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#231445 - 01/06/09 12:34 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: GrandPaul]  
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 89
Dawg Offline
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England
Nice to see you are spending much time on such detail - I am looking forward to the end result!


Interesting comment about the B.T.H 'T.T' magneto, billy banger; I've only heard reports of the opposite opinion! It's the Lucas K1F's that i've heard dodgy things about. I picked a refurbished B.T.H T.T mag up last October for a future project.


1958 Velocette Venom
1960 Norton Dominator 99
1964 Velocette Venom Clubman Mk1
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#236376 - 02/06/09 10:10 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
After getting side tracked making up a set of knife edge rollers that I decided I needed for balancing the crank, I actually got back to putting the bike back together this week.

The new big end bearing/pin assembly and con rod that I ordered arrived some weeks ago so I could get straight into assembling the crank. This involved pressing the big end outer bearing race and the small end bush into the con rod.

[Linked Image]

I then set up an adjustable hand reamer between centres on the lathe and fixed and aligned an angle plate and vee block on the cross slide that retained the rod at the big end but allowed transverse float. This allowed me to ream the small end bush to size while keeping it parallel to the big end bearing. Not strictly the method described in the manual but it worked out OK and everything was inline when I check it on a surface table afterwards.

[Linked Image]

Next the new crank pin was pressed into one side of the crank flywheel, the pin is tapered and went in ok requiring about 5 tonnes of press force to get it home. Although I pressed it in a bit a time preleasing the press pressure and turning the assembly 90degrees each time to keep things square. The big end bearing roller assembly was then installed onto the crank pin, the con rod placed into position and the other flywheel half set onto the pin. I then aligned the outer edges of the flywheels using a straight edge and measured and set the distance between the two fly wheels to an equal distance. Then into the press for pressing home using the same releasing and turning method used for the other side, a final press force of 7 tonnes was applied.

[Linked Image]

I then set the assembled crank between centres and checked alignment, this measured 0.003� radial run out TIR. I will true this up to <0.001� tomorrow.

[Linked Image]

Next step after final alignment is to balance the crank (and try out my new knife edge roller to see if they work!).

Bry


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#239330 - 02/22/09 10:52 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
With the crank assembled and pressed up, next steps were final alignment and balancing.

The alignment process was pretty straight forward once I had the proper tool for the job, which turned out to be a 3x3 fence post! I stood the post on floor, held in a bench vice then by bumping (or more like slamming) one of the flywheels against the end grain of the post I was able to move the assembly by the minute amount necessary � without the need for hammers, lead blocks or the like - using the cranks own weight as the motive force. Eventually after quite a few checks between centres using a dial gauge then bumps on the post I managed to get the main shafts running true to a radial TIR of 0.001�.

I was keen to have a go at balancing the crank myself on this engine having read up on the theory. I had originally checked the existing balance using a pair of live centres and although the numbers seemed to come out OK, I was still a little worried that there was too much friction to allow totally free running for accurate balancing, so I decided to make up a set of knife edge rollers that I can support in the lathe. This worked out well and not only did this allow a very free running of the crank, the extra height provided useful clearance above the bed for hanging balance weights. After a bit of research I settled for a balance factor of 65% (which was what I measured the existing BF to be). But of course due to the new big end assembly, con rod and oversized piston some adjustment was necessary to maintain the 65% BF. After carefully weighing the small end of the assembled crank and the new components that will make up the reciprocating mass, I calculated the necessary weight to attach to the small end. Then by adding and subtracting weights while turning the crank on the knife edge rollers I determined the amount of mass adjustment necessary, this turned out be the equivalent of drilling a 3/8� dia. hole 10.5mm deep in the side of each flywheel at 2x the radius of the crank pin form the centre of the main shaft.

It was then time to fit the main bearings, these are taper rollers of the same type for the drive and timing side. The inner race and roller assembly simply pressed onto the main shaft. In these engines the bearing are pre-tensioned to 0.004� this is achieved by shimming the outer races in their housings in the crankcase. As the crankcases need to be heated (to around 160 deg. C) to drop the bearing outer races in, I ground down the OD of the outer races of the old bearing so that I could first make a cold assembly to measure the amount of end float to see what size of shims would be needed. This got things close to within 0.003� when I heated the cases and dropped the new bearings in, but it was necessary to heat, remove, re-shim again to get everything right. I checked the pretension, by cutting pieces of 0.005� shim stock and placing these around the joint in the crankcase halves and bolting everything together. I then measured an end float of 0.001�, resulting in a pretension of 0.004� (hopefully!).

While the timing side crankcase was hot for the bearing installation I also fitted the oil pump.

After fitting the intermediate timing gear spindle, from inside the TS case I bolted everything together, inserting the timing drive pinion and oil pump worm gear to the end of the timing shaft in the process.

[Linked Image]
Knife edge rollers

[Linked Image]
Balancing crank

[Linked Image]
Weighing small end

[Linked Image]
Marking flywheels for drilling

[Linked Image]
Checking end float

[Linked Image]
Assembled bottom end


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#249764 - 04/22/09 3:22 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
Thought I�d post a brief update on the progress (or lack of!) on the Venom project.

I decided to put this project on hold at the end of February so that I could give my Triumph a service and a good going over in preparation for its MOT test and the riding season. However what started out as a simple service and list of small jobs that I had been saving up since last year turned into much more when I got into it (as it always seems to with old bikes). I also had an extended trip working away from home in the middle of all this. Anyway enough excuses, the Triumph is done and tested and I had my first decent run of the year on it last weekend so back into the Velocette project.

First thing was to assembly the intermediate pinion, camshaft pinion and rockers, this was all straight forward as the existing pinion bushes were good and did not need to be replaced.

I had sent the barrel off to SRM in Wales for a re-bore, gap rings and to bead blast the alloy in early March. As usually SRM did a great job and a quick turn around. So I fitted the new piston and barrel, although this will only be temporary as I will need to measure the compression ratio when I get the head done to determine the correct compression plates that need to be fitted at the base of the cylinder. One minor problem I found was that the new stainless insert adaptors for the cylinder assembly studs that I ordered were a bit too long and fouled the underside of the barrel fin when assembled. So a minor turn down of the ends of these will be required, no problem when it is stainless as there is no need to worry about replating.

Next on the list of jobs is to polish the timing cover and fit, check over the cylinder head and decide if it needs to be sent out for reseating work and new guides (probably will). Then I am planning to turn my attention to the frame and check it out for cracks, alignment etc then send it out for power coating while I get started on the gearbox. The reason for this approach is that I am planning to fit the engine bottom half and gearbox in the frame then build up the top end in the frame as it is quite a big lump to try and muscle in as a complete assembly yourself without damaging the coating on the frame.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#249772 - 04/22/09 4:06 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 12,081
Lannis Online content
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Lannis  Online Content

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Central Virginia
Bry -

I'm following your progress with interest. I enjoy reading about the methodical way you are tackling these big and sometimes very technical jobs.

After I get my three BSAs fettled and back on the road, I have a 30's roadburner of my own that needs to be assembled and parts fabricated from the ground up, I will be re-reading your progress for inspiration!

Lannis


OK, I admit it, I'm addicted to brake fluid.

But I can stop any time I want.
#250742 - 04/28/09 11:47 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Lannis]  
Joined: Apr 2009
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Texas
Beautiful work!

#258200 - 06/09/09 4:56 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Wheel Enthusiast]  
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 89
Dawg Offline
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Dawg  Offline
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England
Looking forward to the next installment Bry

There have been developments on my front!

It was a swine trying to find a Venom Clubman in need of a thorough restoration, and I couldn't find a non-runner.

However! a good runner turned up; i've just bought a 1963/'64 Venom Clubman - it's been messed around with and semi 'Thruxtonized', but is in very good condition and is M.O.T'd. The gearbox is stamped as an 'R' close ratio box, but appears to have been made standard at some point. I'll be starting pretty soon on returning it to Factory Spec; it'll be an easy 'rebuild', mere cosmetics, tinware etc..and most likely, will be ready later this year.


1958 Velocette Venom
1960 Norton Dominator 99
1964 Velocette Venom Clubman Mk1
#258500 - 06/10/09 10:03 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Dawg]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
Originally Posted By: Steve Buckley
Looking forward to the next installment Bry

There have been developments on my front!

It was a swine trying to find a Venom Clubman in need of a thorough restoration, and I couldn't find a non-runner.

However! a good runner turned up; i've just bought a 1963/'64 Venom Clubman - it's been messed around with and semi 'Thruxtonized', but is in very good condition and is M.O.T'd. The gearbox is stamped as an 'R' close ratio box, but appears to have been made standard at some point. I'll be starting pretty soon on returning it to Factory Spec; it'll be an easy 'rebuild', mere cosmetics, tinware etc..and most likely, will be ready later this year.


Great news on you finding another Venom Steve, '63/64' just what you were after.

Progress on my Venom restoration has almost come to a halt, hence the absence of any updates recently. This is mainly due to me working a lot overseas lately and also because of some problems that I have had with the Triumph which have resulted in an unscheduled mini rebuild. I have prioritised getting the Triumph fixed to get some riding in before the summer is over, all going to plan this should done by the end of this month, then I can turn my attention to the Velo' again.

BTW. I read with great interest, your article in Fishtail.

Bry


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#268276 - 08/02/09 10:03 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
I finally got back into the Venom project this weekend.

I started by polishing the timing cover, in preparation for this I tidied up the gasket surface on a glass plate with a sheet of wet and dry stuck to it and went over the outer surface lightly with a small flap type sanding wheel in the dremel to buff out the worst of the deep scratches, dings and gouges. Then a couple of hours at the buffing wheel with various grades of cutting then polishing compound got the desired result. I then used small felt bob heads in the dremel to clean up and polish the screw recesses.

[Linked Image]

I then tapped out the oil union hole in the timing cover, the thread looked a bit ropey and I though at first it may need a helicoil but it cleaned up OK with just a tap.

Finally, the oilways in the cover were cleaned out using aerosol carb� cleaner, prodding with pipe cleaners and a good blast out with compressed air.

Next was to complete the trial assembly of the timing chest (I will make the final assembly when the head is on and I set the valve timing), by fitting the outer steady plate then the timing cover. This revealed a couple of minor issues that are easily fixed. First was excessive end float in the intermediate timing gear � the manual states a max. axial float of 0.0015�, I measured 0.004�. After I bit of research to determine if this would be real problem I discovered that this can cause a bit of a clattering noise when the engine is running unloaded; so needed to be fixed. The intermediate timing gear runs on an extended bush that when measured had worn a bit due to the thrust load of the helical timing gears. The obvious fix � which I will make � is to replace this bush. I did however investigate other fixes for this first as due to the helical gear arrangement when this bush is replaced it needs to be line bored to ensure concentricity with the gear engagement circumference � apparently reaming to size is not accurate enough for this. After contemplating a couple of bodges involving shim washers or machining back the length of the existing bush and making up a spacer, I decided that the only option was to do it right, so new bush ordered and will be pressed in and line bored to size. The second issue was the nut on the replacement cam pinion spindle was fouling the timing cover preventing the cover seating on the gasket face of the timing chest; this was a straight forward fix that involved facing of the nut by 0.025� and cutting a new chamfer.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

It was also time to try out my new nickel plating kit. I decided to get one of these and give it a try as although I get very good results from the electroplating company that I normally use (and I will continue to this company for major parts), this involves packing and sending parts away and awaiting their return. I therefore seen the potential benefit in doing a bit of plating myself on smaller items as I go. After a bit of investigation on the various DIY plating kits available, I decided to purchased an electroless nickel plating kit from Caswell. The valve lifter lever was the chosen piece for the trial and was given a bit of a clean and buff up. The plating process itself was pretty straightforward and involved mixing the various chemicals supplied with distilled water in a container, bringing to the boil using the emersion heater provided and placing the component into the boiling solution. The thickness of the plating is determined as result to the time the component is left in the boiling solution. It is also necessary to make a calculation based on the surface area of the component(s) being plated and the thickness of the plating applied and keep a record to determine how much the plating tank has depleted and when replenishment of chemicals is necessary. After 45 minutes (which should be about 0.0008� of plating) I removed the lever and after cooling and bit of light buffing, I was very happy with the results, so plating kit will definitely be getting used again.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#268754 - 08/05/09 2:16 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 168
darbone85737 Offline
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darbone85737  Offline
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Tucson, AZ
Brilliant work.


Tucson, AZ
1955 BSA Gold Star clubman
1958 BSA A10 Super Rocket
#274031 - 09/09/09 11:09 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
OK! the gearbox next.

[Linked Image]

Gearbox was intact with no obvious external damage. Main shaft could be turned by hand but it was quite stiff, gear shifter lever could be moved by hand but would not select gear, may have done if I forced it, but I didn�t.

First thing to see if there is any oil in there and drain if there is, I removed the drain plug with catcher container held optimistically in hand, but nothing came out. A bit of a prod in the drain hole with a screw driver revealed a thick oily layer of sludge in the bottom of the gearbox shell. I therefore filled the gearbox with paraffin gave it a shake and drained a few times. This not only got the sludge out but the main shaft freed up and I could now easily select gears by hand, all four were present.

Next I removed the cover for a look in side, not too bad and all the major parts seem to be present and in the right place.

[Linked Image]

In close consultation with the workshop manual I removed the main and lay shaft gear assemblies and the selector mechanism. I will go through these parts and check for wear and damage later, but an initial check of the internal part against the parts booked confirmed that everything is there.

[Linked Image]

After giving the gearbox shell and cover a good clean in the part washer, the kick start assembly and bearings were removed. To get at the main shaft bearing I needed to make up a tool to remove the slotted lock ring, this was turned up on the lathe and worked well (much better than a hammer and screwdriver!).

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Close inspection of the gearbox shell revealed that at some time in the past there has been a bit of internal gearbox trauma, there are some internal gouges in the alloy internally below were the lay shaft sits and externally some surface cracks from the internal damage. I decided to repair this by grinding grooves in the cracks and welding using oxy/acetylene and Aluweld rods. This worked well and after a bit of buffing cleaned up OK, this repair is on the underside of the gearbox and will be hidden.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Next steps are to clean up the gearbox shell by bead blasting, reface the gasket surfaces, check threaded screw holes and polish the outer cover.


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#282460 - 11/04/09 11:06 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
�continuing with the gearbox overhaul.

I gave the gearbox shell and end cover a good clean in the blasting cabinet with glass beads, a through wash by hand in hot soapy water with a stiff brush, then finally a covert cycle in the dishwasher.

I then dressed up the gasket faces and the sealing area at the back of the gearbox shell where the primary cover fits against, on a glass plate with a mixture of grinding paste and paraffin. The gasket faces were actually in pretty good condition and only needed minimal resurfacing and truing.

The outer cover was then polished on the buffing wheel, after an initial going over with cutting compound to remove the worst of the dings and deep scratches, a couple of areas needed a light session with a small flap wheel in the Dremel (how did we ever manage in the days before the Dremel!).

The casing screws and other tapped holes were then cleaned out using an appropriate tap and finally blasted clean with a combination of aerosol solvent and compressed air. I got a tip from one of the lads at a VOC meeting that the holes for the outer casing screws can usually be tapped a bit deeper to accommodate slightly longer screws, increasing thread engagement, I found this to be the case so did this. I found all the threads to be in good condition once they were cleaned up, so the helicoil set stayed in the toolbox � for now!

Following a detailed inspection of the gearbox internal parts, I found that only one of the lay shaft pinions had a bit too much corrosion on the face of about 2/3 of the teeth, so decided to replace it. The main shaft was also slightly bent, measuring a radial run out of 0.0015 at the nearest bearing surface to the centre when rotated between centres, as a new part was available from a reliable source, I decided to replace this also. The only other major parts that needed to be replaced were the sleeve gear and the kick start housing as the thrust cam face was badly worn and broken at the top, this could possibly have been repaired by building up with weld and some careful grinding, but again as a new good quality part was available, I decided to replace rather than repair. A parts order was then sent for these items and all bearings, bushes, seals and springs. I also ordered stainless replacements for some of the fasteners, turned some up myself and re-plated some of the originals for reuse.

To assist with cleaning up the gearbox internal parts I tried out the latest tool addition to my shed, an ultrasonic cleaner, this has proven to be a very useful piece of equipment and cleaned parts up - including all the hard to get to nooks and crannies in small parts - very well. It was also useful for giving parts a final clean after polishing before I nickel plated them using my home plating kit, with a noticeable improvement in the plating finish compared to the parts cleaned using the solvent and paper towel method that I had been using previously.

It was then necessary to make up yet another tool to support the pressed on lay shaft pinions for removal in the hydraulic press. Same old story, a few hours work making the tool for a few seconds use in removing the pinion; oh well, at least I should have all the special tools I need if I rebuild another Velocette.
Reassembly was reasonably straight forward after careful study of the various manuals, books and internet sources of information. This did however involve the usual line boring of pinion bushes (apparently reaming is not accurate enough) and adjustment of various clearances and end floats on shafts and spindles using shims that I have become accustomed to when working on a Velocette.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

After a couple (actually a bit more than a couple) of trial assemblies and checks for smooth gear selection and operation by turning by hand, everything was assembled using assembly lube, sealant and lock tight as necessary, I put a temporary fill of oil in to act as an internal preservative until the bike is ready to be run.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Next step is to make a start on the frame.


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#282498 - 11/05/09 3:44 am Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 12,081
Lannis Online content
Life member
Lannis  Online Content

Life member

Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 12,081
Central Virginia
That really is beautiful work, and thanks VERY much for making a photo-record of your setups and assembly work - it's inspiring!!

Lannis


OK, I admit it, I'm addicted to brake fluid.

But I can stop any time I want.
#282933 - 11/08/09 9:15 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
The first job on the frame was to straighten the bent footrest brackets. Both brackets were bent back around 15-20deg, evidence that the bike has had a previous hard life!

[Linked Image]

The brackets are pretty substantial and it was obvious that quite a bit of force would be required to get them straight. As the brackets are brazed to the frame tubes, the application of heat to assist was not an option as the brazing would almost certainly have melted before the brackets got hot enough to benefit proceedings.

Also - care would be needed to avoid distorting the lower frame tubes that the brackets are attached to.

The brackets not only support the footrests but also locate the bottom engine mounting bolt. I therefore decided to make up a spacer bar to fit tightly between the lugs where the engine would be mounted, the spaced bar was drilled and tapped in each end to accommodate studs and nuts to secure to the brackets. The intention being that this bar would rigidly support the brackets off of each other and provided that the straightening force was applied across the brackets, then there would be minimal stress transferred to the frame tubes.

I then cut and drilled a piece of 20mm thick plate and bolted it to one of the brackets and bolted the base plate of the hydraulic press to the other side. The press jig was then manoeuvred into place transversely across the frame, after aligning the hydraulic ram with the 20mm plate the jig was clamped to the base plate. The bracket was then straightened by jacking against the 20mm plate. Everything was then dismantled and reassembled the opposite way around and the other bracket straightened in the same way.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Finally - there was some localised distortion on the faces of the brackets where the footrest collars had indented them. This needed a bit of work with a file to bring back a flat consistent surface]p.

[Linked Image]

A trial fit of the footrests confirmed that everything was straight and true again.

Next step, to remove the front and rear ends, further check frame alignment and inspect the brazing at connections.


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#288312 - 12/10/09 10:27 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
�continuing with the frame, I removed the wheels and after getting the frame set level I checked for alignment using a combination of straight edges, spirit levels and a laser lever across the bore of the swing arm trunnion shaft, front and rear wheel spindles, head stock and engine mounts. Everything checked out with no frame distortion detected.

The forks and swing arm assembly were then removed and set aside for attention later.

Taking a closer look at the brazing of the frame tubes to the connection fitments - removing the paint as necessary - everything seemed to be sound.

I then went over the areas of the frame tubes that were most heavily corroded with a sanding disc and was pleased to find it was mostly just surface corrosion with only a couple of areas showing slight signs of surface pitting which buffed out with only a light sanding.

The centre stand was missing from the bike when I got it so I ordered a new pattern replacement which seems to be of a good enough quality but needed quite a bit of work involving filing, grinding, milling and finishing with a flap disc to make it a good fit and to tidy up some of the rough edges from the casting process.

[Linked Image]

The rear brake lever and side stand are both original items that were with the bike. Both were showing signs of wear at the fulcrum holes, these are not bushed and the holes were elongated. I therefore reamed the holes oversized until the holes were round and made up new oversized pins to suit.

[Linked Image]

The stands and brake lever were then trial fitted and after a bit more filing, shaping and refitting they were positioned right and functioned correctly.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Next I�ll give the frame and associated parts a final once over and make up some masking plugs for the swing arm bracket and steering head bearing areas and pay a visit to the local powder coating company that I use.


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#289010 - 12/14/09 10:40 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 790
jays375 Offline
BritBike Forum member
jays375  Offline
BritBike Forum member

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 790
pa.
Very nice detailed work.The next time you are woried about heating something don't.You can buy a spray on chemical that will stop the spread of the heat.It works really good,even seen it used on brake caliper bolts.Don't know what you have a available to you in Scotland though.You could try your welding supply stores.Worth checking into I think

Last edited by jays375; 12/14/09 10:41 pm.
#291451 - 12/30/09 12:56 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
�I got the frame and associated parts back from the powder coater, finished in gloss black.

First job was to remove the powder coating around the contact faces of the swinging arm trunnion bosses and the engine and gearbox mounting brackets with a flat file then run a hand reamer through the engine mounting bolt holes.

I then trial assembled the engine and gearbox plates in the frame, to verify that the new stainless steel bolts and spacer were the correct fit.

Next was to fit and size the new swinging arm trunnion shaft bushes. I left the old bushes in to protect the housing during the blasting and power coating process, so these were knocked out using a round drift. After tapping out the grease nipple holes and cleaning up the bush housing with a light sand with emery cloth, the trunnion bracket housing was given a good clean out and blast with compressed air.

I turned up a spiggoted boss with a hole through the centre to insert into the end of the trunnion bush and selected a large socket to fit over the opposite end of the bush housing and by inserting a length of threaded rod between the two, pulled the bushes into place, one at a time, marking first to ensure that the grease holes lined up.

The trunnion bushes needed to be line reamed to size after fitting to suit the new trunnion shaft. I had the right sized adjustable reamer but had to make up a pilot attachment assembly to fit to the end of the reamer to ensure that the bushes were reamed in alignment to each other.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#291497 - 12/30/09 10:45 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 89
Dawg Offline
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Dawg  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 89
England
How was the trunnion shaft going in Bry? I used the club's adjustable reamer that had a pilot attachment. I took measurement after measurement on the reamer - got it spot on with the red book and the trunnion shaft was an absolute pig going in - I know they're meant to be a pretty tight fit. It's in now, but mine seemed extremely reluctant....

One tip I was given by a club member - don't use the ineffective felt washers in between the swing arm and the trunnion shaft frame lug. Turn a couple of nylon washers and use those instead.


I'm really looking forward to the end result on your Venom - when I saw it in Cheshire, I thought it was too far gone to be honest, but I think it's going to look pretty damn special when you've finished it. Concours prize at Stafford!


Last edited by Steve Buckley; 12/30/09 11:04 pm.

1958 Velocette Venom
1960 Norton Dominator 99
1964 Velocette Venom Clubman Mk1
#291728 - 01/01/10 10:43 am Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Dawg]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
Originally Posted By: Steve Buckley
How was the trunnion shaft going in Bry? I used the club's adjustable reamer that had a pilot attachment. I took measurement after measurement on the reamer - got it spot on with the red book and the trunnion shaft was an absolute pig going in - I know they're meant to be a pretty tight fit. It's in now, but mine seemed extremely reluctant....

One tip I was given by a club member - don't use the ineffective felt washers in between the swing arm and the trunnion shaft frame lug. Turn a couple of nylon washers and use those instead.


I'm really looking forward to the end result on your Venom - when I saw it in Cheshire, I thought it was too far gone to be honest, but I think it's going to look pretty damn special when you've finished it. Concours prize at Stafford!



Happy New Year Steve!,

The trunnion shaft fitted OK with slight resistance on inserting requiring a light tap with a hide mallet, and turned by hand once in. I used metallic bushes and reamed to suit the new 1.25 trunnion shaft which was non-tapered. I assume that you used acetylcopolymer bushes from the club spares scheme if you were using their reamer, from what I have read these should be a tight fit.

Thanks for the tip on the nylon washer, I have a set of replacement felt ones but was a bit skeptical about how effective they would be, I see that club spares lists bonded rubber seals an option but I like the idea of making my own from nylon.

BTW, out of curiosity does the club reamer look anything like the one that I made up (see picture in previous post)?

Bry


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#291831 - 01/01/10 9:46 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,468
HawaiianTiger Online content
BritBike Forum member
HawaiianTiger  Online Content

BritBike Forum member

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,468
Maui Hawaii
Bry,
There's a lot of reality programs on TV these days with bumbling idiots slapping together ugly choppers ands such.
For my money, I would love to see you re-manufacturing one of these beauties with patience and care such as you demonstrate. That would be programming worth watching!
Bill


Bikes
1974 Commando
1985 Honda Nighthawk 650
1957 Thunderbird/T110 "Flying Tiger"
Antique Fans: Loads of Emersons (Two six wingers) plus gyros and orbiters.
#294162 - 01/15/10 11:27 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
...engine and gearbox assembled into the frame. This was pretty straight forward, the only slight problem was that the bottom engine fixing bolt seemed a bit too loose in the threaded hole in the frame lug that it fits into, closer inspection revealed that the thread was a bit worn so I decided to fit a helicoil which made the fit much better and the bolt felt a lot more secure when I torqued it up.

I fitted the centre and side stands, rear brake pedal assembly and bolted together the swinging arm assembly to the trunnion shaft.

Next job is to make up a couple of tools, one for clamping the ends of the swinging arm and the other to align both sides for the final bolt up.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#318280 - 06/13/10 11:38 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
Things have been a bit slow on this project lately, due to mainly work commitments and some other smaller projects that I decided to get finished.

Anyway - I�ve been concentrating on the front end and have now got the forks rebuilt and ready for assembly onto the bike.

After a strip down and check of the components, I found the forks to be in reasonable condition with all the main parts present and correct. There was some dings and dents in the outer shrouds and the headlight brackets; but a couple of hours with the panel beating hammers and dollys had them straightened out (literally!), and they were taken to a local company, together with the yoke assembly, for powder coating gloss black.

Due to the construction of the fork sliders where the end fitments are soft soldered to the tubes, I decided not to risk get them power coated for fear that the heat involved in the process would compromise the soldered joints, so after sealing them, I blast cleaned and painted them myself.

Internally - the stanchions were not that bad with only minor signs of corrosion and some wear where the external springs had been rubbing, but with the availability of good quality replacements I decided to fit new ones. These were however for later model Velocettes; the only difference that I could see was that the original ones were dual diameter, 1.240� at the lower part and 1.250� at the upper, whereas the new ones are 1.250� along the entire length. This did not present any problem as the part that fits into the yokes is the same diameter and only the upper bush and oil seal needed to be changed fit the larger diameter. I order the correct sized oil seals and decided to reuse the old upper bushes which although slightly worn still had enough material to bore out to suit the new larger diameter stanchions. I believe the bush material to be Oilite, so a bit of care was needed when boring these to prevent dragging the material and fouling the pours of the Oilite. I therefore used a sharp pointed boring TC tool, which seemed to work OK. Also - the original stanchions have a small radially drilled vent hole at the top, I was going to drill the replacements to make them the same, but after a bit of research on this decided not to as there didn�t seem to be a problem with later models where this hole was omitted, possibly due to improved oil seal technology eliminating the need for a vent, we�ll see!.

The hydraulic dampening unit was found to be OK and free of wear so only needed a good clean out and rebuild.

Reassembly was pretty straight forward, although the replacement springs needed a bit of grinding work to get the ends right for locating into the housings on the top of the sliders, a good fit is necessary here as it is the �screwing in� effect of the springs into these housings that retains the oil seals.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#318355 - 06/14/10 1:22 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 12,081
Lannis Online content
Life member
Lannis  Online Content

Life member

Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 12,081
Central Virginia
The nice work continues! Thanks!

Remember, I'm pullin' for ya! We're all in this together!

Lannis


OK, I admit it, I'm addicted to brake fluid.

But I can stop any time I want.
#319934 - 06/23/10 11:25 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Lannis]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Bry Offline
Bry  Offline



Joined: May 2006
Posts: 257
Scotland
I�ve now got the forks assembled onto the frame. This required the manufacture of yet another special tool. I decided to make up a simple screw jacking device to pull the fork stanchion through the lower yoke where a split bush locates it. The split bush is quite a tight fit and needs to be presented squarely to the hole in the yoke and held straight while it is drawn in. I initially tried to do this by hand without success, hence the commissioning of the jacking tool.

With the forks located in place I also used the jacking tool and a dial gauge to get the stanchion positions correct and even, for locating the top yoke to give the correct fit on the head race bearings and also to slightly compress the rubber buffers that hold the the headlight brackets snuggly between the top and bottom yokes.

I replaced the original cup and ball head race bearings with taper roller bearings purchased with the bottom bearing inner ID pre-ground to suit the stem journal.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


1946 Velocette MSS
1955 Triton (project)
1959 Velocette Venom
1966 Triumph T120
#320032 - 06/24/10 2:17 pm Re: '59 Velocette Venom [Re: Bry]  
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 12,081
Lannis Online content
Life member
Lannis  Online Content

Life member

Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 12,081
Central Virginia
Wow, when they talk about these Velos being "an engineer's bike", they're not kidding. That's quite an elaborate fork assembly tool. The one for the taper-fit BSA fork is MUCH simpler ....

Keep us apprised ...

Lannis


OK, I admit it, I'm addicted to brake fluid.

But I can stop any time I want.
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