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#383362 - 07/09/11 2:57 pm New BSA A65 & A70 barrels.  
Joined: Apr 2011
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handyman Offline
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handyman  Offline
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East Sussex, UK
As I now have the facilities, a bigger hotter funace laugh :D, I am tempted to cast up some new barrels for the BSA unit twins in cast iron or aluminium alloy, with sleeved liners.

I can make these from 500cc upto about 810cc using the original form of barrels, as they are sand cast using a set of patterns I am making. The bore size is purely down to machining and it would be possible to change the barrel height to give different engine characteristics.

Anybody interested in new barrels for their beloved bike? Just an expression of interest at this stage would be useful. Price and availablity would be forthcoming once I get further on with the project.

I've already done some alloy barrels for my big singles, using modern modified pistons.

I have a number of sources for new pistons and no, not those nasty cast rubbish parts from the Far East.

Handyman

Last edited by handyman; 07/09/11 2:58 pm.
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#383419 - 07/09/11 9:16 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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KevRasen Online content
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London,Great Britain
Hello Handyman,

I would certainly be interested in a set of barrels, especially a big-bore set - do you know of a piston source for a big bore ?
I'll keep my eye on your post and if you decide to go ahead let me know.
Regards
Kev

#383463 - 07/10/11 2:21 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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gavin eisler Online content
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gavin eisler  Online Content
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argyll. scotland, uk
+1 for the big bore barrels


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
#383471 - 07/10/11 4:27 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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DMadigan Online content
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DMadigan  Online Content
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ca, us
810cc (83.5mm bore)? Seems a bit large to fit within the head bolts.

#383552 - 07/10/11 4:30 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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KC in S.B. Online content
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KC in S.B.  Online Content

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Santa Barbara, California
I'd pop for a set for A65 in standard. The Alloy would be the seller for me!
Of course, we are all looking for a price estimate.........


Down to 1 BSA, 2 Triumphs, 2 '56 Chevys
#383607 - 07/10/11 8:50 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: ]  
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Shane in Oz Online content
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Shane in Oz  Online Content
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Originally Posted By: 1968BSA

but a rough estimate would be apreciated, otherwise i may buy some OIF ones and ask srm to alter the cases.


I think SRM sell offset studs which will allow late (3/8 stud) barrels to be used on earlier cases. They used to list the studs for fitting the 750 kit to earlier cases.

#383628 - 07/10/11 10:03 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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Gordo in Comox Offline
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For sure I am keen on anything to reduce weight but a ballpark (cricket field?) price estimate range would help when you can narrow it down. Standard bore 1965-69 type would cover our needs.

Can you post photos of the barrels you have already made for your singles?

Gordo


Without frequent roadside repairs there is no fun in riding!
#383691 - 07/11/11 1:57 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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Zapmaster Flash Offline
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Zapmaster Flash  Offline
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New Philadelphia, Ohio. U.S.A...
I would be interested in a standard set of aluminum barrels, as already stated the price is the clincher.


If its got tits or tires your gonna have problems!
1964 BSA Cyclone
1965 A65R
1970 BSA A65T
1979 Kaw KZ650
1994 Honda CB1000
#383707 - 07/11/11 2:51 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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gavin eisler Online content
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gavin eisler  Online Content
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argyll. scotland, uk
68 bSA , i want a set of 750 short stroke barrels, why ? I have lomg and short stroke versions, the short stroke I want to live on, pistons are lighter than stock nad the motor is torquier and smoother than stock.
new jugs , yes please.
Can you get pistons as well.?


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
#383718 - 07/11/11 3:28 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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gavin eisler Online content
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gavin eisler  Online Content
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argyll. scotland, uk
My short stroke is std stroke , 71 motor big bore ,end fed crank.
going for long stroke, try a norton crank amd check out
Mark Parker's threads on 90 degree cranks, great stuff.


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
#383733 - 07/11/11 7:17 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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wak Offline
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derby england
will the cam followers running in the block be an issue with alloy ? i know some triumphs run alloy cam follower blocks but there not the same alloy as the cast barrels, nice idea tho, a65 barrels are heavy


BSA CYCLONE
BSA METISSE
TRIUMPH TR6C
BSA BUSHMAN
INDIAN WOODSMAN
#383751 - 07/11/11 9:51 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: ]  
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Shane in Oz Online content
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Originally Posted By: 1968BSA
im a bit thick tonight (no one say "What do you mean tonight") well i am most nights, but tonight a little more cotton filled than normal.

How do you follow - off set studs?


Allan,

From memory, the centre studs are located slightly differently for the 5/16 stud and 3/8 stud cylinders. SRM used to list studs for fitting the big bore kit (3/8 studs) to early cases. The studs mostly had 2 diameters, but a couple were also offset. There's not much in it; just enough to be annoying.

I could well be totally wrong, in which case Kevin or Rich will sort me out smile

#383754 - 07/11/11 10:33 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: wak]  
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handyman Offline
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Thanks for all your interest in the castings.

To answer a few queries:

Cost. This a a variable at the moment, until I can get view on the quantites involved. The more I can make per batch, the cheaper they get.

Cast Iron sets. I'll need to make a chill piece for the castings to ensure the material around the tappet area is cast correctly.

Alloy sets. I will probably go for a cast in steel tappet block, although I could look at other materials offering good wear properties. Treated alloy may be possible, but longevity of the wearing surfaces is a big consideration. The muff will probably be linered, making reboring un-nessecary, as the muff can be re-sleeved. Larger bores can be accomodated purely by boring the muff to fit the liner, providing there is enough material in the muff not to weaken the casting.

Bore sizes. This is governed by the design of the head and crancases and any dimensional limitations, like fixing locations and crank strokes. It is possible to make a near 750cc barrel using the standard crank, using pistons that are sqatter than the stock sizes and a shorter cylinder muff with a larger bore. I've done this before, as this is what Les did at Devimead.

Cubic capacities. As there are limitations to the maximum bore size, any increase in capacity has to be done by modifying the stroke. Not difficult until you try to sqeeze in a Norton crank to get to 900cc. The whole motor gets really stressed and rather fragile. Time to think about a whole new design. Fitting an A10 crank to get a bigger CC is quite common, I've done a few of these over the years.

Pistons. I have a number of sources for these, although I do have two prefered UK based manufacturers. If I can use stock castings from them, with a few bore variations, that will make them affordable, but not cheap.

As this project is not high on my workload list, it will be months before it gets completed, but I will post up information as it progresses.

I cannot post up photos of the singles barrels I have made as they are currently in use and I have no intention of stripping down the lumps just yet.

As for larger 3/8 studs fitted on to earlier cases and boring early cylinder muffs to take the larger size studs, I have sets of jigs to do this. It is only a drilling and tapping exercise.

Handyman

#383804 - 07/11/11 2:49 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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DMadigan Online content
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DMadigan  Online Content
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The triples use aluminum tappet blocks, unknown if these are a different alloy than the barrels. Presumably they are since the barrels are cast and the tappets are machined round stock (no point in casting).
You could use valve guide sleeves in the aluminum tappet block. The front and rear wall are only to prevent rotation.
The early A65 cylinder front centre two studs are farther apart than the later 3/8" studs. The cylinder would need a different drill pattern. I had to make a drill plate for both cases so I could find the bore centres.
I doubt you will be able to make a 750cc using the stock stroke and liners, not enough material between the bore and head bolts.

#415030 - 01/24/12 12:37 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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oleandreas Offline
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IM interested in alloy barrels, big bore.

Andreas

#415199 - 01/25/12 7:15 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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Mark Parker Offline
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Mark Parker  Offline
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Bega NSW Australia
Handyman, I'd recommend alloy cyls rather than cast iron. And I wouldn't use liners, Nicasil makes it one piece and gives a good ring seal. I tried a set with thin liners which pressed down against a step at the bottom of the bores, problem is with a long stroke crank the lower bores need slotting a little to clear the rods, it would probably be ok if the liners didn't move or turn in the block, mine did. With a 79.5mm bore the lower bore is getting a bit thin even with the casting oversize and needing the case mouth opened, when that thickness is half sleeve half alloy neither is very strong, mine cracked a sleeve. A thicker sleeve stepped at the top is a bit problematic because of the limited room from bore to bolt/stud holes. Which needs reduced H/bolt dia so as not to distort the bores.
So the second set I made are all alloy with Nicasil plated bores 79.5mm and they seem to work very well esp with Ed V's forged B44 pistons and high spec chrome rings.
I just use a cast tappet block, the cyls are heat treated to T6 and I expect the tappet block to last, although I've not had it apart to look.
When I build a short stroke motor I'll still use a std length cyl but with B44 pistons and longer rods, that way I can use the same cyl for long or short stroke motor.
These are my cyls before plating.


mark
#445753 - 07/22/12 10:42 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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JER.Hill Online content
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JER.Hill  Online Content
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Forfar, Scotland
Hi

I'm new to the forum and realise this is an old post. Is there any update on the "Handyman" producing alloy barrels!
Mark Parker are you to be producing any of your barrels for sale!

Any information would be helpful

John

#445848 - 07/23/12 4:55 pm Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: JER.Hill]  
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Semper Gumby Offline
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Semper Gumby  Offline
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Atlanta, GA USA
I'd be interested in Alloy Nicasil Coated barrels in the Stock size for the Hornet Project. Anything to lighten up the motor.


Gaggle of BSAs
a Honda
an old BMW
and a Montesa
Parking lot Elf in training
#446031 - 07/25/12 3:31 am Re: New BSA A65 & A70 barrels. [Re: handyman]  
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Mark Z Online content
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Mark Z  Online Content
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Owego, NY, USA
For those of us who have owned the same A65s for many years, which have undergone one or two rebores with no rebalancing, it would be nice to go back to a standard bore, and pistons that weigh the same as the originals, so that the engine would be balanced at least as well as it was when it left the factory. (Is that laughter I hear?).


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.

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