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Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30964
11/06/07 9:25 pm
11/06/07 9:25 pm
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 2,775
Comox BC Canada
G
Gordo in Comox Offline OP
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Gordo in Comox  Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 2,775
Comox BC Canada
The winter plan calls for new valves and guides for my 1965 A65. Currently I have cast iron guides and steel valves but my supplier has both cast iron and bronze guides plus steel and stainless steel valves. What is the best combination?

Gordo


Without frequent roadside repairs there is no fun in riding!
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Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30965
11/06/07 9:38 pm
11/06/07 9:38 pm
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,571
Sydney Australia
B
BSA_WM20 Online content
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BSA_WM20  Online Content
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,571
Sydney Australia
Gordo.
What type of guides depends upon what type of valves.
The guides need to be harder than the valves so that the stems wear rather than the guides as replaceing the valves is much easier than the guides and you can do it at infinitum with little problems for the head.
OTOH there is a very limited number of times that you can remove the guides before the head is cactus.

For this reason I have changed my ideas & go for guide sleeveing rather than guide changing.
If you do decide to replace the guides, remove the old ones first, then check the head for damage &/ or wear as often removal takes significant amounts of the head with them thus requiring you to replace them with oversized guides but you will not know till the old ones are out & you measure up ( or rather down) the hole.


Bike Beesa
Trevor
Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30966
11/06/07 10:24 pm
11/06/07 10:24 pm
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,572
ca, us
D
DMadigan Online content
BritBike Forum member
DMadigan  Online Content
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D
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,572
ca, us
Phosphor bronze (Ampco 45 or similar) is used on modern engines. That with hard chromed stems will last. Plus you can put in oil seals.

Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30967
11/06/07 10:45 pm
11/06/07 10:45 pm
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
A
Adam M. Online content
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Adam M.  Online Content
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A
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,611
Mississauga, Ontario.
I do not have good experience with phosphor bronze guides in A65 ( specially exhaust guides get used fast ). I changed them to cast iron + Black Diamond valves and after 1500 miles had a opportunity to check them ( seized engine smile ).
They didnt have any sign of getting worn - no difference comparing to the new ones.

Adam M.

Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30969
11/07/07 7:25 am
11/07/07 7:25 am
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 27
Norway
M
MiG16 Offline
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MiG16  Offline
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M
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 27
Norway
Cast iron has self-lubricating properties that bronze lacks. Cast iron could be an advantage when valve gear is inadequately lubricated.

Michael

Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30970
11/07/07 2:41 pm
11/07/07 2:41 pm
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 197
Ipswich England
wbabojo Offline
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wbabojo  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 197
Ipswich England
I use 'COLSIBRO', an alloy of copper,silicon and bronze. This enables the guide to be made with a 0.001" valve to guide clearance. This makes for a quieter engine, less likely to bounce and rattle. I've had two BSA unit twins with this mod, work done by P.Seager Engineering, IPSWICH UK. He turns a guide from scratch on the lathe after measuring the head and rather than an off the shelf guide, his actually WORK and FIT properly. Highly recommended A+


Gavin
You can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear.
Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30971
11/08/07 12:54 am
11/08/07 12:54 am
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 398
hamilton on. can.
H
highway Offline
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highway  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 398
hamilton on. can.
A Petro Canada told me the gas we're getting here,( unleaded, low sulpher, ethanol) no longer has any lubrication qualities. Transfer of bronze to the valve stem causing stickng or siezure is not uncommon. (mainly on Triumphs) I've switched to Rowe cast guides and black nitrated valves, no sticking and long life.
The vast majority of engines now use cast guides, high quality valves. Rick

Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30972
11/08/07 1:09 am
11/08/07 1:09 am
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 46
Auckland New Zealand
L
Lightning 7a Offline
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Lightning 7a  Offline
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 46
Auckland New Zealand
Cast Iron guides for me every time valves are easier to replace than guides as suggested above Cheers

Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30973
11/08/07 10:30 am
11/08/07 10:30 am
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 724
bromley uk
N
norton bob Offline
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norton bob  Offline
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N
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 724
bromley uk
If the lubrication is poor (domminator)cast iron is the only way.If lots of oil you will need seals on a shorter guide(not good for support)Ho-Hum,round in circles,how about a rotary engine!

Re: Cast Iron or Bronze Guides for A65? #30974
11/09/07 5:16 pm
11/09/07 5:16 pm
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,511
argyll. scotland, uk
gavin eisler Online content
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gavin eisler  Online Content
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,511
argyll. scotland, uk
iron exhaust guides and bronze inlets for me, maybe its just my bike but the bronze exhaust guides wore very rapidly.
Cheers
pod


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod

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