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#526645 - 02/05/14 10:11 pm Threebond 1215  
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 4,533
Allan Gill Offline
Allan Gill  Offline



Joined: May 2013
Posts: 4,533
Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
I bought some of this for sealing the crank cases on the A65, AFAIK it is what BSA/Triumph used back in the day.

I haven't used it on the A65 yet, but I glued the Bantam primary case up with it. I always like to give at least a day for the gasket goo to do its work before adding any oil. On this occasion I decided I wanted to polish the case.

I can normally tap the case in several places with a rubber mallet to ease it from the crank case - on this occasion no such luck. I had to use a craft knife to cut all the way around the case and pull it off that way.

I'm not complaining, I am just very surprised how strong it is and it it seals as well as it holds I'll be very happy. I wondered if anyone else uses this? I believe it is very similar to Yamabond 4 (which is something we don't get in the UK)

Many thanks


beerchug
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#526647 - 02/05/14 10:37 pm Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
John Healy Online content
John Healy  Online Content


Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
Boston, Massachusetts
Yamabond #4 is a Threebond product.


#526655 - 02/05/14 11:48 pm Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,049
Tridentman Online content
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Tridentman  Online Content

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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,049
New Jersey USA
Certainly Triumph used Wellseal(or its forerunner) for the crankcase joints.
HTH

Last edited by Tridentman; 02/05/14 11:49 pm.
#526656 - 02/06/14 12:54 am Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Tridentman]  
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,549
Pete R - R.I.P. Offline
In Remembrance
Pete R - R.I.P.  Offline
In Remembrance

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,549
Vic. Australia
At one point Triumph were using Loctite master gasket on gearbox covers.I'm not sure about crankcase halves.
I use Loctite 515 or 518.It gives you plenty of time,because it won't set until you close the joint.

#526689 - 02/06/14 7:48 am Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 8,890
kommando Online content
kommando  Online Content


Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 8,890
Scotland
Pete R +1, and you don't get a bead on the inside waiting to break off and lodge in an oil pipe or pump.

#526693 - 02/06/14 8:28 am Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 4,533
Allan Gill Offline
Allan Gill  Offline



Joined: May 2013
Posts: 4,533
Rotherham - S. Yorkshire
I'm very happy with the product (so far) I normally use something like Welseal to seal crank case halves and then a layer of welseal on the gasket faces, not normally having a problem. I intend to continue to use welseal on gasket faces.


The Threebond does come out quite thick, so I remove any excess before fitting, and make my application towards the outer edge of the joint (and not the inner) Although I have considered using it in place of the cylinder base gasket (if clearance allows). When I removed the Bantam cover there was none seeping in the case, any excess on the outside dried to a rubber like finish and the mating surface areas had formed fairly hard - it wouldn't just peel off like you 2.99 silicone gasket glues.


(I guess this makes a change from an oil thread? laughing )


beerchug
#526704 - 02/06/14 9:49 am Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
John Healy Online content
John Healy  Online Content


Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
Boston, Massachusetts
Threebond 1215 is one of their silicone based products. 1184 is the Yamaha, Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, Harley Bond sealant product. It is semi-hardening. They also make anerobic sealants.


#526708 - 02/06/14 9:59 am Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 101
sciadventurer Offline
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sciadventurer  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 101
NY
This product was recommended to me by Rask Cycle, PA, when I was sorting various oil leaks from my A50 Royal Star. The sealing properties are excellent and the A50 has been drop free since. Clean-up is accomplished with Toluene or lacquer thinner on a cloth. Applying the same solvents by thin brush on joints will soften the bond, penetrate gaskets and allow for easier removal.

#526711 - 02/06/14 10:49 am Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
John Healy Online content
John Healy  Online Content


Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
Boston, Massachusetts
A lot of time has been spent debating the Japanese use of the horizontal split crankcase, while the Brits doggedly kept to the vertical split. It was touted that this was the reason Japanese bikes didn't leak oil.

But look at the Honda 750 that has been touted to have led to the demise of the British motorcycle industry. Sure it had a horizontal split crankcase, but on both sides of the engine it had vertical joints. It wasn't the horizontal split crankcase, but the use of better gaskets and sealants, like the group of Threebond products (Yamabond being just one of them), that kept the oil in the engine.
Just my opinion...
John


#526714 - 02/06/14 11:54 am Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,049
Tridentman Online content
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Tridentman  Online Content

BritBike Forum member

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,049
New Jersey USA
I am sure that you are correct ,John, but I think there are possibly other contributing factors.
If you want good sealed joints on a mass produced product then the machining of everything has to be consistent and accurate.
The Japanese had the advantage of good new machine tools which achieved that.
I remember walking around the Meriden factory and marveling that some of the machine tools worked at all.
Some of them had been retrieved from the Priory Street factory in central Coventry after the Luftwaffes attentions in 1940.
And had been used flat out since then.
I am not getting into the argument about why the equipment was not replaced (short term profitability versus reinvestment in new products and machine tools etc etc) but the fact is that our Triumphs were made on equipment some of which any self respecting machine tool engineer would condemn as unusable.
Just my 2 cents worth.

#526738 - 02/06/14 1:56 pm Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
John Healy Online content
John Healy  Online Content


Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,970
Boston, Massachusetts
As was my observations on my visits to the factory. One some of the equipment the condition was even worse, and it was the skill of the workers to nudge, bend, lever that allowed anything useable to be made at all. It is actually amazing what they did with what they had. It could never be done today, as the skills are long gone. I can still remember a young lady sitting on an tree stump. The top stuffed with old seat foams and covered with a scrap of an old seat. She sat there in front of another stump assembling the nut that was captured the bracket that held the TR6C exhaust pipes together.

The auctioneer who sold of the BSA, who was an American, was amazed as a lot of the equipment he was "knocking down" pre-dated WWI. Considering the challenges the machinery held, the surfaces were not all that bad. It was the English Bull dog insistence to save a few farthings and use no gasket, or ones made from paper better suited for to absorb the fat from a pile of fish & chips. The ThreeBond will seal almost any Triumph machined joint without the need for a gasket! So it was not just the machining...

But it wasn't until the American dealers started to hold the factory to the fire, and the American distributors insisted that they abandon gasket less joints, and the likes of Wellseal for a proper gasket did things start to improve. The Triumph Corporation, (Baltimore) was actually buying American made gaskets and shipping them to the factory to be used on their bikes did the factory get the message. By then the "horse was out of the barn."


#526739 - 02/06/14 1:57 pm Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,584
Adam M. Online content
BritBike Forum member
Adam M.  Online Content
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,584
Mississauga, Ontario.
Reinvested profit was taxed, dividends weren't.

#526776 - 02/06/14 5:52 pm Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Feb 2008
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Tridentman Online content
BritBike Forum member
Tridentman  Online Content

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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,049
New Jersey USA
John, I think we agree on this one!----I must go to the quack and see if I am OK!
As I said---the machining is only one of several contributory factors.
Being screwed via the Stock Exchange to produce more profits each year via making more bikes --on equipment older than many of the workers left little time and effort to improve the product.
Sad but true.
And hindsight is good stuff in my experience--very rarely wrong!

#526808 - 02/06/14 8:33 pm Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,459
HawaiianTiger Online content
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HawaiianTiger  Online Content

BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,459
Maui Hawaii
I don't hear much about what effect having Triumph no longer winning races, particularly in circle track, had on bike sales especially where I lived in Southern California. I can clearly remember riding my Bonneville to Ascot to see Jorgy Jorgensen win on a Norton a the feeling of pride I had when going back out to the parking lot to start up my pristine Triumph. The next year, on the same bike, I returned to the parking lot a bit embarrassed to say the least. Only two Triumphs ran that night. One died almost immediately an the other circled around the track in last place and was lapped by several of the leaders.
Still I rode British bikes nearly every day, all year long from about 1972 to 1980 when nobody cared. After that things started to improve, I thought. Those bikes I was riding were becoming classics........

Another consideration concerning joint sealing is the width of the gasket surface. There are some very thin gasket surfaces on these bikes and that makes it all the more difficult to seal them.

Bill


Bikes
1974 Commando
1985 Honda Nighthawk 650
1957 Thunderbird/T110 "Flying Tiger"
Antique Fans: Loads of Emersons (Two six wingers) plus gyros and orbiters.
#526818 - 02/06/14 9:53 pm Re: Threebond 1215 [Re: Allan Gill]  
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,324
NickL Online content
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NickL  Online Content
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,324
Aus
Yes, i agree with some of the comments about the brits not investing in tooling etc. and maybe the reluctance of management to move with the times as far as the use of more modern products.
Maybe the Americans with their massive market and economy should have started to build bikes that had foot changes and overhead valves to compete with the 0% financed Japanese manufacturers.

You have got to accept any country the size of England cannot foot the bill of 2 world wars in one century and survive economically, there is little or no natural resource in the UK and it did not get rebuilt in the 20's or the 40's by gifted overseas finance.

Nick




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