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#487944 - 04/29/13 7:47 pm 68 Victor kickstand tab  
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HillbillyBarr Online content
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S.E. Ohio
Hey y'all is the tab that the kickstand bolts to brazed on? On my 68 the tab has moved so far you need a 2X4 to hold the bike right. Can I heat this tab then move it back into place? Or do I need to find a 70 kickstand and bend it in a bit? Or somethin else? Thanks, Hillbilly Barr

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#487993 - 04/30/13 1:11 am Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Peter Quick Online content
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Generally the kickstand boss that is brazed to the frame does not move. Has your whole frame twisted out with the boss? However I have seen a couple come loose and move around. If the boss is loose it would need to be re-brazed back to the frame. Easier said than done! A complete down to frame strip and then figuring out some way to cook out all the oil that is now between the boss and frame. After cleaning you can not weld the boss, it has to be brazed!

A more likely problem is that you have either a bent kick stand or where the stand meets the boss to stop moving is all worn down so the stand is moving to far and not holding the bike upright. Or probably both. The wear is probably on both the boss and inside the stand. Weld can be added in the areas that have been pounded down and then ground back until a suitable side stand position has been reached.

Best way to keep the sidestand holding the bike in its correct position is not to stand/sit on the bike with the sidestand down. Let alone trying to kick start the bike when on its stand. It wasn't designed to hold much more than the bikes weight!

Peter


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#488002 - 04/30/13 2:05 am Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Mr Mike Offline
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HBB,
The ones I have seen (side stand) are brazed and you will need someone with torch skills to re-position it and braze it.

Mr Mike

#488024 - 04/30/13 11:20 am Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Peter Quick Online content
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Mike,

Have you ever tried to melt brazing on a BSA frame enough to separate two brazed parts?

Hillbilly,

Is the kickstand "tab" loose from the frame tube? If it is not loose then I don't think re-brazing is the issue.

Peter


check out: www.bsaunitsingles.com
2500 BSA part numbers with inventory in stock just for the unit singles!
#488045 - 04/30/13 2:50 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Steve Erickson Online content
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The Northwoods... Michigan
If it is the ring/tab assembly that is loose, you can drill a small hole through the ring from one side through the other (with the tab at the correct angle), and drive in a roll pin to secure it.

Oddball sidenote; I just recently noticed that there are a couple different types of tab assemblies. My 67 VR has only a smallish segment of a ring securing the tab, where later Victor models have a full ring. Wonder how many times I've looked at that and not noticed the difference?

#488110 - 04/30/13 8:50 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: Steve Erickson]  
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I'll go out nd relook here in a second. I know not to kick or set on a britbike's side stand, this one came this way. My 69, 66,67 and 73 all set ok. As far as brazin is concerned I learned it as a kid, now 59, been a mechanic all my life even have my own partial machine shop plus I blacksmith. The tab looked to be a bit up but I'll go relook. It didn't feel loose and the clevis part of the sidestand looked ok. The 69 Shooting Star I sold it's stand was bent but this sidestand looked straight. I'll go look and see if'n the clevis part of the stand widened or what and come back. Thanks fer all the advise. Hillbilly

#488113 - 04/30/13 9:19 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Ever notice how many gas tanks have dents on the left side only? I removed the side stand and set it aside for the person who will eventually restore an original bike with unblemished tank when I'm too old to kick her over - or crash and burn. I'm good either way. Leon


October of 69-A50R
#488114 - 04/30/13 9:19 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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HillbillyBarr Online content
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Ok after lookin again I found the the through hole for the kickstand measures .430-.450 which should be aound .375-.380 I'd guess since it has a 3/8 bolt. Now I looked at the tab and it's also enlarged to .420. So it would appear both holes have enlarged. That would allow the stand to lean I guess. I think I can fix the tab by drillin it out to .500 and make a 1/2" o.d. X 3/8" i.d. bushing. Should I make the bushing outa brass or steel? But to fix the kickstand would seem a bit rougher as the alignment for both hole would have to be fairly right. Do you think I could weld up the hole a bit then put it in a vise and drill from the treaded side with a 5/16 bit in my drill press so as not to hit the threads then flip it over an drill it to 3/8"? Does this soud about right or should I try and braze around the hole and redrill instead of weldin it? I bought the bike to try and fix and sell so I want to do this right as I wouldn't want someone to think I'd pass of some sorta junk. Thanks again fer the help, Hillbilly

#488126 - 04/30/13 10:15 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Mr Mike Offline
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I have brazed a little. My father was a blacksmith in his early years and was good with a torch. If it will break free so it can be repositioned, you should be able to rebraze but I do not speak from experience. My A65 has the same problem, it leans too far on the side stand, but it least it stands up.

HBB...sounds like you have the skills. Let us know how you come out.

Mr Mike

#488132 - 04/30/13 11:16 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Gary E Online content
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I've welded up both the side stand hole and the frame lug hole and redrilled them to get the bolt a tighter fit and take the slop out of the stand. Have had to also close the gap on the side stand to remove the slop, as well as weld and file a portion of the stand crotch to restore the proper stop distance against the frame lug. And while at it welded up the flat and reshsaped it back to original at the bottom end of the stand from years of wear on the pavement.


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#488195 - 05/01/13 8:51 am Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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BSA_WM20 Online content
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The bush must be made from steel.
But the better idea would be to deposit some hard facing on the lug then machine it out to a close fit.
You will also need to clean up both the inner faces of the bracket as they will be worn tappered and ditto to the stand itself.
Use a low grade steel bolt and change it every so often as it is easier to change the bolt than repair the frame.


Bike Beesa
Trevor
#488250 - 05/01/13 4:25 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Gary E I think yer idea of weldin both holes shut on the kickstand then redrillin them together sounds better as the alignment would be correct. I really don't know why it did this as the bike's speedo says around 6,000 miles, but that could be wrong. Also the holes weren't really elongated both being darn near round. ANyway that's the path i'm takin. Can't do it today but later this week. Thanks fer all the help guys, Hillbilly

#488251 - 05/01/13 4:35 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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BSA_WM20 I've got steel on hand for a bushing. I thought about weldin up the tab's hole but the bike is pretty much together and I hate weldin on things with bearings as I've seen bearing balls destroyed by the arcing even when the weld wasn't anyway near it or in it's path. That's the reason I thought about bushin it.Also drillin out the tab to 1/2" will take care of the taper now on the tab. Thanks fer the advise on the low grade bolt. By the way should I make the bush outa hard or soft steel as I've got some drill rod and some soft 1/2" stock layin around. Hillbilly

#488255 - 05/01/13 5:27 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Tridentman Online content
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Gary says:
"I've welded up both the side stand hole and the frame lug hole and redrilled them to get the bolt a tighter fit and take the slop out of the stand. Have had to also close the gap on the side stand to remove the slop, as well as weld and file a portion of the stand crotch to restore the proper stop distance against the frame lug."
Sorry--I am pretty computer illiterate so dont know how to put part of a previous posting in a smart box.
When the side stand lug has clearance between itself and the frame lug it is tempting to squeeze the side stand lug to give a "good fit".
In fact all this does is to give a point "good fit". This point will wear quickly in use and you will then be pi**ed off because the side stand is sloppy again.
IME--dont squeeze the side stand lug. Instead make a spacer to go between the side stand lug and the frame tab to give clear movement but virtually no play.
I usually start off with a fender washer (UK-penny washer) of the right diameter and file it to suit.
Takes time with plenty of trial fits but when you have it done the stand swings great with no play---and will last a long time like that.
HTH

#488543 - 05/03/13 10:28 am Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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BSA_WM20 Online content
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I think what Trident man is trying to say is to make the bush ( hard steel ) a couple of thou bigger than the side stand itself so you clamp down on the bolt instead of pinching in the mounting.
On a lot of bikes the stand bolt is shouldered to do just this.
If you do not want to weld the frame then at least build up the worn face on the side stand itself so there is not much slop.


Bike Beesa
Trevor
#488563 - 05/03/13 1:20 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Tridentman Online content
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Thanks Trevor--but I didnt actually mean that--valid though your comments are!
My fault for not making myself clear.
I was referring to Garys comment "have had also to close the gap on the side stand----".
There is slop in the pivot location---hole in stand worn, hole in frame lug worn, bolt worn etc etc. These aspects have been covered in earlier postings by others.
I was referring to the clearance between the gap between the two sides of the side stand lug and the thickness of the frame lug.
Sometimes (rarely) it is difficult to get the stand onto the frame lug.
Much more frequently there is a gap , typically of maybe 1/16", between the inside faces of the side stand and the faces of the frame lug.
Here it is tempting to squeeze the sides of the side stand together in a vice to seemingly reduce this gap.
All that happens of course is the the outer edges of the side stand "tuning fork" are forced closer together but the inner edges stay put as they are part of the much stronger part of the lug.
If you do squeeze the tuning fork to give a good fit it wont stay like that for long as it is basically a point or at best a line contact and after little use will wear and be sloppy again.
My suggestion, which I have done many times, is to file the inside faces of the tuning fork flat and parallel and then make a spacer to give a good fit beteen the side stand lug and the frame lug. As stated I normally start off with a fender (penny) washer with the correct hole diameter for the mounting bolt and then file the thickness of the washer to give a good fit.
Hope this is a bit clearer and apologies again for not being clearer previously.
HTH

#488711 - 05/04/13 3:01 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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The parallel faces of the side atand are pretty much still parrallel with the gap bein 20 thou more'n than the thickness of the tab. I can take this up with the bush if needed. Had to wait fer the wife to wash my weldin hat from the mouse crap they decided to leave me before i can weld the stand up. I'll go out today and make the bush on the lathe. Also think instead of weldin up the sidestand I'll just drill and bush the open end with drill rod which sould give the sidestand a bit harder surface against the through bolt. Hillbilly

#488717 - 05/04/13 3:39 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Tridentman Online content
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If you only take up the 20 thou gap using the bush (presumably with the bush standing proud of the frame tab)then the ends of the bush will wear very quickly and the slop will return.
I suggest making the bush flush with the frame tab and then making a "washer"--perhaps from 20 thou shim stock and fitting that between the side stand and the frame tab.In that way the forces will be spread over a larger area and the wear rate will be lower.
HTH

#488721 - 05/04/13 4:08 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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kommando Online content
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I am with Tridentman, unless you make a flanged bush where the flange is 20thou thick the end will wear away very quickly.

#488735 - 05/04/13 5:54 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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Tridentman Online content
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If you do it with a flanged bush then the OD of the flange needs to be as large as possible(extending to the outer edges of the side stand lug).Not too easy to turn a bush with such different diameters of OD of the flange and OD of the body of the bush.
HTH

#489958 - 05/12/13 9:45 pm Re: 68 Victor kickstand tab [Re: HillbillyBarr]  
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I'll make a .020 washer. Got busy last week and couldn't git around to the 68. I plan on makin the bush and washer tomorrow and installin them. Didn't think .020 was too much slop between the tab and sidestand but I'm not always right. Thanks guys, Hillbilly


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