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#631363 - 12/23/15 2:36 pm BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism  
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 41
FLYNN54 Offline
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FLYNN54  Offline
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MOTHERWELL NORTH LANARKSHIRE S...
Does anyone know if the clutch cam lift mechanism for a Triumph T140 can be used on a 1971 OIF BSA A65L (inside timing cover)? Triumph part is 57-7033 (plus another 6 parts numbers according to age). BSA part number is 57-4049. Triumph part is freely available in the UK, alas BSA part is not. Currently getting the "dreaded" clicking noise when pulling in the clutch. I will try very carefully adjusting the pushrod clearance to eliminate the clicking of the clutch mechanism. If not successful replacement may be necessary. Previous owner had fitted a longer than standard clutch adjuster bolt and nut on the clutch side outer lift plate - which fouled the inside of the inspection cover when the cable was pulled. The ball bearing on the push rod was also missing ( now added). The penny dropped (an Epiphany moment) when my left wrist gave way trying to operate the clutch lever. I have also fitted a new cable. Clicking started when the correct adjuster bolt/nut and ball were added to the push rod. Push rod is in good condition - not mushroomed in any way. Clutch plates are as near new. Correct OE handle bar clutch lever is fitted.
Thank you as always for any comments/advice and Happy Christmas to everyone on the forum.
Regards from "Red nosed" Flynn. (Garage Heater is bust !!!)
m

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#631378 - 12/23/15 4:10 pm Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: FLYNN54]  
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 541
Ed V Offline
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Ed V  Offline

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Howard City, MI
It sounds to me like you need to go back to square one and readjust your clutch cross rod adjustment, loosen the cable adjustment so you have a lot of free play then adjust the cross rod at the pressure plate, run it down until you know it is bottomed then back it off 1/4 turn and lock down the jam nut now go ahead and adjust the cable. Usually the clicking you hear is the three balls rolling our of their seats due to poor adjustment nothing more.

#631410 - 12/23/15 8:09 pm Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: FLYNN54]  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,405
gavin eisler Online content
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gavin eisler  Online Content
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argyll. scotland, uk
The triumph part does not fit an A65.


71 Devimead A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
#631425 - 12/23/15 10:43 pm Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: gavin eisler]  
Joined: Apr 2007
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BrizzoBrit Offline
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BrizzoBrit  Offline

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Brisbane, Australia
Hi,
Clicking indicates the balls are running out of the top of the ramp. This means you would need to back off the clutch pressure plate adjuster, then the cable until the balls reach the bottom of their ramp. At this point, the rotating ramp that the cable goes into wont go backwards any further without starting to lift again (ie bottomed-out). You want it so the balls and rotating ramp just start to lift from this point or be a tiny bit into the lifting action as you start to to pull the clutch lever. Then do as ED says, screw pressure plate adjuster in until it takes up the slack and back-off a bit (think Ed says 1/4 turn which would be right). You just want a little bit of clearance at this point. If you are fouling the primary cover then plate stack is too thick or as you suggest you need to trim the length of the adjuster or get correct length one.

This actuation mechanism requires correct adjustment on both sides to work best.

HTH

Apologies if I'm telling you what you know.

Ray


BSA 1969 A65F
BSA 1966 A65H
Triumph 1968 T120
Kawasaki A1R
& too many projects!
#631429 - 12/23/15 11:24 pm Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: FLYNN54]  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,196
Mark Z Online content
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Mark Z  Online Content
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Posts: 4,196
Owego, NY, USA
Before I would fettle too much more with the adjustments, I would take a look at the lifter mechanism. Wear is obvious, balls out of round, uneven ramps. A common cause of failure is from rust, so look for that too. If it looks ok, then at least you'll know you're working with good parts.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
#631448 - 12/24/15 4:02 am Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: FLYNN54]  
Joined: Aug 2012
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DoubleDiamond Offline
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DoubleDiamond  Offline
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Hampshire, England
I found the the Triumph plate, the part the screws to the timing cover, will fit to the BSA but you need to cut in a little at one edge so it clears the mounting screw. The Triumph part doesn't have the cut-out.


BSA: '71 B175; '68 B25; '71 A65; '71 A75
Triumph: '87 T140; '72 T150v
#631684 - 12/25/15 8:29 pm Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: DoubleDiamond]  
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FLYNN54 Offline
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FLYNN54  Offline
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Posts: 41
MOTHERWELL NORTH LANARKSHIRE S...
Thank you for your comments and advice. I have tried to adjust the "free play " in the clutch mechanism so that the cam just moves when the pushrod engages. The clearance seems to be quite critical as the "clicking" has ceased for now !! By adjusting the screw/nut on the drive side of the clutch whilst feeling for the beginning of any movement ( through the inspection hole near the cable end) of the rotating cam on the timing side minus 1/2 a turn on the pushrod I seem to have the correct adjustment. One strange thing - too much grease on the ball bearings in the lift can plates made the clicking more pronounced - it seems. When tightening the allen screws on the timing cover - the plate seems to distort quite easily causing the kick start shaft to stick a little. A gentle curve (near to the airbox) in the routing of the clutch cable makes quite a difference to the weight of pull on the clutch lever. Simple/ obvious observation ( often missed?) I know - but quite a difference. Thanks once again for your collective help. Best regards from John Flynn.

Last edited by FLYNN54; 12/25/15 8:56 pm.
#636118 - 01/20/16 9:33 pm Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: FLYNN54]  
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FLYNN54 Offline
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FLYNN54  Offline
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MOTHERWELL NORTH LANARKSHIRE S...
A quick up date. I tried all suggestions given ( thanks once again) and after careful adjustment from both sides of the clutch - lifter/pushrod/ adjuster nut - the clicking came back. I stripped down the clutch lifter mechanism again and the "boss" (wife) pointed out in passing boredom - that one of the ball bearings was bigger that the others (pause for child like jokes about "balls" at this point...)
Parts manual says all 3 should be 3/8 (9.3mm) - one was 10mm.The lift plate was turning at an angle - enough to cause the click. I also added a new cable which proved to be 1/2 inch too short (pt no WW 80679)- false economy. Burton Bikes to the rescue pt no 60-2456 genuine old BSA stock item. Clutch now not clicking. Table cloth now has grease marks on it - I wanted to avoid ball bearings going "awol" in the garage ( happens every time - to me) so I did the "deed" in the house.
Moral - genuine parts are better than pattern (more often than not) in this case. Check the size of your ball bearings if they start clicking - or if married ask your (own) wife to do it.
Best regards.
John (one of my 3 balls is bigger than the other 2) Flynn (sorry)!!

#636133 - 01/20/16 11:14 pm Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: FLYNN54]  
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Mark Z Online content
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Mark Z  Online Content
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Owego, NY, USA
Good detective work, and thanks for reporting back the solution! Different size balls in the clutch release mech., who'da thunk it? Makes one wonder how they got that way, eh?

Oh, and be sure to pass the compliment on to the boss...



Last edited by Mark Z; 01/20/16 11:16 pm.

Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
#636545 - 01/23/16 2:13 am Re: BSA A65 / Triumph T140 Clutch cam thrust mechanism [Re: Mark Z]  
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DavidP Online content
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DavidP  Online Content

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Gnashville
Originally Posted By Mark Z
Makes one wonder how they got that way, eh?

They got that way the same way that 6mm bolts get screwed into Triumph rocker boxes, "I think this fits."
Those balls ain't hard to find, just make sure that they're all the same size. Go to the hardware store, NOT the Home Depot, and replace all three balls.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"

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