BritBike Forum logo
BritBike Sponsor BritBike Sponsor BritBike Sponsor
BritBike Sponsor

BritBike Sponsor

BritBike Sponsor
BritBike Sponsor BritBike Sponsor BritBike Sponsor
  JWood Auction  
Home | Sponsors, Newsletter | Regalia | Calendar | Bike Project | BritBike Museum | Spiders Cartoons, "OLD" BritBike Forum | DVD- Manuals & Parts books | BritBike Stickers & Decals
Upgrade to: Premium Membership | Premium Life Membership | Vendor Membership | Site Sponsor Membership
Photo posting tutorial

Member Spotlight
Dick1969
Dick1969
The Netherlands
Posts: 91
Joined: December 2006
Show All Member Profiles 
Shout Box
Search eBay for motorcycle parts in following countries
Australia, Canada, France, Holland, Italy, United Kingdom, USA
Random Gallery photo
Who's Online Now
226 registered members (57nortonmodel77), 1,778 guests, and 516 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
XTINCT, Bruce Roberts, Brian Ellery, Jon Andrews, Berni Ernst
9957 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
btour 189
koan58 100
Stuart 86
NickL 71
Popular Topics(Views)
437,557 mail-order LSR
Forum Statistics
Forums33
Topics65,279
Posts632,262
Members9,955
Most Online3,995
Feb 13th, 2017
Like BritBike.com on Facebook

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
#391704 - 08/26/11 2:17 am clutch plates stuck together  
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
DKA Offline
BritBike Forum member
DKA  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
North Carolina
I have a '79 T140. If I leave the clutch alone for more than 2 days the plates stick together so much that I can't break them loose unless I take them out of the clutch and pry them apart with a screw driver. The pads do not seem overly worn and the metal ones are really smooth. If I coat them heavily with oil then they work nicely until driven, then back to sticking together. Whats with that? I just replaced the basket due to lots of dents in the slots and I filed down the dogs while I was at it. They slid past each other the next day, but then after 3 days they are stuck again. Should I just get new plates?
David

Support Your #1 BritBike Forum!
Membership Type! Free
Member
Premium
Member
Premium Life
Member
Vendor
Member
Site
Sponsor
Recognition No Premium Member Premium Life member (5 years) Vendor Member Site Sponsor Membership
Post commercial threads No No No Yes Yes
Custom title No Yes Yes Yes Yes
Upload avatar & photos No Yes Yes Yes Yes
Link avatar & photos Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes
Private Message Storage: 10 100 100 100 100
Length of signatures 255 600 600 600 600
Removes this very advert island between post 1&2 No Yes Yes Yes Yes
Price Free $12.90/year $105.00 No End
$55.00/5 years
$210.00/year
($17.50/month)
Email
Click on button >>
  Premium Member Premium Life member Vendor Member Site Sponsor Membership
#391705 - 08/26/11 2:22 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,643
GrandPaul Online content
BritBike Forum member
GrandPaul  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,643
Laredo (South) Texas, USA
My old '79 used to stick almost as soon as I buttoned up the primary.

Try Barnett friction plates and back off the spring pressure till it just starts to slip on hard accelleration from about 3500 RPM, then turn in the screws about 1/4 turn and you should be good to go.


GrandPaul (does not use emoticons)
Author of the book "Old Bikes"
Too many bikes to list, mostly Triumph & Norton, some BSA & European
"The Iron in your blood should be Vintage"
#391707 - 08/26/11 2:35 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: GrandPaul]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 112
mike07 Online content
BritBike Forum member
mike07  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 112
Ottawa Ontario, Canada
Somebody here,i forget who suggested using a zip tie to hold lever to bar if its gonna sit for a while & it works for me.


68 Bonneville
68 Daytona
68 CL450
68 CL350
#391708 - 08/26/11 2:46 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,515
DMadigan Online content
BritBike Forum member
DMadigan  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,515
ca, us
Usually you pull in the lever and use the kickstart to break the plates free before starting.
Instead of using zip ties, cut an old mountain bike inner tube into inch wide strips and use one or two of those to relieve the pressure plate.

#391712 - 08/26/11 3:20 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DMadigan]  
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
DKA Offline
BritBike Forum member
DKA  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
North Carolina
I can pull in the clutch lever and kick it while the rear tire is on the ground with a person on the seat and the plates won't break loose. I'll try the holding in the lever trick after I pull it back apart and separate them. I was a little worried that that might weaken the springs, but if other people do it to good affect, then I guess its worth a try. I've heard good things about Barnett so I'll probably do those over the winter, or sooner.
Does tightening the three springs past snug actually increase spring pressure? or does it just decrease its length?
David

#391721 - 08/26/11 4:55 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 85
Torch Offline
BritBike Forum member
Torch  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 85
so.cal
Many times on the 1970 and later bikes it's the engine oil you are using that sticks them together, if you are not already you might try using a actual Motorcycle oil that is intended for use with clutch plates.
It isn't a big problem on the earlier bikes because most people with the non-primary breather models use ATF in the primary case because it's designed to be used with clutch plates.

Last edited by Torch; 08/26/11 4:59 am.

"Statesman" is the term often used to describe a deceased politician, we need more Statesmen.
#391741 - 08/26/11 12:29 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,965
John Healy Online content
John Healy  Online Content



Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,965
Boston, Massachusetts
This is a problem typically seen with the older clutch material Barnett used on their plates. As David explained, they would seem to weld themselves together. With in the past year they changed friction material and we have not had a complaint of sticking Barnett plates since.

This is rarely seen with the NEW Barnett, Taiwan, or Surflex plates. The best releasing plates are the Surflex ones sold by Norman Hyde in his 7 plate conversion.


#391783 - 08/26/11 5:38 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,486
Al Eckstadt Online content
BritBike Forum member
Al Eckstadt  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,486
Jordan, NY
I had this problem a few years ago and tried all the suggestions from this board with no results. Maybe the issue is cleared up now with new materials but I solved my problem with MAP no-drag clutch plates. HTH. Al.


Al Eckstadt
#391793 - 08/26/11 6:39 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,965
John Healy Online content
John Healy  Online Content



Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,965
Boston, Massachusetts
A lot of people have good luck with the Alto plates sold by MAP and others.


#391794 - 08/26/11 6:42 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: Al Eckstadt]  
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 258
kevin large Offline
BritBike Forum member
kevin large  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 258
devon
after cleening everything in petrol refill primary with Atf oil
works every time

#391803 - 08/26/11 7:48 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,965
John Healy Online content
John Healy  Online Content



Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,965
Boston, Massachusetts
ATF won't do a thing to prevent the old Barnett plates from sticking! If you had some real hp they were brilliant, but you had to take precautions to make sure they didn't weld themselves together.

Because we always checked the clutch rod adjustment between races we would just run in the adjuster between races. This kept the pressure off the plates in the same manner as putting a bunji of the clutch lever but a lot less stress full on the clutch cable.


#391834 - 08/27/11 12:13 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,113
Jack Adams Offline
BritBike Forum member
Jack Adams  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,113
Noblesville, IN
DKA,Your post about kicking with the tire on the ground and someone on the seat makes me think you are trying to kick it in gear. Are you? Jack

#391885 - 08/27/11 11:39 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
DKA Offline
BritBike Forum member
DKA  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
North Carolina
Thanks for all the ideas. I'm glad to see that it is a normal issue and not that the universe is picking on me! John, I'll do the clutch adjuster thing. Jack, I was hoping to break the plates free by using a locked rear wheel(can't use the brake pedal 'cause its in the way of kicking). Over the winter I'm going to get new plates and hopefully be done with this. Also, tomorrow I'm putting in ATF to give it a try. Thanks everyone!

#391886 - 08/27/11 11:48 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,465
L.A.B. Online content
BritBike Forum member
L.A.B.  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,465
Norfolk, UK
Originally Posted By: DKA
I have a '79 T140.


Originally Posted By: DKA
Also, tomorrow I'm putting in ATF to give it a try.


No! Do not use ATF in the primary case

It's a 1979 model therefore you must use the same oil in the primary case as you use for the engine.

#392021 - 08/28/11 5:26 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
DKA Offline
BritBike Forum member
DKA  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
North Carolina
LAB, thanks for yelling at me and getting my attention. I need it sometimes. OK, I won't go for the ATF but yesterday I cleaned them and coated them with ATF and reassembled the clutch leaving the springs fully tightened. This morning I tried kicking it over and they would not release. I'm no physicist, but I'm wondering if as the plates get worn they become ultra smooth, almost polished. Two polished surfaces with a thin film of wetness between them almost always will stick together. Surface tension or something like that. I do think I'll go ahead and get some Surflex plates instead of waiting. When the new ones arrive, I'm going to rough up my old ones and see if that makes any difference. I love a good experiment!
David

#392036 - 08/28/11 8:46 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,465
L.A.B. Online content
BritBike Forum member
L.A.B.  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,465
Norfolk, UK
Originally Posted By: DKA
yesterday I cleaned them and coated them with ATF and reassembled the clutch leaving the springs fully tightened. This morning I tried kicking it over and they would not release. I'm no physicist, but I'm wondering if as the plates get worn they become ultra smooth, almost polished.


I think it's just an "old" plate problem, and it's one that I've heard Triumph owners often mention before. Fitting a new set of friction plates (such as Surflex etc.) usually cures the "overnight" plate-sticking problem.

When you say the clutch springs were "fully tightened" I hope you mean "correctly adjusted"?

#392039 - 08/28/11 9:17 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,643
GrandPaul Online content
BritBike Forum member
GrandPaul  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,643
Laredo (South) Texas, USA
You aren't supposed to fully tighten the clutch springs; you are supposed to adjust them to the point that they provide full lock-up with no slipping under accelleration in higher gears, and no grabbing/creeping with clutch engaged at low RPM at a stop.

Typically, you can just see the first thread at the end of the bolt coming up through the slotted head section at that pooint. That's why the special tool has a notch to accommodate it.

Fully tightened is sure to lock the clutch up solid regardless of lever / cable / mechanicsm position.

Last edited by GrandPaul; 08/28/11 9:18 pm.

GrandPaul (does not use emoticons)
Author of the book "Old Bikes"
Too many bikes to list, mostly Triumph & Norton, some BSA & European
"The Iron in your blood should be Vintage"
#392096 - 08/29/11 11:30 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
DKA Offline
BritBike Forum member
DKA  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
North Carolina
Yes, I should have used the correct words. I had one thread showing on the spring adjusters. I'm ordering new plates this week. Thanks for everyone's help on this.
David

#392106 - 08/29/11 12:41 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,429
Tiger Offline
BritBike Forum member
Tiger  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,429
Melbourne Australia
MAP no-drag clutch plates.

If MAP advertise them as such I hope they send God to fit them.

Some folks have endless problems with Triumph clutches but mine have been few, once the bolts fixing the cush drive togeather came loose and that was my fault for not checking them at rebuild.

A cable once broke also and the nipple is still beneath the outer gearbox cover.

People speak of steel plates becoming polished and thereby allowing a pure suction lock against friction plates and suggest bead blasting of steel plates.

My clutch is feather light and only ever slips momentarily when accelerating in higher gears when the bike has been parked for a month, when warm it behaves.

Plates are what were fitted when I bought the bike 8 yrs back, I measured them at rebuild and have done 35K miles since.

I do the basic behaviours like never hold the clutch in but rather select neutral etc but that is not a dark secret.


1969 TR6R
7.62 x 51 is not a maths puzzle.
#392120 - 08/29/11 2:10 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: Tiger]  
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,643
GrandPaul Online content
BritBike Forum member
GrandPaul  Online Content
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,643
Laredo (South) Texas, USA
I swirl the plain steel plates (both sides) on a smooth area of my concrete shop floor, to knock the glaze off and give them a reasonably consistent tacky surface. It's worked fine for me for 20 years and several dozen bikes (at least).


GrandPaul (does not use emoticons)
Author of the book "Old Bikes"
Too many bikes to list, mostly Triumph & Norton, some BSA & European
"The Iron in your blood should be Vintage"
#392392 - 08/31/11 1:49 am Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
DKA Offline
BritBike Forum member
DKA  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 208
North Carolina
So who do I go to to buy the Surflex or Barnett plates? Preferably one of the advertisers on this site. I've looked around on their sites but haven't found a listing.

Thanks

#392621 - 09/01/11 5:13 pm Re: clutch plates stuck together [Re: DKA]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,562
Roadwarrior Offline
Private Sponsor
Roadwarrior  Offline

Private Sponsor

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,562
El Dorado, California
The good suppliers will have a variety of plates to choose from. I like Walridge motors.


Bob


73 Triumph T140 Main Ride
70 Bonnie
67 BSA West Coast Hornet

56 Chevy

Who are the brain police?




Moderated by  John Healy 


Home | Sponsors | Newsletter | Regalia | Calendar | Bike Project | BritBike Museum | Spiders Cartoons | "OLD" BritBike Forum | DVD- Manuals & Parts books | BritBike Stickers & Decals
Upgrade to: Premium Membership | Premium Life Membership | Vendor Membership | Site Sponsor Membership
UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.203s Queries: 15 (0.041s) Memory: 0.9634 MB (Peak: 1.2761 MB) Zlib disabled. Server Time: 2017-11-22 02:08:42 UTC