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Lucas E3HB Dynamo #654837
05/30/16 3:14 pm
05/30/16 3:14 pm
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 35
Windsor, Berkshire, UK
S
Sarujima Offline OP
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Sarujima  Offline OP
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Windsor, Berkshire, UK
Hi All,
My 1937 Model S is fitted with a Lucas E3HB dynamo - I've got a couple of questions that I hope you chaps can help with.

Firstly is there a part number for the points assembly on the end of the Dynamo? (and does anybody know if they're still available?)

Secondly - In addition to the D & F terminals there's also a "WL" terminal which I think stands for "Warning Light" - Does this terminal just lead to a warning light and then on to earth, or is there some additional circuitry required?

Thanks in advance,

Stu

Last edited by Sarujima; 05/30/16 3:32 pm.
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Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #654852
05/30/16 5:40 pm
05/30/16 5:40 pm
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 897
newcastle australia
trevinoz Offline
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newcastle australia
Firstly the points, I would presume that they are not available as I have been looking for a complete set including mounting plate and contact arm for some time.
The warning light is connected to the ignition switch on one side and to the "WL" terminal on the other.
When the ignition is switched on, current flows from the switch to the lamp and then to the generator and to earth via the armature.
As the voltage rises to the set value, the lamp will be extinguished as the same voltage will be present on each side of the filament.

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #654861
05/30/16 6:45 pm
05/30/16 6:45 pm
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,143
Oztralia
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Rohan Online content
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Someone will likely have a box full of those points,
its 'only' a matter of finding him/her ?

Those engine speed generators only had a max rated output of 30w,
so don't use too large a warning light !
I didn't know about the WL warning light stuff - but where did the warning light live ?

Thats a nice new refurbed looking unit - who did that ?
Cheers.

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Rohan] #654880
05/30/16 8:51 pm
05/30/16 8:51 pm
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,118
Ottawa, Canada
gREgg-K Offline

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Originally Posted By Rohan
Someone will likely have a box full of those points,
its 'only' a matter of finding him/her ?<SNIP>

In case someone comes up with a box of these contact breakers, or even just the points, here are some Lucas numbers to help you identify them:
- Contact breaker complete: 470117
- Replacement points: 470187

These are listed for the 1937 model S, which used the E3HB. The 1938 and 1938 models used a different varian6 of the E3HB, for which Lucas did not list a complete breaker assembly, though it did use the same replacement points as the 1937.

Hope this is of help,
.. Gregg


Spyder Integrated Technologies
Lucas, BTH, & Miller Magneto & Dynamo Restoration
SMITHS Chronometric Restoration
magneto@spyder-it.com
Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #654884
05/30/16 9:08 pm
05/30/16 9:08 pm
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,143
Oztralia
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Rohan Online content
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Burton Bikebits list those 470187 points, for 4.20

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Rohan] #654886
05/30/16 9:12 pm
05/30/16 9:12 pm
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,118
Ottawa, Canada
gREgg-K Offline

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Originally Posted By Rohan
Burton Bikebits list those 470187 points, for 4.20

Sounds like Stu's problem is solved!
.. Gregg


Spyder Integrated Technologies
Lucas, BTH, & Miller Magneto & Dynamo Restoration
SMITHS Chronometric Restoration
magneto@spyder-it.com
Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: gREgg-K] #654976
05/31/16 2:37 pm
05/31/16 2:37 pm
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 109
Ontario Canada
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T.W.Craig Offline
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Ontario Canada
Warning light was in red dot ammeter in tank panel and some were mounted onto generator in a small box.Tom

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655100
06/01/16 10:59 am
06/01/16 10:59 am
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 35
Windsor, Berkshire, UK
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Sarujima Offline OP
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Sarujima  Offline OP
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Windsor, Berkshire, UK
Thanks for the responses gents. The Dynamo was refurbished by Donald Day of DH Day. Took him 3 months but it looks like he's done a nice job. The solid state alternator was fried so I've ordered a DVR2 which arrived this morning.

Thanks for the tip on the warning light and the details for the points. I've had to make a replacement tank panel so I might put a warning light in there between the ammeter and the light switch - I know I've got the wrong ammeter frown



The bike is coming along pretty nicely (imho) - trying not to make it look too pristine.



All the best Stu


Last edited by Sarujima; 06/01/16 11:11 am.
Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655158
06/01/16 5:29 pm
06/01/16 5:29 pm
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 897
newcastle australia
trevinoz Offline
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newcastle australia
Stu, you have the wrong switch also. You need one with a key in the centre for ignition.
Lucas PLC6, I think is the type, without looking at the book.
I have overhauled a few of those generators for a bloke here in Australia and he just fits a small warning light in the panel.

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: trevinoz] #655251
06/02/16 7:29 am
06/02/16 7:29 am
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 35
Windsor, Berkshire, UK
S
Sarujima Offline OP
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Windsor, Berkshire, UK
Originally Posted By trevinoz
Stu, you have the wrong switch also.


Bugger smile ....

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655292
06/02/16 2:59 pm
06/02/16 2:59 pm
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 35
Windsor, Berkshire, UK
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Sarujima Offline OP
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Further to above gents.... I'm planning to swap out the condenser too. Is there a specification that I should be looking for? The condenser that's already in place has no markings and I'm keen not to guess and get it wrong .....

Ta

Stu

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655306
06/02/16 4:10 pm
06/02/16 4:10 pm
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,118
Ottawa, Canada
gREgg-K Offline

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Originally Posted By Sarujima
Further to above gents.... I'm planning to swap out the condenser too. Is there a specification that I should be looking for? The condenser that's already in place has no markings and I'm keen not to guess and get it wrong .....

Ta

Stu

Stu, since you have battery and coil ignition, you have a lot of latitude in what you can use to replace the original condenser. IT does not have to go in the Bakelite cap, and you can connect it from earth to the points lead at the coil if you like.

Almost any old-school automotive condenser will work, and the capacitance is usually 0.2uF (microFarads)

... Gregg


Spyder Integrated Technologies
Lucas, BTH, & Miller Magneto & Dynamo Restoration
SMITHS Chronometric Restoration
magneto@spyder-it.com
Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655318
06/02/16 5:19 pm
06/02/16 5:19 pm
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 897
newcastle australia
trevinoz Offline
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newcastle australia
Stu, as Gregg says, almost any condenser will work.
I just unsweat the old one and fit one from an auto spares retailer.
I sweat it in and connect to the original point with a small screw and nut.
Keeps the original look.

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655337
06/02/16 7:40 pm
06/02/16 7:40 pm
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,143
Oztralia
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Rohan Online content
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And, being totally precise here, almost the entire world has standardized on 0.22 microfarad automotive condensors.
You'd probably have trouble find a 0.2

Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Rohan] #655341
06/02/16 8:35 pm
06/02/16 8:35 pm
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,118
Ottawa, Canada
gREgg-K Offline

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Originally Posted By Rohan
And, being totally precise here, almost the entire world has standardized on 0.22 microfarad automotive condensors.
You'd probably have trouble find a 0.2

Perhaps down under, Rohan, but I have 3 (new/unused) automotive condensers in stock currently. These are part number G120P made by BWD, and while their capacitance is not marked ... I measured them just now with my 5 digit Agilent DMM, they come up as being 0.1940, 0.1950 and 0.1965 uFarad.

I'll concede that general purpose capacitors made for electronics have standardized on 220 nFarad (0.22 uF) for many years, but for this automotive application it really does not matter whether they are 0.2 or 0.22 uF ... but yes, 0.2 uF is standard issue for automotive applications, at least in North America.

.. Gregg


Spyder Integrated Technologies
Lucas, BTH, & Miller Magneto & Dynamo Restoration
SMITHS Chronometric Restoration
magneto@spyder-it.com
Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655358
06/02/16 10:56 pm
06/02/16 10:56 pm
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,143
Oztralia
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Rohan Online content
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Oztralia
While I'd agree with most of that Gregg, and condensors may only be a nominal value and don't need to be a precise number, I've had both Ford and GM engined vehicles (with points ignition) and they had 0.22 mfd condensors.

The std Lucas condensor for auto ignitions is 0.22 mfd too.
Again this may only be a nominal stamped value.
Maybe you get 10% less with modern ones (!!).


Re: Lucas E3HB Dynamo [Re: Sarujima] #655387
06/03/16 8:56 am
06/03/16 8:56 am
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 35
Windsor, Berkshire, UK
S
Sarujima Offline OP
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Windsor, Berkshire, UK
Thanks chaps ... I'll just crack on and see what happens.

Stu



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