds?

Below is a pic of his current ride, built around a Meguro copy of the Triumph.



Note fire-breathing Japanese magneto, cylinder head drilled for lightness and cooling, Yamaha front brake, etc.
In a gamble-racer chassis this Meguro engine would be mated to a 2-speed g-box with chain primary, crank has adjustable weights in the flywheels, very, very trick and very powerful.


Last edited by Nick; 12/10/16 12:54 am.

When people who should have known better cautioned me about the dangers of motorcycle racing, I always told them that a fear of death is nothing more than a fear of life in disguise.
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #677109
12/10/16 12:07 am
12/10/16 12:07 am
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,755
Laredo (South) Texas, USA
GrandPaul Online content
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Laredo (South) Texas, USA
Mighty nice one-off!


GrandPaul (does not use emoticons)
Author of the book "Old Bikes"
Too many bikes to list, mostly Triumph & Norton, some BSA & European
"The Iron in your blood should be Vintage"
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #677128
12/10/16 7:32 am
12/10/16 7:32 am
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,069
Netherlands
Peter R Online content

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Netherlands
Can't help with the Weslake unfortunately.
The bike on these pice looks great, athough the Meguro's that I have seen were all BSA A10 clones, this one looks to me like a pre-unit Triumph twin.

Last edited by Peter R; 12/10/16 7:35 am. Reason: spelling

Peter.
1974 Commando 850
1972 Trident T150T
1961 Goldie DBD34
1969 Benelli 250 sport special
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #677169
12/10/16 1:07 pm
12/10/16 1:07 pm
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 163
Costa Mesa/Mammoth Lakes, CA
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Chris Johnson Online content
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Costa Mesa/Mammoth Lakes, CA
I picked up a Godden Weslake to poach the engine for a chopper project. An accumulation of other projects and the general good condition of the Gooden has kept me from moving forward. I am interested in seeing what your buddy comes up with.

Chris

Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #677208
12/10/16 6:51 pm
12/10/16 6:51 pm
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 726
Overland Missouri
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old mule Offline
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Overland Missouri
Look at the Australian road racing sites- old speedway motors are popular there. Alcohol fuel.
JAPs, Goddens, Jawas, all turn up frequently there.

Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #677223
12/10/16 10:27 pm
12/10/16 10:27 pm
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 716
Out There!
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Nick Offline OP
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Nick  Offline OP
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Out There!
Meguro copied the BSA, resulting in the W1 Kawasaki after Kawasaki bought it from Meguro. However, Meguro built Triumph copies specially for the gamble racers. These were purpose-built racing engines. I was told that there was also an American tuner living in Japan back in the day who made big bucks building and tuning engines for the gamble racers. In those days the money involved was serious, with the top riders earning close to a million dollars a year. I'd love to track down that American tuner hear his stories.....

I heard that one rider actually had his best engine gold plated. Another guy had his 'magic crankshaft' with which his engine always made way more power than with other cranks. He kept it locked in a safe in his work area at the track and only used it for main events!


When people who should have known better cautioned me about the dangers of motorcycle racing, I always told them that a fear of death is nothing more than a fear of life in disguise.
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #677828
12/15/16 5:46 pm
12/15/16 5:46 pm
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,557
Maui Hawaii
HawaiianTiger Online content

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Maui Hawaii
Perhaps we can narrow it down a bit. Weslake made a few versions of their Speedway motors. When I was racing, there was a four valve conversion kit for the Jawa two valve. I had the more common four valve push rod motor, but there was a double overhead cam motor as well. There even a one liter v twin utilizing two of the four valve push rod motors for sidecar work. That would be the motor to use for a street special, I think, or perhaps even a classic racer.
I'm sure there's a shed somewhere in England just loaded with spares for these motors....

Cheers,

Bill

PS here's the shed Weslake parts

Last edited by HawaiianTiger; 12/15/16 5:51 pm.

Bikes
1974 Commando
1985 Honda Nighthawk 650
1957 Thunderbird/T110 "Flying Tiger"
Antique Fans: Loads of Emersons (Two six wingers) plus gyros and orbiters.
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: HawaiianTiger] #677833
12/15/16 6:28 pm
12/15/16 6:28 pm
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 3,260
Running from demons in WNY
Hillbilly bike Online content
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Running from demons in WNY
I think "Noisy Norton" who posts in the competition forum has a Weslake in a sidecar LSR machine??...


650 Triumph modified production LSR record holder 133.1 MPH... Twin 650 engine Triumph LSR that goes sorta fast...
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #678225
12/18/16 7:33 pm
12/18/16 7:33 pm
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 593
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bon Online content
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Tim lynch is the gentleman to talk to about tricked up sporty singles. His machine having a jawa 500 speedway top end mated very sweetly to a bsa b31/33 bottom end.

http://www.britbike.com/forums/ubbthread...true#Post593765

Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #678326
12/19/16 5:26 pm
12/19/16 5:26 pm
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,009
Bolton Lancs UK
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Andy Higham Online content
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Bolton Lancs UK
I used to race a supercharged "Wezzie" sprint bike. They are a pretty robust motor but cranks can go out of line when you drop the clutch at 7,000 rpm and the 7" slick bites into the tarmac.
For a road racer or cafe racer the lubrication system would need a complete re-think. The oil pump puts a spit every few revolutions into the crank and similar to the rockers, this is then splashed around the engine and coughed out through a couple of flap valves in the crankcase and caught in a bottle. There are no oil control rings so some oil is burnt


1955 BSA B31 400cc "Stargazer"
1962 Greeves 200cc "Blue Meanie"
1962/67 Greeves 350cc
1967 Greeves 360cc Challenger
1984 Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
GM500cc sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
Jawa 500cc grasstrack
2003 Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #679127
12/28/16 6:49 pm
12/28/16 6:49 pm
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 593
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bon Online content
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The newer speedway/grasstrack engines, as in those made in the last 20 years or so, have recirculating oil systems like any other engine. Also they do have oil control rings so don't burn much if any oil.

A couple of other issues are though, the lack of finning, these engines are designed to run on methanol, which runs cooler than petrol, so don't need as much finning. The other issue is they are usually designed to be "laydown" engines, in that they are held in the frame nearly parallel to the ground. If you put them in a frame upright, there maybe scavanging issues.

Apart from all that, they are very strong, simple and well designed engines, that running methanol, chuck out a lot of power, 60hp +, and are designed to be pure race engines.

Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #679129
12/28/16 7:01 pm
12/28/16 7:01 pm
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,009
Bolton Lancs UK
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Andy Higham Online content
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You are correct that modern speedway/grasstrack engines have a recirculating oil system. On the GM engine the oil is drawn into the crankshaft from the timing case by a scroll, the oil is returned to the timing case via a reed valve. Oil is carried up to the valve gear by the cam chain. Oil capacity is only about 0.8L
Weslake engines do not have these features.
There are companies that will convert a laydown engine to upright, it involves reworking the oiling system and re balancing the crank
You are underestimating the power of these engines, the GM500 offset crank engine produces around 85BHP @ 12,500RPM


1955 BSA B31 400cc "Stargazer"
1962 Greeves 200cc "Blue Meanie"
1962/67 Greeves 350cc
1967 Greeves 360cc Challenger
1984 Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
GM500cc sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
Jawa 500cc grasstrack
2003 Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #679137
12/28/16 8:15 pm
12/28/16 8:15 pm
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Posts: 593
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Yeah i know a lot of the speedway engines make a lot of power, twice what the old british road racing singles like the goldie made. Great engineering in them too, overhead cams, four valves, really good inlet porting.

Re: Weslake 4-valve Single racer?? [Re: Nick] #712138
10/21/17 5:05 pm
10/21/17 5:05 pm
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 56
Cambridge UK
Monty777 Offline
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Cambridge UK
Weslake did design a 4 valve ohc 500cc single which was going to be produced as a road race engine rather than a speedway motor. I believe they did produce 5-10 of them but didn't continue with the project. Mate of mine has one of the engines and the casting patterns as he intended to produce them for classic racing-don't know how far he has got with it though.

John


Growing Old-DISGRACEFULLY!


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