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Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46705
04/04/06 1:58 am
04/04/06 1:58 am
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
A
Adam M. Online content OP
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Adam M.  Online Content OP
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
I have been working on this bike all day long, installing spin on filter in the morning, sorting out Boyer unit in the afternoon and trying to install reg/rec in the evening.
This is a small unit looking exactly like Tympanium, but sold under different name, fully floated device, what means that it has 5 wires:
2 yellow going to the 1 phase alternator, red, black ( ground ) and blue ( load ).
I hoped this unit could be used with a positive ground installation, but every time I try to connect a red wire from the unit to the hot wire from a battery results in broken fuse.
Am I doing something stupid or this unit works with negative ground installation only ???

Adam M.

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Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46706
04/04/06 2:09 am
04/04/06 2:09 am
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 285
Dallas, TX
Brian_Dallas_TX Offline
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Posts: 285
Dallas, TX
The box may say if it is intended for negative ground installation only. What did you connect the load to? Disconnect the "load" and check for a short on the bike side of things. When does the fuse blow, and what size are you using?

Brian


Brian
'64 B40T Enduro Star '49 AJS 18CS
'65 A65L/R '71 BMW R75/5
'71 B25T '02 Bonnie
'63 A10 SR
'47 James ML 125
Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46707
04/04/06 2:15 am
04/04/06 2:15 am
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
A
Adam M. Online content OP
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Adam M.  Online Content OP
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
I had the "load" disconnected.
A fuse blew as soon as I touched the wires.

Adam M.

Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46708
04/04/06 2:34 am
04/04/06 2:34 am
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,348
Michigan, USA
BONZO R.I.P. Offline
In Remembrance
BONZO R.I.P.  Offline
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Posts: 3,348
Michigan, USA
Adam , You didnt specify the brand of the unit you are using , this might help if someone is familiar with them . In general , if the unit has both red and black wires , battery polarity shouldnt be an issue as the case is probably not attached to either of these leads, but again , I have no idea what unit you are using . Now , you dont specify what you term "hot" from the battery ? If you run bat+ to ground , and attach the positive lead of the unit to ground (it is likely red, check your instructions )and attach bat - to the load side of your harness and the negative wire from the unit to this (again , this might be the black wire from the unit ) then you should have positive ground , why you would want that is beyond me , but it's your bike . ... The blue wire confuses me , I have a podtronics unit , that I am told is basically a replica of a tympanium , and there is no blue wire , only the two yellow wires , a black and a red . If you could postthe instructions that came with this it might help as well . I am only hoping that , if terminals were crossed , nothing more than a fuse was blown , some of these semi modern solid state devices can be very sensitive .

- Good luck -BONZO

Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46709
04/04/06 10:13 pm
04/04/06 10:13 pm
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
A
Adam M. Online content OP
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Adam M.  Online Content OP
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
The brand of the unit is TrailTech and only difference between it and Podtronics, or Tympanium unit is a blue wire which I don`t use anyway ( it has to be used with low output alternators - below 100W ).
So what you are saying, I should connect red wire of the unit to the ground (+) and black to the hot ( means "-" ) wire from the battery ? Yesterday I kept connecting black wire of the unit to the ground and red to to the (-) of the battery.

Adam M.

Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46710
04/05/06 12:31 am
04/05/06 12:31 am
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,348
Michigan, USA
BONZO R.I.P. Offline
In Remembrance
BONZO R.I.P.  Offline
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Michigan, USA
Adam , I think you are on the right track,bat + is usuaully red/bat - is usuallyblack, regardless if it is neg or pos ground . this seems to get some people confused but it really is just about that simple, some blow hards will go on about hole flow theory vs. electron flow etc...., and others argue that the pos ground was developed for military use to slow oxidation at ground connections (or maybe render any captured equipment useless to the enemy ) but none of that matters when it comes to makingthe bike run , and very few electrical components on your bike care what side you have grounded (usually just coils/rect/reg) . Now, the blue wire was curious , now I am more curious about it , I havent seen a high/low output universal rectifier/regulator before , i'm sure it could be a good thing , but I am wondering how the blue wire is connected internally ? Do your instructions say where to connect this wire when used in low output mode ? Do you add it , or substitute for a different wire ? (I'm wondering if it is a third alternator wire , or if it should simply be swapped with a red or black wire ??? )I'd still be concerned about the reversed polarity that blew the fuse , it's a very good thing that you had the fuse in the circuit ,it may have saved the unit from a meltdown , but that is the kind of thing that can kill one of these units, and usualy voids a warrantee if there was one .

FWIW-BONZO

Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46711
04/05/06 1:51 am
04/05/06 1:51 am
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,871
Cape Carteret, NC
M
Mr Mike Offline
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Posts: 3,871
Cape Carteret, NC
Adam, I am not sure we are on the same page. You said:

"I hoped this unit could be used with a positive ground installation, but every time I try to connect a red wire from the unit to the hot wire from a battery results in broken fuse.
Am I doing something stupid or this unit works with negative ground installation only ???"

On most BSA's (1) ground is positive (+) and (2)negative (-) is the hot lead and (3) red is ground or positive (+). If you do what you are saying and connecting the red wire to to the hot wire, that is a direct short and will blow the fuse every time. The red wire should go to ground or (+). Did I read what you said incorrectly??
Mr Mike

Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46712
04/05/06 3:01 am
04/05/06 3:01 am
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,919
new jersey usa
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John RGS Offline
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new jersey usa
These Trailtech regulator's main application is dirt bikes and quads. If you check out what is involved in adapting them to an A-65, it appears hardly worth the effort. According to them, the stator must be rewound and other mods are necessary. Hardly worth the effort as you could have had a Tymp unit in and running by now. They seem to run about the same price. Tymp units can be wired positive or negative ground with out any changes except the output leads. Hope this helps!

http://www.trailtech.net/dc_conversion.htm


,_o
_ -\_<,
(*)/'(*)

NOPGS #2
Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46713
04/05/06 3:13 am
04/05/06 3:13 am
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,348
Michigan, USA
BONZO R.I.P. Offline
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Michigan, USA
I'm not sure I agree with John aboutthe application , according to the website , it is obviously intended for offroad/ATV use , and I am in no way familiar with them , but as far as I know , the BSA alternator is a floating ground system ???So it may be a direct fit , just not sure about the power capability . If I already had this , I'd forge ahead and install it , with a heat sink of some sort , and see what happens .

FWIW-BONZO

Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46714
04/05/06 3:20 am
04/05/06 3:20 am
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John RGS Offline
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new jersey usa
Stator is floating ground Bonzo, but the conversion stuff is confusing. Where is this extra lead going? I think it's for one of those multi lead dirt bike Kowayaha stators and i don't know nothin' about them either.


,_o
_ -\_<,
(*)/'(*)

NOPGS #2
Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46715
04/05/06 3:59 am
04/05/06 3:59 am
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,348
Michigan, USA
BONZO R.I.P. Offline
In Remembrance
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Michigan, USA
Ahhh yes.... the infamous blue wire ??? That is the wrench in the works , as I mentioned , I'd really like to see the instruction sheet before determining what way to go , but if it really is a high/low output situation , and Adam seems to think the blue wire is not needed in this application???And he states that the two yellow wires are attached to single phase Ac input and the unit may already be toast ??? waddya got to lose?And , appearantly the device can handle some power as they can be fitted to bikes with lights and e-starter , that's a whole lotta "???!!!???!!!???" ifs/whatnots and wherefores ..... but like I say , if I already had one in hand , I'd give it a go ,I do agree that a tymp or a podtronic unit may have been the way to go initially , I've used pod , Boyer power box , and even H-d solid state rect/reg on BSA with no trouble , I guess it really isnt majik goin on in there , so this might prove out just fine???

Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46716
04/05/06 4:09 am
04/05/06 4:09 am
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John RGS Offline
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PSST Adam, Snip off that blue wire and go for it!


,_o
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(*)/'(*)

NOPGS #2
Re: Installing regulator rectifier on a BSA A65. #46717
04/06/06 1:20 am
04/06/06 1:20 am
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
A
Adam M. Online content OP
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Adam M.  Online Content OP
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
Yes, Bonzo and MrMike - I was tired and didnt think straight - I tried to connect red positive wire of the unit with negative wire from the battery. I will try it again, hoping the unit is not damaged yet, if it is I will buy another one from them ( $29.95 ). Cant beat this price smile
I`m quite sure its going to work without any problem with my Lucas alternator, anyway I`m going to write about it during summer.
In the meantime I took the unit off the bike and realised that connections I did using my cheapo crimping tool arent worth ****.
I ordered the PROPER crimping tool with a box of bullet connectors from TrailTech ( another $ 29.95 - cant beat that price ) and am waiting for it to come in order to redo my connections.
During the waiting period I`ll try to start the bike and sort out carbs. I got lucky, because my Boyer works. Anyway Ill write about it later.
Thanks guys for your input - I will email TrailTech to explain exact role of the blue wire.
I know that many japanese bikes used additional wire to "sense load" for their reg/rectifiers.

Adam M.


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