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Originally Posted by Motolab
Regarding BSA brand and Mahindra.... well Triumph did the same, it did not exist anymore... just revived and everybody is buying that...sort off, 80% of the Triumph club members attending on a “new” triumph these day’s (Most of them made in Thailand)
I'll give the Bloor Triumphs a pass. The name and many assets were bought from the Receiver, and the new owner shrewdly licenced the right to manufacture T140s to L.F. Harris. This kept the brand alive to the public, with new machines being manufactured until the new factory and designs we ready to manufacture the new range.

Apart from the original Triumph company, the current incarnation may well have stayed in the same hands for longer than any of its predecessors.

I like my Co-Op T140 and 1974 NVT T150, which have quite different characters. I also quite enjoy my 2011 Hinkley Sprint GT, which again has a quite different character. As a transverse 3-cylinder road bike, it does have a common basis with the Tridents and Rocket 3s, and with enough imagination is something the Small Heath and Meriden factories could have produced with sufficient capital and cash flow.

I think Husqvarna also has a clear line of descent from the original company, but I haven't paid serious attention to modern off-roaders for quite some time.

The others had extremely long periods out of production, and many changes of ownership in between, so do seem to have been largely branding exercises.

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The days of brand names necessarily reflecting their parent company or location of manufacture are long gone. We as BSA owners should not be troubled by this; we just need to identify our steeds as VINTAGE BSAs, just as a distinction has developed between old and new Triumphs, all arguably fine motorcycles, but of needs different, notwithstanding some degree of lineage.

There have also been initiatives in retro styling, which is really another topic; each example needs to be judged on its own merit. But to produce exact replicas of vintage motorcycles is untenable, and not even desirable, except to a very narrow niche of wealthy fanatics (case in point, the hand-built $22,000 Norton Manx replica that came out a few years ago).


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I am not talking about, if i like them or not.... (as i do). Hinkley Triumph Is a totally different firm than the “meriden” Triumph firm, just “a”name imho..... point i want to make is... what is wrong with reviving brand names if done proper....

So give Manindra a chance...... Mark Z is saying it right imho..


Originally Posted by Shane in Oz
I think Husqvarna also has a clear line of descent from the original company, but I haven't paid serious attention to modern off-roaders for quite some time.
.

Husqvarna was from Sweden..... brandname sold to Italy i believe, then To austria (KTM) now it is a luxury “label” from KTM, with KTM technology and a husky badge....

See what happens, people are buying it.... and why not.... if only a new Mahindra BSA becomes as cool and good as a Husqvarna Vitpilen 701, i going to buy one! Just i do not want them in the (vintage) BSA Owners club where i am a member off.


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Originally Posted by Mark Z
The days of brand names necessarily reflecting their parent company or location of manufacture are long gone. We as BSA owners should not be troubled by this; we just need to identify our steeds as VINTAGE BSAs, just as a distinction has developed between old and new Triumphs, all arguably fine motorcycles, but of needs different, notwithstanding some degree of lineage.

There have also been initiatives in retro styling, which is really another topic; each example needs to be judged on its own merit. But to produce exact replicas of vintage motorcycles is untenable, and not even desirable, except to a very narrow niche of wealthy fanatics (case in point, the hand-built $22,000 Norton Manx replica that came out a few years ago).


This BSA owner isn't "troubled" by an Indian entrepreneur buying a 50-year-old name. Lots of people (Excelsior, Henderson, etc) have done it.

I was just wondering what's "exciting" about it. India and China make all kinds of bikes for the world market .... Bajaj, Mahindra, Changyeng, etc. already. How does it make it somehow better to stick a "BSA" decal on one of what they already make? Far as I know, none of what they make now is exciting enough to make me (or anyone else on the list, as far as I know) want to buy one, and they're already available ....

Lannis


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And what happened to the "new" Excelsiors and Hendersons?

How many twists and turns have the names "Norton" and "Indian" gone through?

It's all a bit silly, really.

Just buy a Honda and slap a BSA sticker on the tank. Today's new riders won't know the difference.

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The problem with rebirthing an old name is it comes with expectations
While not a rebirthing, the expectations of HD riders is a prime example
HD are big and go ker thump,,,,ker thump,,,,,ker thump,,,,ker thump
When they tried to introduce their Bantam , pup wasn't it , it was a dismal market failure cause if it did not go ,,,,ker thump,,,,ker thump,,,,ker thump it just was not a Harley .
A bit latter on they realised they needed an entry level bike to get younger riders in and tried the rebadged Aeromachi and again it failed dismally
Finally they worked out that the only small Harley the market would accept was a scaled down version, they release the 400 and down here it was a run away success because it lived up the markets preconviciton of what a Harley should look & sound like.

So what should a BSA sound like ?
How should a BSA go ?

Big problem here because MY BSA's go thud , thud, thud or bark bark bark and none of these would pass modern noise laws.
Goldie riders ( or wanny be riders ) will expect something that goes THUMP THUMP THUMP and again it ain't going to get approval anywhere outside the 3rd world
A 10 riders will be expecting some thing that goes Putter, putter putter and has a lot of low end torque, again not going to happen either .
Etc etc etc

Learners have no idea what a BSA is or was unless they are the children of one of us , so again wasted on them as well .
If they use the BSA name in SE Asia , where there are hundreds if not thousands of BSA's still in daily use then it would make good sense but reintroducing the name on a bike with absolutely noting in common with anything that carried the BSA baded in the past into a market with little to no memory of what a BSA was is asking to fail, like all of the other attempts to leverage off an old name
Any one remember the "new" Ariel of a few years back, did any ever see the light of day ?


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Originally Posted by Lannis
I was just wondering what's "exciting" about it. India and China make all kinds of bikes for the world market .... Bajaj, Mahindra, Changyeng, etc. already. How does it make it somehow better to stick a "BSA" decal on one of what they already make? Far as I know, none of what they make now is exciting enough to make me (or anyone else on the list, as far as I know) want to buy one, and they're already available ....

Lannis

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what they come up with, but I'm not optimistic either. I think the new RE twin is as close as they're going to get to retro styling, and I've heard some lackluster reviews on those. I'm not sure what sort of new bike would excite me.


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Originally Posted by BSA_WM20
So what should a BSA sound like ?
How should a BSA go ?

Big problem here because MY BSA's go thud , thud, thud or bark bark bark and none of these would pass modern noise laws.
Goldie riders ( or wanny be riders ) will expect something that goes THUMP THUMP THUMP and again it ain't going to get approval anywhere outside the 3rd world
A 10 riders will be expecting some thing that goes Putter, putter putter and has a lot of low end torque, again not going to happen either .
Etc etc etc
A BSA can sound like whatever you want it to sound like.
It can go nang-nang-nang like a Bantam, thud, bark or thump like a single, putter like a pre-unit twin, growl like a unit twin or howl like a triple (all within current noise regulations, of course). Rose-tint aside, BSA in its heyday produced a wide range of motorcycles for just about every market segment.
By the same token, what should a Honda sound like?


Originally Posted by BSA_WM20
Learners have no idea what a BSA is or was unless they are the children of one of us , so again wasted on them as well .
If they use the BSA name in SE Asia , where there are hundreds if not thousands of BSA's still in daily use then it would make good sense but reintroducing the name on a bike with absolutely noting in common with anything that carried the BSA baded in the past into a market with little to no memory of what a BSA was is asking to fail, like all of the other attempts to leverage off an old name
Marketing to "first world" countries could be quite a challenge. It's been a long time since there were large numbers of Small Heath BSAs around, and even then BSAs were seen largely as well-engineered (for the time), reliable (for the time) value for money machines.
Mahindra has the advantage of massive resources, and has a similar reputation of producing quite a range of adequate but not exciting, value for money tractors. Taking a similar approach to motorcycles may work well for them, or they may try for the more expensive end of the market.

Electric motorcycle are a new market segment, so may work out really well for a well-financed company.

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Originally Posted by Mark Z
Originally Posted by Lannis
I was just wondering what's "exciting" about it. India and China make all kinds of bikes for the world market .... Bajaj, Mahindra, Changyeng, etc. already. How does it make it somehow better to stick a "BSA" decal on one of what they already make? Far as I know, none of what they make now is exciting enough to make me (or anyone else on the list, as far as I know) want to buy one, and they're already available ....

Lannis

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what they come up with, but I'm not optimistic either. I think the new RE twin is as close as they're going to get to retro styling, and I've heard some lackluster reviews on those. I'm not sure what sort of new bike would excite me.


That is strange, i have not spoken to anyone who has ridden one of the new enfields or owns one, that has a bad word to
say about them. They are not a rocket ship but the blokes i've spoken to all say they will sit at 70-80mph very happily. For
a naked bike that's about all you need really, they have good brakes and steer very well too. I suppose someone getting off
a jap 4 would say they lack power but it's horses for courses eh? Value for money, they are unbeaten.

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Originally Posted by NickL
Originally Posted by Mark Z
Originally Posted by Lannis
I was just wondering what's "exciting" about it. India and China make all kinds of bikes for the world market .... Bajaj, Mahindra, Changyeng, etc. already. How does it make it somehow better to stick a "BSA" decal on one of what they already make? Far as I know, none of what they make now is exciting enough to make me (or anyone else on the list, as far as I know) want to buy one, and they're already available ....

Lannis

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what they come up with, but I'm not optimistic either. I think the new RE twin is as close as they're going to get to retro styling, and I've heard some lackluster reviews on those. I'm not sure what sort of new bike would excite me.


That is strange, i have not spoken to anyone who has ridden one of the new enfields or owns one, that has a bad word to
say about them. They are not a rocket ship but the blokes i've spoken to all say they will sit at 70-80mph very happily. For
a naked bike that's about all you need really, they have good brakes and steer very well too. I suppose someone getting off
a jap 4 would say they lack power but it's horses for courses eh? Value for money, they are unbeaten.


I've always fancied the (now no longer made) single cylinder RE Continental GT, they sell for a sensible price even when new, look good handle well as you say and power seems to be similar to that of our old classic iron. Its not shaby performance but not VFR type power by a long stretch... That said a friend and I were travelling up the motorway in a van and doing the speed limit, this 650 twin RE continetal GT came past us in a breeze and he didn't seem to be ringing its neck.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

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I beleive the new Beezers are electric.

Bought a New 2006 carbie T-100 and have since sold it.

Electric start.
Oil cooler, wet sump.
CV carbs if I remember right.
Could do the ton, if I laid on the tank, and still had 1k left on the tach.

Might have been what Triumph could have been in the early seventies, but was not.

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The original 250cc RE GT Continental took the company slogan up a notch. Instead of "built like a gun" it was built like a grenade


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Originally Posted by Chip H
I beleive the new Beezers are electric.
The various online news articles indicated that there are petrol-engined models and an electric model.

It will be interesting to see what comes out, and in which price range.


Mahindra has a big advantage in that it has an established world-wide dealer network for farm machinery. Whether that works well with their BSA marketing strategy remains to be seen. I can imagine the jokes already smile

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Mahindra do have some experience in electric vehicles https://www.mahindraracing.com/


BSA B31 500 "Stargazer"
Greeves 200 "Blue Meanie"
Greeves 350
Greeves 360
Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
GM500 sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
Jawa 500 "Llareggub"
Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
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Mahindra also have three moto3 wins to their name https://www.mahindraracing.com/moto-3/


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Greeves 200 "Blue Meanie"
Greeves 350
Greeves 360
Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
GM500 sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
Jawa 500 "Llareggub"
Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
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Just put into google BSA Regal then BSA Tempest and you will see that they were tried back in the 1990,s the Regal did go into production but it was one off orders not mass production the Tempest only ever got as far as a prototype but they both looked good ilke modern versions of a BSA. The company was not big enough so the one off costs were too high for the average guy to buy. Now if Mahindra were to make something similar and could keep the costs down then they could be onto a winner. but electric is a step too far.

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In 10 years electric will be all we are allowed to buy. The development needs to be done NOW and bikes need to be on sale in the near future to avoid being left behind.


BSA B31 500 "Stargazer"
Greeves 200 "Blue Meanie"
Greeves 350
Greeves 360
Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
GM500 sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
Jawa 500 "Llareggub"
Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
'35 & '36 OK Supreme
Kawasaki ZZR1400 "Kuro no senshi"
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IF "in 10 years electric will be all we are allowed to buy" really happens, then I will likely be dead by then,
and will be glad of it.

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Well, doing a coparo..
having a starter under my thumb, rather than my right well used up leg,
has some advantage.

But I have walked in front of a Prius, having not heard it coming.

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Originally Posted by Irish Swede
IF "in 10 years electric will be all we are allowed to buy" really happens, then I will likely be dead by then,
and will be glad of it.

Never fear. The "can't sell IC vehicles in 10 years" is just a British regulatory crack-pipe dream. Won't even happen there, much less here. We don't have to be re-told all the reasons why that's a silly schedule .... !

Lannis


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A bit like the crack-pipe yankee unleaded fuel scheme, ethanol fuel and the crazy california emission laws, of course
they never got through did they?
The regs regarding ic engines are a europe thing not just uk, i agree it's stupid but it will come in maybe 25 years not 10.
Things move on, 120 years ago it was horses and steam, look at the infrastructure required for petrol fuelled cars.
I don't give a monkey's really as i'll be long brown bread. Problem for our super-race children eh?

Lannis, hows your prediction regarding covid 19 looking now eh?

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It will happen eventually, hopefully by the time its compulsory for new vehicles the battery tech will have followed Moores law, in ten years we might have something half the weight with twice the power , I am all for it, no clutch no fiddly timing no gears, just juice and magnets, bring it on. if it says BSA on it , why not, these are only marks on paper.


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Well. Jay Leno made the point on his show when he took on a grandma driving a Tesla with his 650 HP Cobra. The Tesla blew his doors off because a motor generates max torque regardless of rpm. So the question becomes, would one want a near silent crotch rocket? Or the more visceral feeling of understandable mechanics harnessing the power of controlled explosions. With an exhaust note to warn incompetent drivers of your presence.

Manufacturers will program a selection of exhaust notes, Thumper, 180, 270, Harley syncopated, Reggae, whatever, complete with volume control, piped through speakers, to provide that old school vibe and additional safety.

Of course that whole electric bike thing will be only a fad as we move quickly to hovering bikes like on Star Wars.

Back to obsolete technology. Has anyone every ran CNG in a motorcycle? It works well for cars and light trucks. If the trend continues it will be almost as available as gasoline. At least where I am.

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I would like an elctric bike to come with different soundtrack options, me , thinks" clippety clop coconuts " would be fun.


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No telling. I got a full set of Motorcraft ignition coils from an eBay vendor. They didn't come individually boxed, where the origin is usually stated.
The brake calipers and shocks were bought from NAPA. Those boxes said Made in USA. The serpentine belt came from Gates.
Mine's a 1997, mostly metric fasteners.
They almost lost me when they started calling a 351 a 5.4 liter. laugh


Knowledge speaks. Wisdom listens.

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