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Chokes #787792 10/22/19 5:23 am
Joined: Oct 2008
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DavidP Offline OP
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I put the chokes back on. Never needed them before, but after setting the float heights "correctly" the engine was a bit difficult to start cold using just the ticklers.
Talk about a right royal PITA! I had to devise a way to keep the choke slide up while putting the other end of each cable into that goofy 3:1 junction. I ended up pulling on the cable while shoving a deep socket into the throat to hold the slide and choke open.
I adjusted to be certain that the choke slides clear the bore with the lever fully tight. I can only hope that I can operate the lever with the screw tight enough to hold the slides open. Somebody really should devise a ratchet arrangement for the choke lever.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"
72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"
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Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #787806 10/22/19 8:13 am
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L.A.B. Online Content
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Originally Posted by DavidP
Talk about a right royal PITA! I had to devise a way to keep the choke slide up while putting the other end of each cable into that goofy 3:1 junction. I ended up pulling on the cable while shoving a deep socket into the throat to hold the slide and choke open.



I would have fitted the cables to the junction first, then attached the choke slides to the cables.

Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #787829 10/22/19 1:51 pm
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Tridentman Offline
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David--IME it is a difficult balance to achieve---between on the one hand having enough friction in the choke lever to stop the chokes moving to the ON position when riding and on the other hand being able to move the choke lever manually.
A couple of things that might work:
-- Use weaker choke springs. I think Double Diamond in UK makes and supplies these.
-- Alternatively cut a couple of loops off the standard springs.
-- Use a longer lever---such as the old style ignition advance/retard levers.
HTH

Re: Chokes [Re: L.A.B.] #787843 10/22/19 5:29 pm
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DavidP Offline OP
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Originally Posted by L.A.B.

I would have fitted the cables to the junction first, then attached the choke slides to the cables.

I first tried that. I figured that I would need three hands to hold everything while fitting the slides.
Hope it all works once the carbs are back on the bike.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"
72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"
Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #787856 10/22/19 6:49 pm
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DMadigan Offline
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Presumably you did not have the junction cable connected to the hand control? There would be nothing pulling on the cables as you assembled the chokes in the carb tops. It helps to use a surgical clamp to hold the cable at the top to keep it from moving as you insert the end through the choke, tube and spring.
With the chokes in place they can be retracted with the hand control while you put each slide into the carb bodies.
You do have the wave spring in the hand control?

Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #787896 10/23/19 4:22 am
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DavidP Offline OP
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I put the carbs back on today. Pulled the lever tight to check that the choke slides clear the bores. The small end pulled off of the single cable. A bad omen?
At least that didn't happen on the road, 10 miles east of nowhere, at night, in the rain.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"
72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"
Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #787993 10/24/19 4:48 am
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DavidP Offline OP
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I guess the chokes must come off. I can't find a compatible cable to go from the handlebar lever to the junction, and I'm NOT using the totally goofy setup with the cables run under the seat. It's too crowded under there to begin with.
I figured I could find the cable listed for my T120. When I enter 60-1818 on eBay I get listings which give as many as three PNs for the same cable! Only one listing actually gives the length of the cable, but the difference between the outer and inner is more than I need. Other vendors only list the complete cable setup.
I made the cable I had on there. I've made throttle and clutch cables in past, and this is the first one that failed. I don't much like the idea of any cable being under this much constant tension anyway.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"
72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"
Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #788046 10/24/19 5:50 pm
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kevin roberts Offline
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i had chad at barnett make me a complete new set for my T150.

if you do that send him all tbe old pieces so he can copy it. their records on this setup are spotty.


every day you do not take a chance is a day of your life that you will never get back.
Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #788051 10/24/19 7:37 pm
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Tridentman Offline
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David-- if you PM your mailing address to me I will mail one to you.
HTH

Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #788057 10/24/19 8:57 pm
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Andy Higham Online Content
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Just one of the many shortcomings of the Mk 1 Concentric


BSA B31 500 "Stargazer"
Greeves 200 "Blue Meanie"
Greeves 350
Greeves 360
Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
GM500 sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
Jawa 500 "Llareggub"
Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
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Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #788059 10/24/19 9:18 pm
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kevin roberts Offline
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you know, though, the old mk 1s work okay, about as well as the rest of the machine. they're cool because they're primitive-looking, but they're also annoying because there are so few tuning options. i wouldn't take Concentrics off a machine where they were working correctly, but neither would i spend a lot of time trying to correct their various issues if they weren't

the VM mikuni carb goes back to the middle 1970s, and so can easily be more vintage than many of the newer AMAL Concentrics fitted to british machines newer than that.. i've had them on my old morgo T120 for almost 40 years, and i love them.

even the keihin FCRs qualify as vintage now. this design is 30 years old:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


every day you do not take a chance is a day of your life that you will never get back.
Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #788076 10/24/19 11:55 pm
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DavidP Offline OP
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Actually I'm reverting to Amals on the A65 after many years of trying to get the VMs correct. I guess if you have access to a dyno or a friend at the emissions station to shove a probe up your pipes they can work well.
Also, what other carb will work with the rods and not cables to pull the slides? Maybe some Mk 1.5 with the cold-start jets?

BTW: I have Mk 2 carbs on my T120 and I love them. Only drawback is that the parts seem to cost twice as much when you can find them.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"
72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"
Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #788470 10/28/19 7:13 pm
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Tridentman Offline
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David-- just to confirm that a choke cable from 3 into 1 to handlebar lever is in the mail to you.
It is used --but that means it came off a bike so it should fit OK.
Used but usable.
HTH

Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #788980 11/03/19 1:18 am
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DavidP Offline OP
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Thanks Tridentman, I got the cable.
Looks like I'll need to dismantle the carbs again in order to use it. I can't get enough slack in the cables to get the junction apart with the slides in place. That gives me a chance to cut a couple of coils off each spring.
Still bothers me that this one cable can cause so much trouble if it were to break when on a long ride. Guess I'll add three pairs of hemostat pliers to my tool kit.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"
72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"
Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #789025 11/03/19 1:29 pm
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Adam M. Offline
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I use original set up of chokes with lever attached to the gantry, and after some fights during first assembly 3 years ago they work.
3 short cables bend is too small IMHO and I got rid of tool box ( which I never used anyway ) to give them more space near battery box and make dismantling carbs easier, but I don'r have any real problem with them.
Just remember to tighten the big screw once a year perhaps, that's all.

Re: Chokes [Re: DavidP] #789226 11/05/19 5:37 am
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DavidP Offline OP
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Cables together, chokes installed, carbs back on. I cut about 1/4" off of each spring and the lever pulls easy and stays put.


Stepping on others doesn't make you stand tall.

71 A65L "Zelda"
92 BMW K100rs "Gustav"
72 T120V cafe project "Mr. Jim"
72 T150V "Wotan"

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