BritBike Forum logo
BritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorBritBike Sponsor SteadfastCyclesBritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorHepolite PistonsBritBike Sponsor
Upgrade to: Premium Membership | Gold Membership | Life Membership | Vendor Membership | Site Sponsor Membership
Member Spotlight
jimt100
jimt100
Tennessee
Posts: 27
Joined: May 2010
New BritBike book out!
ShoutChat
Comment Guidelines: Do post respectful and insightful comments. Don't flame, hate, spam.
Search eBay for motorcycle parts in following countries
Australia, Canada, France, Holland, Italy, United Kingdom, USA
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,475
Likes: 21
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,475
Likes: 21
Originally Posted by wadeschields
My tins are blue right now so If they are original .... I had not come to that conclusion yet... But I'll look closer .... Then blk as black and maybe "b" for blue??? Who knows ... I cant even read where mine was dispatched too.......



There were only two distributors in the US at that time, East coast; BSA US Nutley, and West coast; Hap Alzina. So I would conclude it went to Alzina. I don't believe blue was a color available, only red or black depending on model. So again I would conclude black.

As for the STD 2, the 2 denotes that needle roller bearings were used on both shafts as opposed to bushings.


Bill B...


Boomer
1 member likes this: wadeschields
Support Your #1 BritBike Forum!

Check out British motorcycles for sale: British Motorcycles on e-Bay UK, British motorcycles on e-Bay North America
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 753
Likes: 45
C
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
C
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 753
Likes: 45
Hi Wade / Boomer,

Quote
As for the STD 2, the 2 denotes that needle roller bearings were used on both shafts as opposed to bushings.

I do not believe this is so, The needle roller boxes have "T" to denote Torrington needle roller bearing fitment

STD2 is a wide ratio gearbox fitted to US market Super Rockets (based on that I have never seen one over here)

The BSA gearbox data is in this BB thread,, http://www.britbike.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=15504

I do not know how this wide ratio gearbox would work out on a B33 ?? Peter Quick did not seem to like it ??

John

Last edited by chaterlea25; 05/16/20 10:01 pm.
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,475
Likes: 21
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,475
Likes: 21
Originally Posted by chaterlea25
Hi Wade / Boomer,

Quote
As for the STD 2, the 2 denotes that needle roller bearings were used on both shafts as opposed to bushings.


John


Okay, I was going by the difference between the RRT and RRT2 where the RRT has the rollers on one shaft and the RRT2 has rollers on both shafts.


Bill B...


Boomer
Boomer #809157 05/17/20 4:17 am
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 644
Likes: 15
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 644
Likes: 15
The T2 denotes Torrington needle bearing in the "A" gear. These are only in two clusters (RR T2, SC T2). The STD 2 "A"gear is a 42-3088 with no needle bearing. Same as SC T, ARRT, ASC T,


Coming to terms with your delusions, is the first step to sanity
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Britbike forum member
OP Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
So my B33 came with the STD 2 box but I also have the STD box as well. Which one would be better to use ? and why?


http://wadeschields.tumblr.com/

Jack of all trades . Master of fun! wink

Beer is not the Answer.... Its the Question..... The answer is YES

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
BritTwit #809254 05/18/20 2:23 am
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 7,223
Likes: 52
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 7,223
Likes: 52
Originally Posted by BritTwit
The T2 denotes Torrington needle bearing in the "A" gear. These are only in two clusters (RR T2, SC T2). The STD 2 "A"gear is a 42-3088 with no needle bearing. Same as SC T, ARRT, ASC T,


So what does it mean for the gearbox on my fathers A10 that has just T2 and no other letters?

Also does this mean that ALL the pre unit boxes were bushes layshafts? I was lead to believe that some had needle rollers there but could be an old wives tale


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

BritTwit #809265 05/18/20 4:11 am
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,475
Likes: 21
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,475
Likes: 21
Originally Posted by BritTwit
The T2 denotes Torrington needle bearing in the "A" gear. These are only in two clusters (RR T2, SC T2). The STD 2 "A"gear is a 42-3088 with no needle bearing. Same as SC T, ARRT, ASC T,


I disagree, the "T" denotes the needle roller on the layshaft, I believe it is in the blind hole. The "T2" denotes needle rollers on the layshaft end AND the "A" gear. In other words both (2) shafts.


Bill B...

Last edited by Boomer; 05/18/20 4:17 am.

Boomer
1 member likes this: Allan G
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 70
S
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
S
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 70
Originally Posted by wadeschields
So my B33 came with the STD 2 box but I also have the STD box as well. Which one would be better to use ? and why?
The STD gearing is probably more useful for general use. That was the STanDard gearbox used on most swingarm pre-unit A & B series BSAs. The others were for specific uses (TRIals, SCrambles, Road Race) so had different ratios. Who knows what they were thinking right at the end of the pre-unit manufacture?

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 201
Likes: 1
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 201
Likes: 1
Howdy Wade

That’s a great looking project you have

I have an early swing arm ‘54 B33 with a magdyno set up and std box

They’re a blast to ride

S


Keep It Greasy
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,264
Likes: 18
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,264
Likes: 18
Wade: When I look at the complete chart for all the various gearboxes I see that the STD 2 uses the same layshaft as the STD box and thus will not have any needle bearings. A STD T box would have needles on the layshaft. The difference between the STD box and the STD 2 is that there is a different high gear pair of gears. The STD 2 has a 25/18 pair where as the STD has a 26/17 pair. These pairings change the overall ratio of the other gear pairs as they all go through the high gear pairing to drive the sprocket.

So with the boxes you have it would just be deciding on which ratios would be best for your type of riding.

Gordo


The roadside repairs make for the best post ride stories.
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 753
Likes: 45
C
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
C
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 753
Likes: 45
Hi All,
On the bottom right hand corner of the gearbox data sheet a table shows the ratios

ARRT, ASC, ASC.T and STD2 all share the same ratios, 2.877, 1.754, 1.325 and 1:1

There are more gear tooth differences than the A gears between STD2 and STD

T. gearboxes have needle roller bearings on both ends of the layshaft (do not confuse with TRI which is bush )
T2. gearboxes have another needle roller bearing in the A mainshaft gear (A)


Wade for normal road use fit the STD gearbox

John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Britbike forum member
OP Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Thanks All !! Good info!!


http://wadeschields.tumblr.com/

Jack of all trades . Master of fun! wink

Beer is not the Answer.... Its the Question..... The answer is YES

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Salty Dog #809395 05/19/20 12:11 am
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Britbike forum member
OP Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Originally Posted by Salty Dog
Howdy Wade

That’s a great looking project you have

I have an early swing arm ‘54 B33 with a magdyno set up and std box

They’re a blast to ride

S

One was loaned to me in New Zealand back in 2010 for the BSA Rally and fell in love with singles ..... One more cog in the obsession works.... I am looking forward to getting this on the road.... Although I have other things on the burner as well... Some closer to being runners then this one....


http://wadeschields.tumblr.com/

Jack of all trades . Master of fun! wink

Beer is not the Answer.... Its the Question..... The answer is YES

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Britbike forum member
OP Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
So as I am collecting parts and getting inspiration , I have pretty much decided to go with headlight fork ears instead of trying to find an original nacelle and the heavy fenders... call it the sportier American look I guess.... My question is for the fork ears. Will any of them fit my forks ? Are there differences in the years as far as fitment? Ill probably go with the same headlight that came on my 66 Spitfire with the dial switch since I have most of a spare one.


http://wadeschields.tumblr.com/

Jack of all trades . Master of fun! wink

Beer is not the Answer.... Its the Question..... The answer is YES

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Britbike forum member
OP Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
And with the click of a button I change my mind.... Who knows where this project will wind up.... a few beers last night and I am now (soon to be) the new owner of an original rear mudguard . Found it by accident because I was looking for the seat bracket and this popped up because it had the bracket I was looking for and others as well. plus tail light . Im pretty chuff but now I will have to find a front fender and then decide on Nacelle or not.... ??? I guess it all comes down to what becomes available.... Another trouble with the nacelle route is then I am locked into the correct speedo and switches and what not because they go in the tin work .... That could get crazy.....


http://wadeschields.tumblr.com/

Jack of all trades . Master of fun! wink

Beer is not the Answer.... Its the Question..... The answer is YES

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
1 member likes this: Gordon Gray
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 307
Likes: 5
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 307
Likes: 5
I think any of the B, M, A series fork ears will work. The A65's are shorter between the triple tree.


1951 ZB GS
1953 BB GS
1953 Super Flash
1954 Vincent BS
1963 RGS
1956 Triumph T110

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,264
Likes: 18
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,264
Likes: 18
Wade: From what I have seen the only A65 fork ears that will not work are those from the cranked down upper triple models. Most should work.

Gordo


The roadside repairs make for the best post ride stories.
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Britbike forum member
OP Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Fender arrived from England. The rest of my parts from there are taking longer then this did ???? Hopefully not lost..... Now
I need the long curved brackets to mount this fender.... Its a 54 fender but mine being 58, Ive been told I will need to drill new holes for the brackets . I wonder if it matters which year brackets I get then????

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

58 is supposed to have the arrow head type bracket but I cant find a picture of a 58 bike with those on it? Late in the production maybe.....?


http://wadeschields.tumblr.com/

Jack of all trades . Master of fun! wink

Beer is not the Answer.... Its the Question..... The answer is YES

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
Britbike forum member
OP Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,112
Likes: 46
After two months of waiting for this lug to arrive from England I assumed it was lost in the postal black hole so I bought another one from America... Saturday they both arrived in the mail box... Now I have three since the american package contained two.... One a little smaller then the other.... The English one has threads in the holes and fits the frame well.... Thats probably the one I'll weld on... Is it worth trying to get it brazed on like the factory or welding is good enough?



[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]


Then I can paint or get the frame painted and start the actual build process. I try to be sure nothing else it missing on the frame first ....


http://wadeschields.tumblr.com/

Jack of all trades . Master of fun! wink

Beer is not the Answer.... Its the Question..... The answer is YES

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 7,223
Likes: 52
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 7,223
Likes: 52
Nice one Wade! If it was mine I’d grind 3 groves each side of the clamp, then spot mig the clamp to the frame at the point you have spot welded it (once you’ve found your happy with the angle and with it all still clamped together

You’ll be able to dress this up easily as opposed to a full bead of weld and once it’s clamped it won’t take much to ensure it never moves.

2c


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 307
Likes: 5
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 307
Likes: 5
If you are going to weld it make sure you get as much of the brass off as possible. It will contaminate you weld if you do not. Lloyd L


1951 ZB GS
1953 BB GS
1953 Super Flash
1954 Vincent BS
1963 RGS
1956 Triumph T110

1 member likes this: Allan G
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 753
Likes: 45
C
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
C
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 753
Likes: 45
Hi All
Why did BSA see fit to braze this in place on an otherwise all welded frame ?
They knew what they were doing, so I would follow suit
The frame tubing is quite thin and would easily burn through with arc weld
A65's with welded on side stands tear out the mountings
Pre unit BSA's with brazed stand lugs do not

2 cent opinion
John

Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 307
Likes: 5
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 307
Likes: 5
Wade, You might want to do a little more research before you order the arrow head type for you fender (mudguard). I looked at two period shots of a 1958 B33 and both had the type held on with cap screws and nuts. The earliest I have seen the arrow head style was on a 1960 Super Rocket. I am sure the experts will chime in here. It doesn't sound like you are building a museum bike, so use what ever you have. Lloyd L


1951 ZB GS
1953 BB GS
1953 Super Flash
1954 Vincent BS
1963 RGS
1956 Triumph T110

1 member likes this: wadeschields
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 7,223
Likes: 52
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 7,223
Likes: 52
Arrow head stays for 60 on for A10’s so I would assume the singles were the same way.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 119
Likes: 5
M
Britbike forum member
Offline
Britbike forum member
M
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 119
Likes: 5
Hi Wade.The B33 finished in 1960 (1959 for B31). Therefore they did not have arrow head stays, these were only on A7/A10 models.
That rear mudguard you have looks right for 1956-60. The flat in the beading on the edge is there for the flattened tube stays to pass over.
When buying stays be carefull with pattern items, a lot of them are made with the flat central to the tube. The rear edge of the flat should
be parralel with rear side of the tube.
regards, Pat A.

1 member likes this: wadeschields
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Allan G, Jon W. Whitley 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Upgrade to: Premium Membership | Gold Membership | Life Membership | Vendor Membership | Site Sponsor Membership

BritBike SponsorBritBike SponsorBritBike Sponsor
Home | Sponsors, Newsletter | Regalia | Calendar | Bike Project | BritBike Museum | Spiders Cartoons, | DVD- Manuals & Parts books














Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5