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#6296 - 12/06/05 12:17 pm update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
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damnyankonit  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
michigan usa
well I am having my wife make a site with the bike photo album for all to see. It will be done soon. The filters were all plugged up and in need of cleaning. Brother in-law is blasting the frame for paint prep so all is getting pulled. Motor is now on bench. Primary cover was warped and resurficed gasket edge along with 2 cracks fixed. Kick start gear assembly is messed up spring broke... wiring looks somewhat like a spagetti factory. all in all seems to be in good condition just has been neglected for a long time. Pod your input was great and you hit everything on the head so far. manual has been ordered should be here soon. I am excited to have the pic web site for you all, need her help though not good at pc's, soon!!! want new rear fender chrome any ideas cost pleasing? thanks again talk to you all soon

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#6297 - 12/06/05 1:30 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,949
Rich B Online happy
Rich B  Online Happy



Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,949
Stone Creek OH USA
Be careful on blasting that wet frame. You don't want ANY grit at all in the backbone. IT will bite you later.

Your better off taking a wet frame to a radiator shop and sink a tale of woe about a contaminated oil tank that needs boiled out. Definitely keeps the grit out that way.


Life is too short to drink cheap, bad beer.
#6298 - 12/06/05 2:12 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
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damnyankonit  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
michigan usa
good advice will do. plan on sealing with gaskets and gasket maker then doing several flushes with apart. my brother in laws machine shop makes airplane parts and they have the ness... solvents to clean and soak after as well. his work does not allow mistakes however one grain of sand would do it. Do you know where online i could get a "cheap oil filter kit?

#6299 - 12/06/05 10:37 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,871
Mr Mike Offline
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Mr Mike  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,871
Cape Carteret, NC
Ed V sells HD cannisters that work nicely mounted on the rear engine mounting brackets. I am not familiar with the OIF A bikes but it works on the OIF b50 and the pre OIF A bikes. There is a writeup on the Piled Arms site. MAP also sells an aftermarket filter that others like. i think $45 for the HD type and $75 for the MAP, but don't wuote me. I prefer the HD type, but do put a filter on.

Mr Mike

#6300 - 12/06/05 10:56 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
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damnyankonit  Offline
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Posts: 48
michigan usa
thanks mike what is the difference between hd and map?

#6301 - 12/07/05 1:13 am Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Aug 2001
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Rich B Online happy
Rich B  Online Happy



Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,949
Stone Creek OH USA
Don't forget to tightly seal the cap, suction line, return line and breather line. Blasting any wet frame scares me. I do the radiator shop thing.

MAP makes a filter unit specific for the wet frame. Has the ports pointed in the right directions. Probably more geared towards the wet frame Triumphs, it doesn't stand out when installed. Mounts behind the engine on the RH side under the air box. I have pretty well settled on the MAP style for all my bikes, that way I only have to have 1 cartridge in the garage.


Life is too short to drink cheap, bad beer.
#6302 - 12/07/05 3:47 am Re: update on 1971 lightning  
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drp Offline
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drp  Offline
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Posts: 554
west central ohio where all be...
Plastic media blsting is a heck of a lot safer but you will still have to sand off the rust.

When I blasted my frame I sealed up the frame like Rich suggested. However after I finished blasting my wet frame I bought a engine cleaning wand from Harbor Freight for $9.00 that had a venturi port for solvent, put a piece of garden hose on the end and shoved it up the top tube as far as possible. Then I ran a supply line from the can to the gun and a return line from the lowest port on the frame back to the can and circulated solvent through the frame. I left the sump plate and filter on the frame and periodically removed it. The junk I collected on the screen was scary! I repeated this until the kerosene was "crap free" and the last few times I drained the frame into some paint filters and made sure there was no residue. After the bike was back together I put on a MAP filter.

Make sure you check your fork stops for wear before painting.

Dave

#6303 - 12/07/05 6:22 am Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
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damnyankonit  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
michigan usa
hey god ideas from all ends. I say "sand blasting" but it actually is plastic media. its a whole room thing u can put a jet motor of a 747 in there. I do like the idea of filter for running reasons. but if it looks cool i dont mind seein it. I think the beuty of a custom/classic is the neatness and caring work aspect. wanna see all ma shhtuff pumpin and spinnin and well you all get it. thanks again all , wifey is slow with doin the pic thing. our pc has a bad usb port so she takes it to work.
p.s. liked the hose idea, will do on my own then i will def no its purtty! thanks, andy.

#6304 - 12/08/05 1:07 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 219
Whisper Offline
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Whisper  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 219
Cape Town, South Africa
There is a beautiful return line filter available from British Only for O.I.F.
It fits out of sight in the bottom of the frame, replacing the useless mesh filter.
Aluminium finned housing at bottom to cool oil.
Looks and works marvellous.
Whisper

#6305 - 12/08/05 1:47 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,871
Mr Mike Offline
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Mr Mike  Offline
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Posts: 3,871
Cape Carteret, NC
Damnyankonit,
The HD filter cannister mounts to the rear of the engine support brackets and the inlet and outlet are right where they need to be for easy plumbing. I can send you a pic of the mounting if you give me an e-mail. I haven't figured out how to post them on this site.

Mr Mike

#6306 - 12/08/05 2:07 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,145
Vox Teardrop Offline
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Vox Teardrop  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,145
Indy
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr Mike:
Damnyankonit,
The HD filter cannister mounts to the rear of the engine support brackets and the inlet and outlet are right where they need to be for easy plumbing. I can send you a pic of the mounting if you give me an e-mail. I haven't figured out how to post them on this site.

Mr Mike
Very simple. Open a free account with photobucket.com, upload your photo there and then copy the entire line that has an [img] tag in the beginning and paste it here.


95' Triumph Speed Triple
72' Triumph T120
64' BSA Lightning Rocket
#6307 - 12/09/05 5:14 am Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
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damnyankonit  Offline
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Posts: 48
michigan usa
well idid the photobucket thing and here is a [url=linkhttp://photobucket.com/albums/c83/damnyankonit/?sc=1&multi=7]linkhttp://photobucket.com/albums/c83/damnyankonit/?sc=1&multi=7[/url]
i am not sure at this point if all is gonna work great w/ it still learning. if anyone wants my email here it is "android7105@yahoo.com" i would like to see those pics mike. really havnt got any pics to do justice but things are in the works. thanks all

#6308 - 12/09/05 5:17 am Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
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damnyankonit  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
michigan usa
well trying to click ont the link didnt seem to work. tired tonight fixed four wheel on jimmy and did fluid changes its been a rough week. wanna get back on my bike work smile

#6309 - 12/09/05 12:53 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 118
Ol' 441 Offline
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Ol' 441  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 118
Colorado Springs, Colorado
http://photobucket.com/albums/c83/damnyankonit/?sc=1&multi=7

I did a "copy & paste" on this link and it worked just fine for me smile
That is quite a nice looking bike you got there and some good pictures too!!!
I like your work shop, would you care to trade me for my little spot in the back of the garage for about 27 years???

Ol' 441


Ol' 441
#6310 - 12/09/05 1:51 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,394
gavin eisler Online content
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gavin eisler  Online Content
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,394
argyll. scotland, uk
Just flicked through the pics.
First the good news, these look like newish fork stanchions( no wear visible in the pic on the front edge of the RHS leg, and the frame seems OK!
if it was mine i would just retouch the paint with some brushed black hammerite , blasting is a no no on these OIF models too risky.Still with original stands and stuff , hope you got the original ally side panel filter boxes as well, later triumph parts were plastic.
The barrells look like 71 items with the thick base flange and 3/8 unc studs, this is a good thing.
Bad news.
You may have a mixture of motors. if the bottom end cases are A65 GE (1971) then the timing cases are off an earlier pre 1970 model. The clutch operating arm is the give away, the later motors have a ball ramp set up with the clutch cable entering from the top.
Some original philips head screws suggest this was done a while ago, the threads on these should be 1/4 UNC/ whit( where they screw into the later 71 crank cases, easily changes for Socket head cap screws ( allen screws). The points and condensers suggest a Lucas 4CA breaker plate (these are crap, budget for a complete new Boyer , regulator , ignition and coils), which would make the timing side stuff pre 1968.
I would reccomend hunting down the 1971 timing cases just to make spares ordering simpler, you need the inner and the outer.

Imagine you phone for parts , the helpful guy says "make model and year?", and every time you will have to explain all this weirdness.
The worn primary case screws suggest a seriously loose or broken chain at some point.Your bike seems to have suffered above and beyond the usual bodgery and abuse.
Got the swing arm out yet?
best of luck.
Cheers
Pod


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
#6311 - 12/11/05 1:57 am Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
BritBike Forum
damnyankonit  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
michigan usa
kinda bummed you all didnt see the pics b/f taking apart it looks or looked pretty good. I am noticing and feeling that the people or persons b/f me were into just patchin things. I havnt worked on it in about a week. reallt want to but had to fix the tranny on my jimmy and of course i had the friend drop his car off for work. Thanks for the compliment on the shop ol'441 i have put alot of work into that too! took a while to orginize the parts after removal also, didnt want to lose anything. I will post a bunch of pics on tues or wends... hope all are having good holidays.
p.s. hey pod wanna fly to michigan and do some bike work?

#6312 - 12/11/05 1:25 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,394
gavin eisler Online content
BritBike Forum member
gavin eisler  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,394
argyll. scotland, uk
Hi Damnyankonit
Michigan eh! Maybe, who knows?!
Its kind of inevitible that these bikes will have mix and match parts , there are very few that survive totally stock with a service history.
Heres more tips.
You wont find a wiring diagram for this model in a Haynes manual, I use the diagram from a triumph manual covering the oil in frame t120s T140s, they are identical in loom layout and colours. New main looms and Headlamp looms are still available and easy to hook up when you are on the rebuild.
The key differences on the 71 motor from earlier motors are as follows.
Engine primary case threads are 1/4 UNC
Rocker cover is held by 5/16 fasteners, and has 2 x 5/16 UNF tapped holes in a boss for mounting the head steady.
The primary outer should have
a strobe inspection cover, 4 c/sunk 2BA screws.
2 slotted covers for clutch centre and chain tension
2 additional oil drain and level screws.


Internally the crank was machined all over,
iron body oil pump, slightly beefed up con rods.Thicker gasket faces, thick flange barrels.

Externally exhaust pipes should have a balance pipe just in front of the head, this helps top end performance and really helps keep the pipes in the head.
Not much changed in the gearbox, the cam plate got stiffening brackets.
The motor still contains a mix of cycle threads and updated UNC UNF , be careful with the nuts and bolts , bag and label to prevent confusion.

Things to budget for

later gas taps (triumph type), the push pull plungers with corks are historically interesting and very prone to leaking, the corks shrink speshally with modern gas.

Clutch parts, the centre cush drive wears and allows the whole assembly to tilt, check drive vane and end plates, drill out punched part of the thread lock to dissasemble.
new friction and drive plates , if the outer hub sprocket isnt too worn you can get by with filing the drive slots level.

Motor,
Exhaust valve guides and valves ( the guides are nearly always shagged) I like to use iron guides they last longer.
Re cut v/v seats.
New rings/ rebore if needed ( I dont like unneccessary reboring), usually new rings will do, theres only 3 oversizes ,

New big end shells.

New timing side bush. Vital for healthy oil pressure.
This is a biggy, do a search on this on the site for loads of previous. If you have a big budget and want loads of miles/ tuning, then spring for an end fed crank conversion, its good for peace of mind. My motors have these and I never worry about caning them.

Gear box
Selector forks and cam plate, cam plate punger.
if the clutch has been slipping / dragging, the selector forks will be bent or blue, the cam plate will be chewed up.

Rubber bits, oil , UV seems to eat these up
The OIF has a lot.
Front to back
Head lamp mountings.
Tank mounts centre and frame tube.
oil pipes
Battery carrier.
Seat
Steel side panel mounts.

Carbs
Viton tipped float needles, new slides , needles and needle jets.Throttle cables

Whew!
Thatll do for now.
The above is all from bitter experience, I got my OIF A65 in 1981, it was my main ride for twenty years.
Do searches here on site
for clutch centre removal.
Also I totally reccomend you read LD Bennetts tech articles on the "piled arms" site, particularly for a great explanation of the timing side crank bush debate.

hey I might have been quicker just flying out!
Cheers
Pod


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
#6313 - 12/11/05 3:30 pm Re: update on 1971 lightning  
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
damnyankonit Offline
BritBike Forum
damnyankonit  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 48
michigan usa
thanks man whew is right , I have alot of stuff such as seat, headlight mounts... I will take a pic of all of it it. Still waiting for my hatnes will read the t120 and t140 stuff. thanks
andy


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