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#683661 - 02/04/17 11:43 am Any 1970 TR6C owners out there?  
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Wally Balden Online content
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I am trying to finish my 7 year old project - 1970 TR6C and am trying to nail down some of the small details. Have searched high and low for information but still missing a few details. If anyone is an expert or has a stock 1970 TR6C i would be interested in talking. Thanks.

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#683663 - 02/04/17 11:57 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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I have 2 1969 tr6c's. They pretty much the same except for tank color I believe.

#683686 - 02/04/17 3:28 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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It would help if you go ahead and post your questions...


GrandPaul (does not use emoticons)
Author of the book "Old Bikes"
Too many bikes to list, mostly Triumph & Norton, some BSA & European
"The Iron in your blood should be Vintage"
#683704 - 02/04/17 6:21 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: GrandPaul]  
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Looking for a few things as well as some pics - if anyone has any. Looking for the correct kill switch for my 70. See a few options. Not sure which is correct.

Was left grip cut to accommodate the horn switch? Saw this in the parts book. Also, is correct horn switch bolted onto the handlebar - i have seen some pics as well as the part itself that looks like the handlebar was drilled to directly tap the mounting screws.

Just need pics in general as I am trying to take back to stock from PO. Lots of little things done differently on the TR6C.

#683714 - 02/04/17 7:54 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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I have a 70 TR6C in the CD production range. See also my earlier post on TR6C Production 1967-70. As well as the colour there is the separate front engine mount arrangement and there are three different types of grab rail. Late 1969 production has all chrome, 1970 up to about July had black with a chrome top loop and later up to end of production in Sep (KD) had a similar one but with reflector disc mounts added. These are all under the same part number and there is a separate thread about this. Page 138 of the Gaylin Restoration Guide book shows the kill switch quite well and these are still available. Depending on when yours was made, it could have grey or black faced speedo (black from about Mar/April 70 - CD/DD code). I believe the horn push should be screwed on, although similar clamp on ones are also available. Note that machines made in Sep 69 & Sep 70 have duplicated codes (KD) for early & late production.

Last edited by tiger_cub; 02/04/17 7:58 pm.

1970 TR6C
1972 TR6C
#683715 - 02/04/17 7:54 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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KADUTZ Offline
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Originally Posted By Wally Balden
Looking for a few things as well as some pics - if anyone has any. Looking for the correct kill switch for my 70. See a few options. Not sure which is correct.

Was left grip cut to accommodate the horn switch? Saw this in the parts book. Also, is correct horn switch bolted onto the handlebar - i have seen some pics as well as the part itself that looks like the handlebar was drilled to directly tap the mounting screws.

Just need pics in general as I am trying to take back to stock from PO. Lots of little things done differently on the TR6C.



Grip was cut

Switch was screwed to bars

Kill switch part number is in parts list

K


1970 T120RT
1978 T140V
#683726 - 02/04/17 9:16 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Grip was cut, horn switch screwed into handle bars. Acquired my 1969 tr6c in 1975 and that is the way it came then.

#683749 - 02/05/17 2:14 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: russrudolph]  
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Thanks for all of the advice. I need to do a little more homework on the kill switch. I can find them without the chrome housing. Plus, I see two different styles. The one in the parts book is different from the one i see in pics for the 70.

#683775 - 02/05/17 8:43 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Hi Wally,

Originally Posted By Wally Balden
kill switch.
I see two different styles.

Again risking telling you something you know already, there were two different types - ET and 'normal ignition'; when you press the button:-

. the ET one does something like connect the two points wires together (so the ignition LT circuit isn't broken, so the HT sparks stop);

. the 'normal ignition' one simply breaks the coils supply from the ignition switch.

Originally Posted By Wally Balden
The one in the parts book is different from the one i see in pics for the 70.

Triumph (and BSA) regularly continued to use parts book picture printing plates for years after real details had changed - e.g. the '70 parts book pictures still show the earlier 'twist' dipswitch by the 'C' headlamp, just it isn't listed on the following pages.

Lucas might've changed the kill switch style by 1970 but no-one was about to sanction the expense of changing the parts book picture printing plate just for some minor detail changes, particularly when it was all going to change again for '71.

Hth.

Regards,

#683778 - 02/05/17 9:03 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Stuart]  
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desco Online content
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Neither the parts book nor the shop manual are a bible. They are merely a guide.


1968 T120R
1972 T120RV
Any advice given is without a warranty expressed or implied.
#683790 - 02/05/17 11:08 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: desco]  
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Thanks for those tips. I have been using the parts book as my bible, as well as other pics I have taken off of the web. My challenge is finding the "right" way to put this back together and that has been daunting. That is why I was looking for anyone with a stock bike to provide guidance. It's nice to have this knowledge base to tap into.

#683875 - 02/06/17 12:11 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Kill switch used on the 70 was 35835 used in a chromed housing with a couple of funky 'straps'. If I remember correctly there was a short lead with grey covering that plugged into the harness. If you are going to look at pictures also look at T100C pictures. Electrical set up on both TR6C/T100C are the same many other parts are common. 35835 is a 'button' switch that resembles the OIF rear brake light switch. I may see a friend this week that has owned one for the last 25 years or so. Any other questions or details?

K


1970 T120RT
1978 T140V
#683883 - 02/06/17 2:43 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Hi Wally, I found 2 photos (all I have is the 2 left & right views). My old 100% original from new 1970 TR6C CD45532. I think this would be build date of March 1970. Photos taken early 1971.

It had a black face speedo. Grab handle was black with chrome upper loop. Had gusset on back side of loop with a round hole 3/8ish in dia. The gusset is black & welded to black part of handle. Chrome loop fits into the black part. The hole is vacant. Rear side reflectors are on tail lamp unit.

Choke lever is on right bar near throttle.

Inwards of choke lever is kill button. Chrome body with black button top. I cannot tell for sure if the kill button is held with strap or not, but it looks like a strap. Almost certain on that. None of the kill switches shown on eBay look correct. The kill switch is huge tall chrome with black button on top.

Left bar has dip switch/horn switch. Grip is not notched for dip switch. Photo is not that clear on horn/dip switch mounting. It looks like might?? have a band of some sort wrap around the bar, but not clear enough to say. Switch appears to be all the way against clutch lever perch. Again, detail of photo is not that clear to be certain on clamping of either kill button or dip switch.

The wires to switches did not have chrome clips. Had rubber ties of sorts which didn't hold. I installed zip ties.

My bike did not have ET ignition. Just had regular alternator, battery, points, condensers coils.

The horn hangs down longwise below front of gas tank with connectors on right side of bike.

Came with 18t front sprocket. I changed to 20t front & had to remove case saver as chain hit it w/20t installed. I also had skid plate on/off as at the time I felt it gave better cooling without skid plate. I used bike to commute to work every day on freeway. 50 miles a day & also lots of "cow trailing". Was best riding bike I ever owned. 100% reliable & very trouble free. Cruised at 70 mph 2 up for hours on end. Smoothest Triumph I've ever ridden.

Looked at page 138 kill button (p118 in first version)in Galyin's book. That is what my photo shows. It is gigantic chrome with black button on top. The whole kill switch is huge. Again, not shown in eBay. eBay ones don't look correct.

In his new version book p131 shows a horn button where bar was drilled & tapped for screws. My photo doesn't seem to look quite like that. Mine had long dip lever & horn button is more pointing toward sky. It looks like it has a skinny strap around bar securing it, but again, just can't be sure.
Parts book shows the bar drilled & tapped so I'm no help there.

My bike came from Nelson Brothers Triumph Oakland CA.

I had to use strong magnifier to examine handle bar switches. The left side was harder to see. It certainly looks like grip was not notched though. I don't think scanning would help you at all since details would be worse.
Don


1973 Tiger 750
#683897 - 02/06/17 7:08 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: TR7RVMan]  
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Stuart Online content
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Hi Wally,

Originally Posted By TR7RVMan
kill button. Chrome body with black button top. I cannot tell for sure if the kill button is held with strap or not, but it looks like a strap. Almost certain on that. None of the kill switches shown on Ebay look correct. The kill switch is huge tall chrome with black button on top.

The kill button pictured in the 1970 650 parts book is the ET kill button - you can confirm this by looking at '67 and earlier 650 parts books, when the TR6C (and T120TT/C) had ET; however , in the '70 650 parts book, the kill button is numbered "35835" as "Kadutz" has posted, which is the kill button for 'normal DC'. However, afaik the 35835 button doesn't look like the the picture in the '70 650 parts book, the one on my '70 T150 looks like the picture in the '70 T150 parts book, on pages 74/75, including the two "Clip[s]" that hook into the "Cup" (switch body?) secured by the screw-'n'-nut under the handlebar at the Clips' other ends; the T150 book also gives the D1937 (60-1937) Triumph part number.

Originally Posted By TR7RVMan
Left bar has dip switch/horn switch.
Photo is not that clear on horn/dip switch mounting. It looks like might?? have a band of some sort wrap around the bar, but not clear enough to say. Switch appears to be all the way against clutch lever perch.

Switch is standard combined horn-'n'-dip that had been used on standard models for several years; sits on a thick shaped rubber pad all attached by a screw above and below that screw into holes in the handlebar. There's been some cool argument in the past about whether 'bar holes were tapped or not, all the ones I've come across were tapped 6-32.

Otoh, clutch lever is the standard AMAL one that just clamps around the 'bar, so moveable towards/away from switch as desired by owner.

Originally Posted By TR7RVMan
Grip is not notched for dip switch.

Mmmm ... original standard '70 "Gran Turismo" "Made In Italy" grips would have to be, otherwise the switch lever fouls the widest part of the grip.

Otoh, if the grip on Don's bike had been replaced by the similar-looking AMAL (standard certainly on Triumphs into '68), the "widest part" of the grip is smaller and the dipswitch lever clears it.

Digressing slightly, if you haven't discovered this already, "original standard" Gran Turismo grips haven't been available for many years, except second-hand. Current new ones are either shorter or longer than originals:-

. "shorter" don't need the widest part of the grip cutting to clear the dipswitch lever as they don't reach that far; however, if you use the corresponding twistgrip one, you have to shorten the drum or some of it by the twistgrip "Body" will still be exposed when it's all reassembled.

. "longer" (marked "Beston" and/or "Grand Touring") need the widest part cutting to clear the dipswitch lever and can also place your left hand where the dipswitch lever digs into the soft skin between the thumb and forefinger cry (even with gloves on frown ); the twistgrip one - being longer than the drum - can allow the exposed part of the grip inside to drag on the end of the handlebar, affecting throttle closing. frown

Originally Posted By TR7RVMan
My bike did not have ET ignition.

Last Triumphs with ET were '67?

Hth.

Regards,

#683910 - 02/06/17 9:43 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Back on the mainland!


'77 T140J
"Vintage Bike". What's in your garage?

"The paying customer is always right."

Fitting round pegs into square holes since 1961...
#683929 - 02/06/17 12:24 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Wally Balden Online content
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Thanks for all of the info. Very much appreciated. I think one of my challenges is finding the chrome housing for the kill switch. I can find the kill switch itself, but no luck so far with the housing.

Another issue I may have is that I have the wiring harness for the T120 of the same year - which I am guessing does not have wires for the kill switch. I bought the wrong one years ago and not even sure there is a wiring harness specifically for the TR6C.

Kadutz - not sure i need anything more other than pics. I know I am getting anal here, but even trying to figure out which way a bolt goes in and which way certain items are facing - horn, grips (left side with cutout) etc. Always seems to be something.

#683931 - 02/06/17 12:48 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Boomer Online content
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The kill switch housing can be found, usually used, digging deep at swap meets, but the funky straps are usually missing or parts thereof.


Bill B...


Boomer
#683941 - 02/06/17 1:48 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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KADUTZ Offline
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Originally Posted By Wally Balden
Thanks for all of the info. Very much appreciated. I think one of my challenges is finding the chrome housing for the kill switch. I can find the kill switch itself, but no luck so far with the housing.

Another issue I may have is that I have the wiring harness for the T120 of the same year - which I am guessing does not have wires for the kill switch. I bought the wrong one years ago and not even sure there is a wiring harness specifically for the TR6C.

Kadutz - not sure i need anything more other than pics. I know I am getting anal here, but even trying to figure out which way a bolt goes in and which way certain items are facing - horn, grips (left side with cutout) etc. Always seems to be something.


#1 You have the wrong harness there IS a difference (among others headlamp area and plug in for kill switch)
You want a part #54957096 used on TR6C & T100C 1970 only
You have a part #54957095 used on T120R,TR6R, and T100R UK/General Export used a different Loom
Difference between 1969 and 1970 looms 1970 wires for turn signals.

#2 97-2259 kill switch housing (1)
. 97-2034 retention strap (2)
. 97-0745 2BA hex nut (1)
. 97-0687 2BAx5/16 sltd chr scrw(1)
. GS-299 3/16 serr washer (1)
These are items need for kill in addition to switch itself.
All bits are shown in Current British Only online catalog

#3 Suggestion don't get to anal or you will go nuts and actually enjoy the gondola ride in the Arch. crazy

K


1970 T120RT
1978 T140V
#683956 - 02/06/17 3:44 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Hi I don't know the brand of grips my bike had on it. I do recall the dip lever being hard to reach. I think the grip tended to block it. So maybe the grip had be replaced.

I did not buy bike new. It was a trade in at Harley Davidson of Oakland. I was a tech there. We were down the street a short way from Nelson Brothers. The bike only had about 1500 miles on it. The owner really wanted a Sporster. He didn't want to pay the price. He bought the TR6C then got buyers remorse after his friend got a Sporster. He traded in Triumph. I got to know the fellow. He only had bike a few months. He gave me original owners manual & work shop manual he got at time of purchase. Of course he had to buy workshop manual. I still have both. Kept them when I foolishly sold bike.

I quizzed original owner on history. He made no modifications. He took a spill when riding off road & dented oil tank slightly & scuffed right grip & brake lever. I replaced those & repaired dent. Got a new oil level decal. I do not recall replacing left grip, but that was a long time ago.
Don


1973 Tiger 750
#683966 - 02/06/17 4:59 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: TR7RVMan]  
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Irish Swede Online content
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Did the guy who traded your Triumph for a Sportster ever regain his sanity?
I'll bet he not only paid the price for a Sportster, but kept on "paying the price" as long as he owned it.

I rode a few of them. Riding a Sportster is it's own punishment.

#683970 - 02/06/17 5:34 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: KADUTZ]  
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Wally Balden Online content
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Thanks for all of the detailed information. I ordered the new wiring harness and all of the parts for the kill switch.

When I tell my wife something is driving me crazy she says that is not a far drive. I always correct my wife when she says she is going crazy by saying "not crazy, crazier". She loves when I do that.

#684012 - 02/06/17 11:54 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Originally Posted By Wally Balden
Thanks for all of the detailed information. I ordered the new wiring harness and all of the parts for the kill switch.

When I tell my wife something is driving me crazy she says that is not a far drive. I always correct my wife when she says she is going crazy by saying "not crazy, crazier". She loves when I do that.


OK 1st project for the evening is to determine if Anal-Retentive hyphenated or not.
#2 If not why not and if it is why is it.
#3 which letters are Upper Case and which are lower case and why. Just something to do while waiting for parts.

As far as which way bolts go? From the parts book two motor mount bolts shows insertion from T/S with nuts on D/S. The third is shown as a stud with nuts on both sides. Bet you got three bolts on yours. How about the fastener retaining the front and rear frames sections up by the seat. You got a stud or a bolt there? Just so you are aware 70 was a long production year and there were a number of running changes.

If you are familiar with www.classicbike.biz you can look at the Triumph Brochures area to see the factory sales brochures. But be careful using Factory Brochures some were "doctored" by the Advert/Sales Dept. In the case of the three 70 brochures (T120R,TR6R & TR6C)the best is the T120. For a few details on your bike look at the TR6R brochure. The close p of the speedometer is actually a TR6C photo not a TR6R. Also note the close up below of the Headlamp Ignition switch is from the T120. Blow up the picture and look at the reflection of the fender it is red. Go to the TR6C brochure and you get a very good shot of the horn/dipper switch mounting. It doesn't matter what model bike its from. I believe they were all mounted in the same position.

Another excellent place for detail info is period road tests in magazines or reprints. Just wondering about what part of the year your bike was built. Would you be willing to share the first part of the VIN like AD38xxx?


K


1970 T120RT
1978 T140V
#684017 - 02/07/17 1:17 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: TR7RVMan]  
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Stuart Online content
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Hi Wally,

Originally Posted By Wally Balden
Another issue I may have is that I have the wiring harness for the T120 of the same year - which I am guessing does not have wires for the kill switch.

Nothing special there:-

. bear in mind that there were as few differences as possible in harnesses, so costs could be limited by using the same harness on different models, or at least the same sub-harnesses - e.g. a '70 triple harness is hardly different from a '70 twin harness, but different sub-harnesses in the main harness for connecting coils with points, condensers, etc.;

. the ignition coils' -ve terminals were supplied by a White (or White/Blue) wire from the switched side of the ignition switch (Lucas standard that all White(/Blue) wires are only 'live' when the ignition key switch is 'on');

. to supply all the different components that are 'live' when the ignition switch is on, a single White(/Blue) wire runs from the ignition switch to a multi-way snap connector junction with all the individual components' White wires;

. instead of the coils' White wire being connected to this junction, one of the kill button's wires is; the kill button's other wire is connected just to the coils' White wire;

. so power to the coils runs battery -ve -> ignition switch -> White wires' junction -> kill button -> coils; when the button is pressed, it cuts the power just to the coils. bigt

Originally Posted By Wally Balden
not even sure there is a wiring harness specifically for the TR6C.

As "Kadutz" posted, there is; one difference from a T120/TR6R harness is it doesn't have the tiny ring terminals on the Brown/Blue and one Brown/White wires for connecting to the ammeter terminals.

Originally Posted By TR7RVMan
grips

http://www.britbike.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=532894#Post532894

Originally Posted By TR7RVMan
I do not recall replacing left grip, but that was a long time ago.

John Healy and others who were dealers 'back in the day' have posted before that parts were often changed before a bike went on display/to a customer.

Hth.

Regards,

#684052 - 02/07/17 11:36 am Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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Why didn't i find you guys about 5 years ago??? An incredible resource of information. All responses are greatly appreciated. I love all of the detail. I will post the VIN number after I get home tonight.

#684106 - 02/07/17 6:04 pm Re: Any 1970 TR6C owners out there? [Re: Wally Balden]  
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in my house
Wally

Not the whole VIN just the first part so we have an idea where you bike was in the VIN Food Chain so to speak.

K


1970 T120RT
1978 T140V
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