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#390600 - 08/20/11 11:07 am t140 running without a battery is it possible  
Joined: Apr 2011
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brian begg Offline
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brian begg  Offline
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united kingdom
hi is it poss to run my t140 bonnie without a battery. have herd you can but not sure what to do.its fitted with a Boyer electronic ignition .reason i am wanting to do this is i am building a bobber and have no room for a battery .also anyone got any ideas for a wireing loom only going to have front and back light and horn and ignition switch hope you can help me cheers brian

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#390630 - 08/20/11 4:31 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: brian begg]  
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Torch Offline
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so.cal
There are still many people that will say it can't be done but we wire custom bikes that way all the time and it works fine, the secret is a good strong alternator, (that translates into a "new" one) and don't go over board on the stator output, you can't use a 200 watt high output stator with this charge unit so stick with standard output stator and a new rotor. and we use the "Boyer light delay battery eliminator" charge unit. that unit will allow the minimum voltage necessary needed to keep your Boyer ignition running properly before it powers up your lighting system.
It also helps to wire the bike as a negative ground and use an LED taillight and don't use a high wattage halogen headlight (halogen bulbs burn faster when they are run at a lower voltage)this will also minimize you lighting power requirements and prevent pulsing lights at idle.
here is a simple wiring diagram from Rask, you will need to substitute the Boyer charge unit for the Tympanium and battery.
http://raskcycle.com/techtip/webdoc16a.html

Last edited by Torch; 08/20/11 4:32 pm.

"Statesman" is the term often used to describe a deceased politician, we need more Statesmen.
#390636 - 08/20/11 5:02 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: Torch]  
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brian begg Offline
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united kingdom
thank you very much for that information very helpfull

#390637 - 08/20/11 5:11 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: brian begg]  
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brian begg Offline
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united kingdom
sorry had look at wireing diagram it shows it useing a battery .do you just wire it the same way without useing the battery thanks again brian

#390670 - 08/20/11 7:59 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: brian begg]  
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Torch Offline
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so.cal
yes just eliminate the battery, and because those Boyer charge units cost about $140 make sure you put a fuse in line on the (red) power wire.


"Statesman" is the term often used to describe a deceased politician, we need more Statesmen.
#390673 - 08/20/11 8:03 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: Torch]  
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brian begg Offline
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united kingdom
spot on mate thanks again

#391003 - 08/22/11 4:53 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: brian begg]  
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RHall-HCV Offline
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Charlotte NC
Ive got a hi output alt kit with a sparx battery elim kit, running a Boyer with a led tail light bulb (necessity like torch said) and 2 55w bulbs for a head light. Works just fine and starts first kick most of the time.


ROB HALL
HCV MOTORSPORTS
#391012 - 08/22/11 6:00 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: brian begg]  
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RyanF Offline
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KY, USA
I run most of my bikes battery-less. You have several options... in order of preference with electronic ignition:

1. Capacitor with Tympanium/Spark Solid state rectifier/regulator
2. Boyer or Sparx Power box/Battery Eliminator
3. I also use small Sealed Lead Acid batteries of the 4.5 - 5 Amp Hour range. Small enough to conceal easily (2 packs of smokes small), but reliability of a battery.

AS others have stated. I properly working charging system is a must. 10amp std. Alternator/Rotor combo is just fine for me my lights hardly flicker at idle.

I wire my Headlight to a 3 way toggle (ON-OFF-ON) in the light housing so I can start or run without lights on. Tail Light is also wired only to "ACC" position on 3 Position ignition switch. Brake Light runs off coil jumper, so if the bike is running, I have a brake light, lights on or not.

A quick word on LED lights, they are Polarity Sensitive!!! Unless designed to do so, they will not light on a POSITIVE ground system without an inline relay of some type.

That's all I got!

Farducci


1950 BSA A10 Chopper 1951 BSA Golden Flash
1960 Triumph 5T
1962 BSA A65 Royal Star
1968 BSA A65 Bobber - In Progress
1969 Triumph T120 Bobber "The Rabbit"
1972 Triumph T120RV
#391019 - 08/22/11 6:21 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: brian begg]  
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leon bee Offline
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arkansas
I also have been doing this for some time, on several bikes. My favorite setup is Podtronics box and an old time looking, (but new) Mallory capacitor. I've used Mity Max, Sparx box and Boyer Power Box, but like the capacitor best. Boyer Mark 3 and a Pazon, haven't tried with Boyer Mark 4

I mention Boyer Mark 4 because the esteemed Torch has earlier posted he doesn't like the Mark 4 without battery.

As others have said, alternator rotor is the biggest factor- stronger the magnets, less kicking you will do. I always use some kind of little battery at first to get the bike up and running good.

#391561 - 08/25/11 3:05 am Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: RyanF]  
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Torch Offline
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so.cal
"A quick word on LED lights, they are Polarity Sensitive!!! Unless designed to do so, they will not light on a POSITIVE ground system without an inline relay of some type."

as for the LED tail lights all you need to do is switch the black and red wire going to ground from your Tympanuim and you now have a negative ground bike that can just plug in the store bought LEDs

Esteemed? ...hmmm... but I still prefer the Pazon over the Mark IV, the mark III's were fine but the new Boyer's are way to sensitive to minor A/C leakage.

Last edited by Torch; 08/25/11 2:48 pm.

"Statesman" is the term often used to describe a deceased politician, we need more Statesmen.
#391604 - 08/25/11 12:10 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: Torch]  
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JubeePrince Online content
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Back on the mainland!
Originally Posted By: Torch

as for the LED tail lights all you need to do is switch the black and red wire going to ground from your Tympanuim and you now have a negative ground bike that can just plug in the store bought LEDs


If you are going to do this, you would probably want to reverse the polarity on the coils too....

Steve


'77 T140J
"Vintage Bike". What's in your garage?

"The paying customer is always right."

Fitting round pegs into square holes since 1961...
#391618 - 08/25/11 2:45 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: JubeePrince]  
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Torch Offline
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Torch  Offline
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so.cal
there is a whole different wiring diagram for the E/I brain box for a negative ground, but the coil wiring is the same


"Statesman" is the term often used to describe a deceased politician, we need more Statesmen.
#391630 - 08/25/11 4:19 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: Torch]  
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 188
Triumph5ta Online content
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Triumph5ta  Online Content
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London, England
Paul Goff will have all your Positive Earth LED bulbs:
Paul Goff classic bike electrics

#391797 - 08/26/11 7:13 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: leon bee]  
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dave jones Offline
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dave jones  Offline
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Emsworth, sunny south of Engla...
What is the value of the capacitor you use? I fancied trying running with one but wasn't sure if the ancient Lucas capacitors would still work.

Dave

#391806 - 08/26/11 8:16 pm Re: t140 running without a battery is it possible [Re: brian begg]  
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leon bee Offline
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arkansas
I bought several new, fresh capacitors. Mallory, made in USA, (allegedly). They say 4500uF, 30 volts. Mallory number is CGS452U030R2C.


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