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What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? #251248
05/01/09 5:46 pm
05/01/09 5:46 pm
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 625
Winter Springs, FL
Tom Sanders Offline OP
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Tom Sanders  Offline OP
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 625
Winter Springs, FL
I need to find a big deep wall socket to remove the nut on the counter shaft sprocket.

What size do I need?


LONG LIVE LOCKTITE

74 Roadster 880cc
1962 Norton 650SS
75 Ducati 860GT
1968 Commando Fastback SN 126157
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Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Tom Sanders] #251276
05/01/09 8:12 pm
05/01/09 8:12 pm
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 211
California U.S.
Hortons Norton Offline
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Hortons Norton  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 211
California U.S.
1 1/4 LH thread

Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Hortons Norton] #251300
05/01/09 11:33 pm
05/01/09 11:33 pm
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 338
FLORIDA
A
Alan Prudhomme Offline
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Alan Prudhomme  Offline
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A

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 338
FLORIDA
I bought 2 complete sets of 3/4 drive sockets (cold forged) Metric and SAE at Harbor Frieght on sale for $43.00 ea. one of the SAE sockets will fit it with the mainshaft removed or you could cut the socket in half and weld a large pipe nipple in between long enough to clear the mainshaft. I think it will be hard or impossible to find a socket that deep and if you do it would probably cost more than this whole set. I use them all the time mostly for seal drivers... they work great, pick through the set and find the perfect size to fit the seal every time. That nut is hard to get off in the bike because it will rotate when force is applied. You will need to leave the chain on and adjust all the slack out of it and have someone stand on the brake when you twist the wrench. I use a large crescent wrench to do the job. This is one of those things that will get your friends to tell you you have a foul mouth. I do it alone with the crescent wrench in one hand and a strap wrench wraped around the sprocket in the other to teach myself dicipline. I might add my hair has turned grey.

Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Alan Prudhomme] #251315
05/02/09 1:12 am
05/02/09 1:12 am
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,610
Springfield Nebraska
Richrd Offline
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Richrd  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,610
Springfield Nebraska
inch and a half. I went to the pawn shop and bought a wrench then torch the box end and bent it for clearance.

To lock the sprocket in place, I loop a piece of chain around the sprocket and clamp it with vice grips. Works every time if I turn the right direction.

Last edited by Richrd; 05/02/09 1:14 am.

Rich (member ThreeMustGetBeers)
"It's not always about going fast. Sometimes it's nice to slow down" (Wendy E.2016)

69 bonney
72 commando
75 commando interstate
06 Suzu..Suzu.. uh appliance
couple of beesas a ducati
and the Snake Bike
and a Honda?
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Richrd] #251325
05/02/09 2:36 am
05/02/09 2:36 am
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 23
Ontario
T
Thomas Offline
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Thomas  Offline
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T

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 23
Ontario
Tom
I am physically holding the counter shaft sprocket nut in my hand and my digital Mitutoyo mic shows 1.48" across the flats. That would indicate a 1 1/2" socket.
Mind you I am just rebuilding a gearbox for a 72 750 but I think they are all the same.
Correct me if I am wrong.
Regards,


72CCRider
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Thomas] #251343
05/02/09 4:40 am
05/02/09 4:40 am
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 211
California U.S.
Hortons Norton Offline
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Hortons Norton  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 211
California U.S.
Sorry for the bad info. Tom, I am glad there are those that have a better memory than mine. Thanks guys for correcting me, Have a great weekend and ride safe, Chuck.

Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Thomas] #251389
05/02/09 1:53 pm
05/02/09 1:53 pm
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,279
Hamilton, Mass. USA
D
Dave Comeau Offline

Crew Chief
Dave Comeau  Offline

Crew Chief
D

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,279
Hamilton, Mass. USA
Originally Posted By: Thomas
Tom
I am physically holding the counter shaft sprocket nut in my hand and my digital Mitutoyo mic shows 1.48" across the flats. That would indicate a 1 1/2" socket.
Mind you I am just rebuilding a gearbox for a 72 750 but I think they are all the same.
Correct me if I am wrong.
Regards,


And for those without a chart on the garage wall....
1.48" = 1"BS or 7/8"W

I also bodge it with 1-1/2"sae


dynodave
BSA 3 1961-1963
Ducati 3 1992-2002
Norton many 1951-1975
87 Serv-Equip 100HP MC brake dynamometer,
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Dave Comeau] #251398
05/02/09 3:14 pm
05/02/09 3:14 pm
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 23
Ontario
T
Thomas Offline
BritBike Forum member
Thomas  Offline
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T

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 23
Ontario
A tid bit of info out of the INOA Tech Digest:
The nut is a left hand thread, is beveled on one side and flat on the other side. The beveled edge goes against the sprocket face. If it is assembled with the flat side against the sprocket, it acts like a spring nut and is very difficult to remove.
80 ft/lbs touque. good luck


72CCRider
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Thomas] #251411
05/02/09 4:37 pm
05/02/09 4:37 pm
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,279
Hamilton, Mass. USA
D
Dave Comeau Offline

Crew Chief
Dave Comeau  Offline

Crew Chief
D

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,279
Hamilton, Mass. USA
Also little known is that lock tab is dual sided. With the two holes in the sprocket and the dual sided feature, you can always find one position that will align with out modifying/elongating the lock washer screw hole (as I have often seen).
It is generally accepted that 80ft/lb is to much and will start to shear or deform the main shaft circlip.
I've not done a destructive test yet, but heard that 40-50 is more like it for the commando style shaft.
lock screw is 2 BA threads

ADDED
Thanks Dennis, you're right, what was I thinking....wrong nut of course
The sprocket nut should be real tight (LH)
beerchug

Last edited by Dave Comeau; 05/03/09 1:11 pm.

dynodave
BSA 3 1961-1963
Ducati 3 1992-2002
Norton many 1951-1975
87 Serv-Equip 100HP MC brake dynamometer,
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Dave Comeau] #251524
05/03/09 11:19 am
05/03/09 11:19 am
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 888
Annapolis, MD
Dennis B, R.I.P. Offline
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Dennis B, R.I.P.  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 888
Annapolis, MD
Dave,
You said:
"It is generally accepted that 80ft/lb is to much and will start to shear or deform the main shaft circlip.
I've not done a destructive test yet, but heard that 40-50 is more like it for the commando style shaft."

Are you confusing the Clutch fixing nut with the
Countershaft sprocket nut?
The sprocket nut needs to be torqued down to 80-90 ft. lbs.
The clutch fixing nut only needs about 40 ft. lbs.
(or damage can be done to the circlip)
Cheers
Dennis B


Member # 182
'73 750 Commando
'72 Combat Commando
'71 Triumph Blazer
'69 Victors
'68 Starfire
'51 Royal Enfield 250 'S'

Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Dennis B, R.I.P.] #251532
05/03/09 12:12 pm
05/03/09 12:12 pm
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 301
Connecticut
maylar Offline
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maylar  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 301
Connecticut
I too have looked for a deep socket to fit and couldn't find any. They all come up about 1/2" shy of engaging the nut. Someday I'll cut and weld 2 sockets together so I can use a torque wrench, but for now my BFW is a dual box wrench (1-7/16 on one side, 1-1/2 on the other) that I got from Sears. The tool angles at the ends just right for clearance and leverage. One foot on the rear brake and yank hard...


Dave from CT
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: maylar] #251541
05/03/09 12:59 pm
05/03/09 12:59 pm
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 52
Hartford, Alabama
W
williewhyte Offline
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williewhyte  Offline
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 52
Hartford, Alabama
Hi, Gents! Got my 1 1/2" socket at auto-zone, didn't cost much. My technique is a small ratchet strap on the brake LEVER, as i've previously broke a brake cable using pedal method. I also use a 5' "persuader" pipe from Lowe's that slips over my 1/2" breaker bar AND my exhaust nut wrench. Hope this helps, see ya at Blowing Rock in 1.5 weeks!!!
Cheers, Willie


Willie
68 750 Fastback (Norton)
75 1000 Goldwing project
77 360t (honda)
93 750 Ducati Supersport (EURO-SPEC)
96 dyna Wyde=Glyde
97 750 Ducati Monster
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Dennis B, R.I.P.] #251581
05/03/09 3:24 pm
05/03/09 3:24 pm
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 338
FLORIDA
A
Alan Prudhomme Offline
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Alan Prudhomme  Offline
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A

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 338
FLORIDA
I love these threads....80 ft/lb....if you can torque the sprocket nut while the trans is in the bike....by your self....??? Did you say your name was SUPER MAN.
I have changed many worn sprockets over the years. To begin with when you get the nut tight and the lock washer doesn't line up properly (both ways) you may have to loosten the nut a hair to get it to fit the screw hole. You say file the hole??? Norton Villers would have made the lock washer with an elongated hole if this had any importance. These threads are supposed to be to help NEW NORTON OWNERS learn how to maintain these classic bikes. All they do is confuse some poor soul that is already overwhelmed with all the new stuff he has to learn. I have a box full of torque wrenches and the ONLY bolts you will ever see me torque on a NORTON are on the cylendar head. We should keep simple things simple...maybe we can keep a few of the WONDERFULL BIKES from being pieced out every day on eBay.

Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Alan Prudhomme] #251910
05/05/09 6:08 am
05/05/09 6:08 am
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 716
Out There!
N
Nick Offline
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Nick  Offline
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N

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 716
Out There!
Sounds primitive, but a lot of folks just use a punch, either a center punch or a drift punch (after grinding a small flat on the nut). You can get plenty of torque on the nut with a punch, and if you use some Locktite when re-installing (or the lock washer) the nut ain't goin' nowhere.


When people who should have known better cautioned me about the dangers of motorcycle racing, I always told them that a fear of death is nothing more than a fear of life in disguise.
Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: Nick] #251922
05/05/09 9:13 am
05/05/09 9:13 am
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 554
belgium
ludwig Offline
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ludwig  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 554
belgium
I find the easiest way to lock the sprocket is with a socket ( or short tube ) placed between a sprocket tooth and the swingarm .works in both directions and with or without chain .

Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: ludwig] #251932
05/05/09 11:12 am
05/05/09 11:12 am
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 162
FRANCE- DINARD -BRITTANY
marinatlas Offline
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marinatlas  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 162
FRANCE- DINARD -BRITTANY
Hi there , as Ludwig , but in my case use a big lump of hard wood , between teeth and swingie, need to change that wedge only when those hungry teeth had eaten /chewed it........

Re: What size socket to remove big nut on counter shaft sprocket? [Re: marinatlas] #251958
05/05/09 2:49 pm
05/05/09 2:49 pm
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 338
FLORIDA
A
Alan Prudhomme Offline
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Alan Prudhomme  Offline
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A

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 338
FLORIDA
GOOD POST!!! Going to try locking the sprocket like this next time it has to come off. THATS HALF THE FIGHT! I used to use a brass punch to knock the sprocket nut loose until I cracked the nut in half. That takes you out of action until a new one arives.


Moderated by  Dave Comeau 


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