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A7 - A10
#818508 08/03/20 9:45 am
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knuckle head
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Can you put an A10 crank, rods and cylinders in a later 1950's A7 ?


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
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Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #818616 08/03/20 9:49 pm
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Yes, you should also use the A10 head.

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #818649 08/04/20 1:22 am
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Hey Tony---are you playing around with pre unit Beezas now?
FWIW my second bike was a 1960 A7 Shooting Star.
When I was approaching 65 some years ago I thought "I deserve a retirement present but no bugger is going to buy me one so I had better get one for myself".
I decided to try and find a 1960 A7SS.
I eventually found one in UK, flew over for the weekend to have a look and a ride and bought it and had it brought across to Jooooisey.
I also had A10s in UK---both of them fitted with sidecars.
Nice bikes!

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #818657 08/04/20 5:21 am
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Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
Can you put an A10 crank, rods and cylinders in a later 1950's A7 ?
The webs of a big journal A10 crankshaft will foul in CA10 crankcases near BDC, so will probably do the same in late A7 cases. There should be enough meat in the cases to relieve them


damhik,ijk frown

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #818658 08/04/20 5:53 am
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knuckle head
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Thanks for the info...







Richard , I built a 55 A10 from a pile of eBay and swap meet parts in 2000. I bought an engine and frame on eBay. I opened the engine and found inside a brand new crank, rods and Italian made high compression pistons.It was more of a bobber style and it ran very well...I sold in 2005 along with my 53 6T because I was done with bikes...LOL.....The A10 I want back and so maybe it'll pop up for sale...wishful thinking.
A friend of a friend dragged what looks like a later A10 from a basement in NJ ....55 years in the basement!
This was my A10...I sold it to a restaurant owner just west of New Orleans in late August 2005..emailed later on to say the bike survived the Katrina hurricane. I would pay a nice reward if found in one piece...
[Linked Image from live.staticflickr.com]

This is the bike just dragged out after 55 years in a basement...

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819403 08/09/20 7:48 pm
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knuckle head
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Going tomorrow to look at a pile of A10 parts..engines cases, what number/letters on the case to identify it as A10?
? Crankshaft and rods...I assume there's no easy way to tell A10 from A7 other than measuring? .and the head? Thanks


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819413 08/09/20 8:51 pm
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Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
Going tomorrow to look at a pile of A10 parts..engines cases, what number/letters on the case to identify it as A10?
Big journal A10 cases will have a DA10 (Golden Flash) or DA10R (Super Rocket) engine number. CA10R (Road Rocket) engines may have had big journal crankshafts as well, possibly. Perhaps.

Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
Crankshaft and rods...I assume there's no easy way to tell A10 from A7 other than measuring? .and the head? Thanks
Big journal A10 crankshaft have 3 radial bolts holding the flywheel. Small journal crankshafts have 6 (?) axial nuts and bolts holding the flywheel to the centre flange of the crankshaft.
For some reason, BSA used a shorter stroke as well as smaller bore for for the A7, along with shorter rods. The casting numbers are different, but I don't recall the details.
I think you'll have to measure the combustion chamber diameter of the head.


BTW, if that's the bike you plan to put A10 engine internals into, I wouldn't. Sports model A7s were quite uncommon outside the UK, so I'd be very surprised if it's not an A10 Road Rocket. What ar the engine and frame numbers?
If it is an A7 Shooting Star, it's a rather desirable machine in its own right.

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819414 08/09/20 8:51 pm
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HI,
The A10 frames are normally prefixed *A7, only the RGS and Super Flash frames have A10 stampings

Dating data on this link, https://www.britbike.com/bsapitstop/dating/

Cylinder head identification, http://atlanticgreen.com/a10dph.htm

A10's are 70mm bore size standard and A7 is 66mm

A7 has 7 rows of fins on the cylinder, A10 has 8. A7 thin flange, A10 can be thin or thick flange (1/2in)

A10's were made with three different crankshafts, "small bearing" "heavy" and big bearing (3 radial bolts holding flywheel)

A7 crank is small bearing

A10 big journal crank is 1.687 std and the rods are 6 1/2in centres (near enough)

John

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819418 08/09/20 9:24 pm
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Shane is correct---the A7 Shooting Star is a nice bike.
I had one in UK when I was 17---and later sold it of course.
Approaching 65 a few years ago I decided to buy one for myself as a retirement present.
Eventually found one in Bath in UK, flew across to see it, bought it and had it transported over to New Jooooisey.
Photo attached.
Go for it, Tony---best of luck tomorrow---and please let us know how you get on.

Attached Files BSA A7 Shooting Star--March 2010.JPG
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819421 08/09/20 9:44 pm
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knuckle head
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Thanks guys. No this isn't the A7. A good friend of mine is a hoarder of old British bikes and parts. His friend dragged the A10 out of the basement, and when it's mentioned, I say that should be my bike...so my friend text me to say come over and let's shift through hiscA10 parts to see if I can build a bike..
I really like the A10 engine and the welded frame....I love a pile of parts and making it all into something rideable like the black A10 I had......
Let you guys know what I find...


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819463 08/10/20 12:02 pm
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Wish you good luck Tony. I have enjoyed my A-10 for over 20 years. It rides smoother than the A-65 and looks terrific! PRT

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819466 08/10/20 12:55 pm
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knuckle head
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Tom, my A10 was the best pre unit Triumph I ever owned....lol.....


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819472 08/10/20 1:39 pm
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Yes--I have some very good memories of my A7s and A10s.
Rugged and reliable , easy to work on and IMHO very good looking bikes.
Hope the stash you are going to look at turns up something good, Tony.

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819490 08/10/20 4:18 pm
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knuckle head
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Well it's a pile..frames, complete engines, trans, primary parts, oil tank, several front ends, and wheels..Some is in his heated basement,some outside in a barn..Also is piles of Triumph and other British bike parts.Time was tight today....in a few days we will sort through it and grab the best....No paperwork for any of it, no big deal...We have been friends for 25 years and finally he is willing to let me buy stuff...A rear hoarder like on the TV show.......then the hunt for a real girder front fork...Or I'll fabricate it...
The Ducati Pantah project is going to a new home so I can concentrate on the A10


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819555 08/10/20 11:56 pm
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knuckle head
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The numbers on engines cases complete with crank and rods is DA10R 92xx. Below that is HHC..Some sort of Road Rocket?


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819558 08/11/20 12:52 am
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Tony-- the "HC" is High Compression.
The first "H" is I believe High lift camshaft.
I dont have my reference serial numbers in front of me as I write this--but--yes--a Road Rocket or Super Rocket.

Re: A7 - A10
Tridentman #819559 08/11/20 1:23 am
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The number is for a 1963 model - Super Rocket, Spitfire Scrambler or RGS. See if he has a GA10 frame as well smile

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819596 08/11/20 10:46 am
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knuckle head
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Super Rocket,, like an Oldsmobile Rocket 88......lol....will see what frames he has and the rest of the parts...This is very exciting.....


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819619 08/11/20 5:25 pm
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As Shane says- it's a Super Rocket engine that could have been in a Super Rocket, or Spitfire Scrambler, or Rocket Gold Star, they all used the Super Rocket engine. You are hoping for a frame with a stamping starting with A10, but most A10 engined frame numbers started with A7. Is that clear as mud?


Bill B...


Boomer
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819704 08/12/20 12:43 pm
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Tony, Welcome to the Dark Side! PRT

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819743 08/12/20 6:41 pm
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Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
Tom, my A10 was the best pre unit Triumph I ever owned....lol.....

I have had six BSA A10,s two of them threw out the left hand conrod destroying the engines,never had a Triumph do that and these were standard tuned A10.s. Best A10 I owned was a 1952 plunger framed model,I fitted a 1960 super rocket crank and rods, 356 cam and low comp 7.25.-1 pistons loverly smooth old motor hardly any vibes and was quite quick. I think BSA went backwards when they made the pre unit engine and dumped the bolt on box, duplex primary, decent six spring clutch.. good luck with your project. good to build bikes up from parts..


1941 BSA WM20
1958 TRI-BSA 750 PRE UNIT
1957 THUNDERBIRD
1932 R E MODEL GS SPECIAL
1947 BSA YM21
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819745 08/12/20 6:56 pm
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Thanks Tom.....always surprises with old lumps...the 63 engine had a hole in the bottom from an unscheduled rod disassembly. But he had another engine with a small bead nicely welded on the lower left. DA10R 56xx, HHC. Complete with cush drive, turns smoothly. The frame is Ga7 17xxx, appears ugly but no damage...I believe the engine and frame are 1961..The cylinder bores look good, I measured 70.5 mm. He has two alloy heads with a bolt on manifold but wouldn't let me touch them. The few other alloy heads look hammered. I took a cast iron head that has decent guides and seats..He is packing boxes with primary parts, wheels and rocker box stuff that I can get later


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819754 08/12/20 8:29 pm
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Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
...the 63 engine had a hole in the bottom from an unscheduled rod disassembly. But he had another engine with a small bead nicely welded on the lower left.
That's interesting. Folklore has it that only A65s threw the left-hand rod.

Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
DA10R 56xx, HHC. Complete with cush drive, turns smoothly. The frame is Ga7 17xxx, appears ugly but no damage...I believe the engine and frame are 1961..
Yep, both engine and frame numbers are in the 1961 number range, not far below the start of the 1962 range.

Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819755 08/12/20 8:35 pm
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Left hand rod failure can usually be attributed to a worn timing side main bearing


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Re: A7 - A10
Hillbilly bike #819761 08/12/20 9:07 pm
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knuckle head
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Worn bushing must oil starve the drive side rod.When i built the black A10 around 2001,I was on this site and many complained about low oil pressure on A10's after riding for awhile. Mine had a cast iron pump and an oil pressure gauge plumbed in.The pressure abover 2500 rpm was always 45 psi at the least..The current pile looks like this

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

The weld on this engine....
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


79 T140D, 96 900M Ducati ,61 A10 .On a bike you can out run the demons..
“But I don't want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked. “Oh, you can't help that,” said the Cat: “we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
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