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Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin #788502 10/29/19 12:59 am
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Rohan Online Content OP
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Apparently this bike was shown at the NOC display at Ardingly, where-ever that may be.
Is there a writeup anyplace of how this bike still survives ?
Or how it rides, since it looks to be in working condition ??

https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyClassicBikeShows/photos/a.381097699822/10157191783504823/?type=3

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Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #788584 10/30/19 12:28 am
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Apparently these engine parts turned up at a swapmeet/bootsale about 5 or 6 years ago.
And have subsequently been built into a bike (?).
A few blueprints are shown on facebook too.

Wonder where this has all been these past years ?

And, if this is a P6A ( = Project 6A ?) does that mean Bert Hopwoods engine design was engine Project 7,
and thus became officially called the Model 7 when it went into production ??

Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #788635 10/30/19 5:48 pm
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I got to see the bike at Ardingly, Looks a really nice build.Am told It is shaft drive ,the motor has a Triumph look . The timing cover looked like a new casting. The engine parts have been around for some time . I went there on my 99DL . Lots of Nortons of all types ,including the rare 500cc twin carb Nomad. There was an article on the JM motor in the NOC mag I think. My friend took his Ducati 125 DOHC GP (ex desmo) which won a good prize. I should have displayed my bike but too busy enjoying myself. Tempted by a 650 motor with box and mag in the jumble ,American Import ,possibly a Manxman. Needed my heated jacket .

Last edited by norton bob; 10/30/19 6:13 pm.
Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #788645 10/30/19 8:55 pm
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Anna on the NOC mentioned these engines turning up a couple of/few years ago. I gather they were not entirely complete, so what looks to be a newly cast timing cover is not impossible.
I saw mention of shaft drive too, that would seem not to be possible, since its simply a twin engine slotted into ES2 cycleparts - and I can see the sprocket, chain and chainguard in the pic.
There are snaps of some blueprints on facebook too - and no shaft in sight ?

It would seem that Jack rather copied the Triumph design too closely, it was said it would have (heavily ?) infringed Triumphs' patents, so Bert Hopwood was commissioned to do another design,
with less copying of Triumphs ideas and features. And that design went into production as the Model 7, after some attention to the inlet manifold and finning between the cylinders.
Inneresting stuff, this history...

Edit - apparently Anna mentions something about being modified for a drive shaft, for who knows what purpose.
Cycle car ? Lawn mower ! Power saw ??

Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #788689 10/31/19 9:48 am
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Ardingly is a showground in the south East of England about half way to the channel from London, about 40min ride from where I live in SE London.In a green area of old England very pleasant,leafy lanes and very old pubs. Plenty of outside space for stalls and 3 or more industrial size units for exhibitions and inside stalls. Loads of classic and Vintage machines on display plus those that just arrive and park.The Norton club usually has a well attended stand with a dozen or so members bikes on display. We are so lucky here, lots of events through the year and all within an hours ride ,and no need to go on motorways or really busy roads. I can literally ride all year but avoid the few weeks when temps go much over 20 or below 0. I usually bump into plenty of folk I know and sometimes find myself talking to familiar faces that turn out to be old world class riders. Its a hard life , but someone has to do it! I do feel for those who live a thousand miles from anywhere, Just to really "P" you off, spares often arrive next morning if ordered before 4pm the previous day. But that's not to say they will always fit. Off for a ride on a vintage steam train and to and to gaze at the autuminal (?) tree displays.

Last edited by norton bob; 10/31/19 9:54 am.
Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #789335 11/06/19 3:50 pm
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Ardingly Showground in West Sussex, UK is home to the South of England Classic Motorcycle Show & 'Jumble, which I've been running since 2007. It's an all-motorcycle event for pre-1980 machines, so we get lots of Brit Bikes there. We had a great event there last month, on 27th October 2019, with a special display stand of Norton and AMC Prototype & Experimental Designs, which included the Norton P6A twin, a Norton unified twin in a featherbed frame, Pluto, the Matchless oil-in-frame prototype, a red AJS 33CSR, a Norton unified twin in a Norton N15CS frame plus
This motorcycle is the Jack Moore Norton Prototype 500cc twin, which Bracebridge Street planned to put into production in 1948. However, it proved too costly to build and was shelved in favour of the Bert Hopwood design which became known as the Model 7.
The engine in this bike is one of only two surviving Jack Moore designed engines, and was originally fitted to an ES2 rolling chassis for testing. However, in common with many prototypes it was broken up, and the current owner has built it into another ES2 chassis. This required new engine and gearbox mounting plates, plus modifications to get the primary and rear chain alignment correct.
It's not a shaft drive, and was never a shaft drive. I think maybe confusion has arisen as the owner and his friend also had on display engine and gearbox components of Norton’s unique shaft-drive twin prototype, not a whole shaft-drive bike.
Hope this clears up any confusion, we're back at Ardingly for another Classic Motorcycle Show and Bikejumble on Sunday 29th March 2020, more details on our website www.elk-promotions.co.uk
Here's some pictures from Ardingly on 27th October 2019, I hope they come out OK, I've lifted them from our FaceBook page, sadly we didn't get any really great pics of the Norton and AMC Prototype & Experimental Design stand, but here's some!
[img]https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyCl...23/10157271229814823/?type=3&theater[/img]
[img]https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyCl...23/10157271229874823/?type=3&theater[/img]
[img]https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyCl...23/10157271231529823/?type=3&theater [/img]
[img]https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyCl...23/10157271232184823/?type=3&theater[/img]
[img]https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyCl...23/10157271232384823/?type=3&theater[/img]
[img]https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyCl...23/10157271232509823/?type=3&theater[/img]
[img]https://www.facebook.com/ArdinglyCl...23/10157271232649823/?type=3&theater[/img]

Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #789385 11/07/19 1:57 am
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Thanks for the pics, Mrs Elk.
Looks like you had a great show, some great looking bikes there.
I love that Candy Red Model 33, I hope that won some sort of award ?

Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #789386 11/07/19 2:03 am
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Yes, Norton Bob, that part of the country (and thereabouts) is quite pleasant,
I was in Kent for a while, and was surprised at how much was on for old bikes,
and not having to brave the London traffic for it. Its rarely below 20 hereabouts
(except in the wee small hours) so our temp likes may differ a bit.

And I ordered a Commando bit day before yesterday, and it was on my doormat
this morn, and it came from not-so-close, so I'd say thats not so bad..
Thats if the shop down the road doesn't have Andover bits on the shelf.

Cheers.

Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #789407 11/07/19 8:18 am
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Sadly not on this occasion, we did have nearly 200 bikes in the show!
The owner says "This bike is one of only two AJS 33CSRs that was painted red. All the other 33CSRs were finished in blue. This machine was listed as the Hewitt Special in the factory records, Frank Hewitt was the foreman in charge of the assembly line at the AMC factory in Plumstead. The management had asked for people to come up with ideas for new colours. First time at this show for this striking machine."

Re: Jack Moore design of prototype Norton twin [Re: Rohan] #789689 11/10/19 1:40 pm
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I also studied that bike ,very pretty. I did get to ride a G15 750 CSR back in the day.Can't remember much about it, liked the swepped back ex system but not the heavily seamed silencers. I think the riding position was a bit impractical for daily use in traffic. A rare bike even then so probably too dear for me. I was also only 11 stone so kickstarting would be a pain.Out for a nice ride to Brands Hatch today on the Dommy to meet up at the old bikers café, Norton running like clockwork no attention for months.

Last edited by norton bob; 11/10/19 1:44 pm.

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