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#648971 - 04/17/16 11:17 am Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! ***** [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 4,450
Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



Joined: May 2013
Posts: 4,450
Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Well the bike started up today, only briefly as I'm not pulling oil through the pump yet, however ticking over at 4000 rpm was cause enough to switch it off quick!

After spending two hours dropping different slides in to the carbs and trying to wonder why they wouldn't seat properly. It turned out that I was attacked by the dark lord of pattern parts.

Just look at this s**t - it's more of a buyer beware than anything.

I ended up using the original body off my origins factory fitted throttle as the new body was so poorly made



That off set hole in the centre... Yup That's the throttle tube. Needless to say, you can't even fit it to the bars without locking the whole throttle.

Fair enough, not happy but surely the tube was fine. It fitted in the original housing and turned ok. Great.

Ah no.



Pattern on the left, broken OEM on the right. If your not sure of the difference I'll tell you. Look at the OEM, the left hand side of the lug which mounts the cables is shorter on the cable pull side than it is on the throttle stop side. Look at the pattern one. It's completely reversed. So when the throttle is closed, the bike is still at 1/4 throttle- cheers!

So I shortens that part down. And still it's too far off. Which means although the throttle is now almost closed. It isn't snapping shut on the body when the throttle is dropped. Until it does that then I'm not taking the bike on the road.

Really annoying part is the bike is due for MOT next week which means my tuning time before test has now been eliminated. All thanks to shit parts. I'll have another play with the throttle but I seriously doubt I will be able to sort the problem. And yes the stop screws are all the way out as the slides drop completely when the ferrules on the throttle are removed.


beerchug
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#649008 - 04/17/16 2:48 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,700
R Moulding Online content
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R Moulding  Online Content
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South Island

Been there as well Allan. Fitted 3 Pattern Twist grips and all were Crap for one reason or another. Imagine my surprise when the first one while tightly clamped down slid almost of the Bar as I took a corner!

I do not know what BSA used but can recommend the new production AMAL parts.

Regards
Rod



#649022 - 04/17/16 4:16 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,389
D.Bachtel Online content
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D.Bachtel  Online Content
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SLO County, CA
Allan you should have 2 or 3 good spare throttles by now!
Next time you're at a swap keep your eyes open.
Plenty of good AMALS, Dohertys and BTEs out here.

Hope you didn't hurt the bike!

Don in Nipomo

#649025 - 04/17/16 4:25 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Yes I've found the AMAL stuff to be excellent quality. At the moment I am at a point where I darent spend any money on it. So, my brain started working and with a bit of imagination I fixed the problem. It also cured the worry of the twist grip ferrules ever falling out, if the slides stuck. Something which happened once on the old mans A10.

With a bit of imagination with my belt sander, I allowed the throttle to close quite a bit more



But it wasn't quite enough.

I measured the widest part of the ferrule and it measured 3/8" so carefully I bored a 3/8 drill bit down the housing of the OEM body. Carefully bored them at the same depth.



Pushed the ferrule in and it was a snug fit - so no chance of it ever falling out, and no more wrapping bits of tape around them to stop it happening.




All fitted together the slides now slam shut. Bingo!! And no money spent.

That said the cables aren't as healthy as they could be and would benefit with being renewed. A longer inner cable would have stopped any butchery at all. But I have no intention to make any, well not yet anyway. When I do I will do as Gavin Eisler has done and fitted 90 degree bends out of the carbs. I'd also switch. To ferrule tops with midway adjusters. But not yet :wink


beerchug
#649026 - 04/17/16 4:28 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: D.Bachtel]  
Joined: May 2013
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



Joined: May 2013
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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Originally Posted By D.Bachtel
Allan you should have 2 or 3 good spare throttles by now!
Next time you're at a swap keep your eyes open.
Plenty of good AMALS, Dohertys and BTEs out here.

Hope you didn't hurt the bike!

Don in Nipomo


Thanks Don, I nearly searched eBay for something of original parts. But it would all take too long to get here. No expense and a same day fix was just the ticket LOL


beerchug
#649074 - 04/18/16 8:59 am Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,092
gavin eisler Online content
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gavin eisler  Online Content
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argyll. scotland, uk
http://www.dhgate.com/product/pair-v-brake-noodles-cable-guide-boots-mountain/208121961.html

hi Allan, I used these sort of things , mountain bikers call them noodles. Check your local pushbike place.

Last edited by gavin eisler; 04/18/16 10:28 pm.

71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
#649195 - 04/19/16 8:14 am Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Thanks Gavin.


beerchug
#649453 - 04/20/16 3:24 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 777
Andy Higham Online content
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Andy Higham  Online Content
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Bolton Lancs UK
Allan, I get cable bits from Venhill.
I have fitted bends on both ends of throttle cable, this stops the throttle cable hanging down and the risk of it snagging.
http://www.venhill.co.uk/Cables_-_Components_Kits/Cable_Components/Ferrules_-_Bends


1955 BSA B31 400cc "Stargazer"
1962 Greeves 200cc "Blue Meanie"
1962/67 Greeves 350cc
1967 Greeves 360cc Challenger
1984 Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
Modified Nu-Trak GM500cc sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
2003 Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
#649459 - 04/20/16 4:09 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Usually I get my clutch cable kits from them and do both clutch and brake


beerchug
#677585 - 12/13/16 2:34 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Could have sworn I made a post, saying that I could have sworn I took more photos than what I have on my phone.

Anyway, I made the Executive decision and decided that the Clubman seat was to be repaired and re-fitted and with that the rearsets too (cant have one without the other!)

Unfortunately I didnt take any decent photos of how bad the damage was to the hump where a bolt pushed straight through. But I built all the underside up with Fibreglass tissue and resin to make it good and strong, then covered the whole hump with fibreglass filler and started to sand back - tell you what.. thats tough stuff!!!

As it was 12 Months ago...





Some filling and sanding later.



Even after the filler was applied and sanded there was still parts I had missed and there was some deep gouges below the tank badge. I built this up with plenty of High Build Primer, before leaving it for 2 weeks to shrink in preperation for sanding.

Because im Painting the hump black again, some grey primer was needed and thats about where we stand to date:





Ive ordered some Black aerosol from RS paints. I know their paint applies nicely (although I've never used their gloss) and that it goes well with my preferred lacquer. Ive also ordered some Parakete Yellow for my Honda 400/4 as that will be going up for sale in the Spring cry


Ive also ordered some of the thin soft foam to replace that which got ripped when I took the cover off. It says it will add to comfort - maybe it does maybe it doesn't, But it is a comfy seat wink It also helps to hide any imperfections in the main foam so they wont show through to the vynal.... Most important!


beerchug
#677586 - 12/13/16 2:36 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Following this I am considering making a fibreglass tank for the racer. whistle ......


beerchug
#677645 - 12/13/16 7:03 pm Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: May 2010
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TR6Ray Offline
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TR6Ray  Offline
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Illinois, USA
Looks like good work, Allan. Hope it all turns out well for you.


'64 TR6R Plus some Twins from other countries (U.S., Germany, Japan)
#677682 - 12/14/16 3:30 am Re: Lightning Restoration - engine build again!! [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Thanks Ray,

My biggest fear when working with fibreglass is hair line cracks. One appeared in my fibreglass side panel. However there was more flexibility there. The seat is pretty rigid


beerchug
#677907 - 12/16/16 6:04 am Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Almost finished, the paint I ordered from RS Paints proved to be Cellulose, same as the Yellow for my Honda 400/4 bigt and it sprays like a beauty, plenty of coats applied and now waiting for some more 2k lacquer to come in the post. It's tempting not to lacquer it though but it will add some more wear resistance which is what my bikes seem to require. facepalm


It is a little orange peely but the 2k will sort that out, or if I was to flat the paint back and polish it up.




beerchug
#678627 - 12/22/16 2:29 pm Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



Joined: May 2013
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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Final process of the seat,

a 5mm covering foam was placed on the seat to replace what had fell apart previously, and lacquer was missed off on the list of things to do to the tank (28 to spray the rear of the seat just seemed like a waste, as it would have hardened in the tin 2 days later)



The cover replaced... One day I will get Leightons to make a cover which fits properly becasue this one never has. And the old badge placed back on which shows a little battle scarring (aka patina) But otherwise the hump has been cut back with some Farcella G4 and now awaiting a waxing.





beerchug
#678644 - 12/22/16 4:32 pm Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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TR6Ray Offline
BritBike Forum member
TR6Ray  Offline
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Illinois, USA
That looks really nice, Allan. How do you attach the cover?


'64 TR6R Plus some Twins from other countries (U.S., Germany, Japan)
#678666 - 12/22/16 8:36 pm Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Thanks Ray, I used spray carpet adhesive but can see me going round it with Evo-Stick and some pegs. The Capet glue was only supposed to be used for the foam topper.


beerchug
#678937 - 12/26/16 9:57 am Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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bodine031 Offline
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melbourne florida
Nice Job!!!!

#678940 - 12/26/16 10:13 am Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Aug 2001
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konon Online content
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konon  Online Content

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Iowa
Just like new!


1968 BSA Firebird
1200 HD
XS 1100
1971 Rickman 125
#679710 - 01/02/17 12:19 pm Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Thanks Guys, its turned out a lot better than I could have hoped for so I'm really pleased grin

Went back into the workshop today and worked on my "Eddie Dow type" Damper rods, I was never impressed with the factory fitment for dampening and eventually decided to use the Eddie Dow type damper rods that I bought from Autocycle. When I bought them they came with the thinner domed cap nuts as used on the pre units and had a Acorn nut on top. I wasnt impressed with the look but ran with them anyway and they worked really well. You soon find how altering the dampening on the front can improve the ride at the rear too (and vise versa) Although I think a little tweaking might improve it further (like opening up the bleed holes by a drill size) and improve the transition between the spring compression and dampening, or rather soften it) However it works really well.

Well.. Until one of the Acorn nuts flew off when I was blasting down the bypass, and the rod dropped down. So modifications were made for them to be fitted into the proper 1968' onwards style fork nuts.

I firstly made measurements of the rod as standard, then marked up the overall length from under the nut head.

Cut the excess off and reduced the rod diameter to 5/16 in the lathe.









Both rods now will insert into the stanchions same length as the un-altered ones (total length of rod now 420mm for those interested) and I can't wait to see how they perform (especially after a bit of locktite and 5/16 CEI nut has been applied to lock against the cap nut wink ) grin


beerchug
#679750 - 01/02/17 3:24 pm Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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TR6Ray Offline
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TR6Ray  Offline
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Illinois, USA
Very nice, Allan!


'64 TR6R Plus some Twins from other countries (U.S., Germany, Japan)
#682269 - 01/22/17 8:01 am Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



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Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Thanks Ray.

I wanted to get the bike back to its clubmans trim asap, I love the riding position and the look and well I have the tank to match it now too...

So Saturday morning the bike looked like this....



I was close to getting the jetting spot on, but managed to find (have 2 sets now) an original pair of Dunstall silencers, I found this style on Mauro's A65 when I was in Italy and really liked them, they are the non reverse cone type but have the trade mark 7 circles in the outlet. These have been re-chromed before and had the Dunstall stamping polished out of them, but the chrome is a little flakey in places even now. The other pair I have are pretty beaten and battered and some nerk has cut the inlet (1" 5/8) and crushed it down to be 1.5"

I have the silencer pushed pretty far up the pipe now, I think it looks better on these Pre-OIF's (Thanks to PRT for the photo of his with the mega's) It might also alter the HP curve. However... With Factory style rear-sets I will have to use a siamese (OR TT pipes, but I doubt TT pipes will look right with the big tank!)

So now I am looking for an Original RHS down pipe, the pattern ones dont have the same lines as the originals, and as I am going to copy my original factory siamese I'd like to get it as close as possible, and make a single downpipe into a siamese type (but shorter than original wink )

How it stands currently



Unlike the pattern silencers the original Dunstalls have a second hanger bracket welded to the silencer So I will end up fitting a rod from the rear frame loop down to pick that up too. I also have some nice short reach Ace bars which may also make an apearance grin


beerchug
#688696 - 03/20/17 12:24 am Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
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Allan Gill Online sleepy
Allan Gill  Online Sleepy



Joined: May 2013
Posts: 4,450
Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
Well, the next stage to this saga made a president this weekend and work was underway!

I bought a set of downpipes off ebay which looked to have a thick wall tube, most of whats available is thinner than stock and my only reason I think why they golden so quickly. Unfortunately they wouldn't have fitted without modification even if I wanted them too facepalm. However, I had already had them stripped of their new shiny chrome and ready for chopping apart.

I had my original factory 2-1 to make as close to copy as I could. So a lot of reference photos, lots of chopping and lots of welding was carried out. I pretty much wasted the Saturday as I really wanted to heat the pipe to add/correct the bends. However the Oxy-Propane setup wasn't usable and I had a much better idea! Cutting the pipe in certain places meant I could spread it bit by bit (bigger the bend the more the cuts) and re-weld. when sanded back it was virtually invisible to change.

So this is what the original looked like from the side:
[Linked Image]

Followed by mine, it still required work after the hanger mount at this point:
[Linked Image]

At this point whilst the appearance from the front looked near identical, the pipe came much closer to the frame at the taped end. so a correction was added to kick the pipe outwards after the lug, and then back in again so that the silencer didn't stick outwards but kept tucked in with the frame (being cone shaped it would look out of place very quickly


Original from the front:
[Linked Image]

Original showing split, and weld technique:
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Most of the visible weld would have been polished before chroming, but I think that look is great, naturally I blended the welds on mine where there shouldn't be any!


My build from the front:
[Linked Image]

The Siamese bend being made up, unfortunately I haven't a piece of pre bent pipe which I could have attached as an all in one piece, so chop out the bad and put in a bit of good

[Linked Image]


It looks a little angular there between the join but some sanding later and it starts to come good.

Complete frontal shot to check visual balance:

[Linked Image]

Bracing tube goes in! fitted as one piece to ensure correct alignment, then cut in two then shortened:
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

The old girl after a quick run, at this point I hadn't added a proper slide in section between the two pipes (used a pinch clamp for this) Still need to make a decent/rugged silencer bracket and add silencer clamp. Its using a step up adapter at the moment, but I will enlarge the pipe to take up the space and make a more satisfactory appearance

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

I'm looking at getting it ceramic coated in "Volcano Black" which is like a satin black. but meantime I might just spray them black and see what I think of the appearance as I may have them chromed again.

Running results:
So far so good, seems to have a lot more bite and torque than the standard setup, but will require some re-jetting. Re-jet because its a mega, and the extra grunt because the silencer is in a better placed position (from memory the tuned length is 26 inch from the valve. I haven't measured this setup, but it seems to work well with the cam.


beerchug
#688756 - 03/20/17 1:34 pm Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,417
GrandPaul Online content
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GrandPaul  Online Content
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Laredo (South) Texas
Very nice work. This is one MEGA thread!


GrandPaul (does not use emoticons)
Author of the book "Old Bikes"
Too many bikes to list, mostly Triumph & Norton, some BSA & European
"The Iron in your blood should be Vintage"
#688851 - 03/21/17 12:21 pm Re: Lightning Restoration [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 396
pushrod tom Online content
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pushrod tom  Online Content
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new jersey usa
That's a great look Allan. I love the tank! Sometimes I dream about putting the Hornet back to a Hornet. Not quite yet though.

PS It's hard to beat the Siamese for anything but top end power. I have pretty much tried 'em all smile

Last edited by pushrod tom; 03/21/17 12:24 pm.
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