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Generic switches for TR5T
#782324 08/23/19 1:15 pm
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Mark Z Offline OP
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I'm working on adding lights and wiring to a TR5T from which the lights and wiring were stripped some time ago. It has the earlier-type hand levers without the built-in switches, and I don't want to convert to the OE setup.

I have all the components except for handlebar switches. So, I need to source and install a dipper switch, horn switch, and kill switch. It will not have turn signals.

I'm looking for suggestions on universal switches that are reliable and relatively attractive.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
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Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782330 08/23/19 2:09 pm
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Independent Harley shops can help. Taiwan Tedd's website www.vtwinmfg.org has handlebar switches you can look at and decide.

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782351 08/23/19 5:08 pm
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There's a company called K&S Technologies who make a range of good quality handlebar switches see This Link,

Most of these switches can be found on eBay etc. The main problem is going to find one that matches your requirements exactly as many have indicator switches or starter buttons built in, I believe types used by off road/ATV bikes may fit.


1968 A65 Firebird
1967 B44 Shooting Star
1972 Norton Commando
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782359 08/23/19 6:29 pm
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Originally Posted by Mark Z


I have all the components except for handlebar switches. So, I need to source and install a dipper switch, horn switch, and kill switch. It will not have turn signals.





Why not use the neat and simple Tri-con switch? Red for engine kill, black for horn and dip switch.

If your using EI, the kill switch will connect to one of the wires going to the points plate.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782362 08/23/19 6:56 pm
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I have a replica tricon on my B31, it seems good quality and very neat.
I use the red button for the starter


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Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Andy Higham #782402 08/24/19 12:53 am
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Originally Posted by Allan Gill
Why not use the neat and simple Tri-con switch? Red for engine kill, black for horn and dip switch.

If your using EI, the kill switch will connect to one of the wires going to the points plate.


Not familiar with Tri-con, but I'll check it out. The bike has breaker point ignition for now. It sounds like the kill switch is momentary - is it normally open or normally closed?

Originally Posted by Andy Higham
I have a replica tricon on my B31, it seems good quality and very neat.
I use the red button for the starter


Electric start on a B31???


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782408 08/24/19 1:24 am
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He must be very old..............

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
gunner #782413 08/24/19 1:47 am
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Pardon my ignorance; I'm strictly a pre-OIF guy (the TR5T is my son's): I see now that Tri-cor is what's used on OIF Triumphs. I didn't want to go OE because I thought the switches were integrated with the levers, but I see that these are not. They may however all have turnsignal switches; I may be able to live with that, even though the bike will not have turn signals. I'll look some more.

Looking at the J&S Technologies stuff too, also Motion Pro. Some of the online descriptions are not very good. For one thing, they must be for 7/8" handlebars - I'm assuming the ones touted for HD are 1".


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782428 08/24/19 6:36 am
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Hi Mark, look for Tricon not tricor. The kill switch is like the horn, it’s a momentery connteion to earth or for as long as you hold it down. Often the kill is used on magneto ignitions or single cylinder points ignitions. With twins, or singles with EI, the kill wire will connect into one of the legs for the wire going to the trigger plate. (For Boyer and Pazon atleast, don’t know about tri spark) you just hold the button down until the engine has stopped turning. The short to earth kids the ignition module that the rotor isn’t spinning as it’s only receiving feedback from one pole. If this was single cylinder points then you have effectively closed the points gap by shorting it to earth.

If im correct, Andy’s electric starter will be off a change over relay, so a shorty to earth will switch the relay to providing power to the starter

HTH


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Allan G #782514 08/25/19 7:16 am
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Originally Posted by Allan Gill
Hi Mark, look for Tricon not tricor. The kill switch is like the horn, it’s a momentery connteion to earth or for as long as you hold it down. Often the kill is used on magneto ignitions or single cylinder points ignitions. With twins, or singles with EI, the kill wire will connect into one of the legs for the wire going to the trigger plate. (For Boyer and Pazon atleast, don’t know about tri spark) you just hold the button down until the engine has stopped turning. The short to earth kids the ignition module that the rotor isn’t spinning as it’s only receiving feedback from one pole. If this was single cylinder points then you have effectively closed the points gap by shorting it to earth.

If im correct, Andy’s electric starter will be off a change over relay, so a shorty to earth will switch the relay to providing power to the starter

HTH


Oops (Tricon)! This bike will have breaker point ignition. I'm not sure I want to reroute points leads (messy from a wiring standpoint). I'm thinking more of a momentary disconnect of power to the coils, or a toggle or rocker "run" switch.bn


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782519 08/25/19 8:25 am
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Some bikes with twin points had a Lucas push button switch in the headlight which when pressed joined or broke the circuit (can’t remember which way round) if it breaks the circuit then you can wire it into the live feed. If it makes the circuit then you will need 2 wires from the contact breaker (or where it terminates to the coil) you could place this switch anywhere in on the bike which is preferred to you if you don’t want masses of wires (except on the bars)


Switch

Last edited by Allan Gill; 08/25/19 8:26 am.

Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782532 08/25/19 1:44 pm
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My son is insistent on having the kill switch on the handlebar. I'm looking at this one now, dipper/horn/kill switch in one, but I can't tell how the kill switch is wired.

https://www.eBay.co.uk/itm/Wipac-S3858-Chrome-Tricon-Dip-Horn-kill-switch-ideal-for-7-8-Handlebars/391208746299?hash=item5b15dbbd3b:g:LfoAAOSwcgNZHGM0

I don't see how running a wire from both coils to the switch could work; that is, the two wires would be joined at the switch, which means that when one set of points is closed, the other coil would be grounded as well.

Maybe just grounding one coil would be enough to kill the engine?


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782534 08/25/19 1:56 pm
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Ok, this picture shows that the switch has five wires; that's three for the dipper switch and one for the horn switch, which leaves only one for the kill switch. That means the kill switch is a normally open, "grounding" switch.

https://www.eBay.com/itm/Tricon-Swi...trksid=p2349526.m4383.l4275.c10#viTabs_0


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782546 08/25/19 3:22 pm
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Personally, I wouldn't bother with a Tricon Switch unless you are going to the effort of wiring in extra relays for the headlight main/dipped beam. These switches are basic in their construction and don't handle the high power needed for a 55/60W headlight very well. Quite often I've been caught out with Tricon and similar switches which have left me in darkness when switching from dipped to main. Hence my suggestion for something more robust in the form of K&S technologies switch gear which is DOT approved and will fit 7/8 bars.


1968 A65 Firebird
1967 B44 Shooting Star
1972 Norton Commando
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
gunner #782557 08/25/19 4:48 pm
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Mark the Tricon switch is only workable with a magneto ignition or EI (or points on a single cylinder) I had assumed you had EI which is why I mentioned it. It grounds to earth like the horn does.

With the Lucas switch I showed you would connect a wire from the contact breakers to each side. As the button is pressed your creating a circuit where by there might be a single spark but no more will follow it. As the opening and closing of the CB is ignored. I believe some triumph twins are wired like this.

Originally Posted by gunner
Personally, I wouldn't bother with a Tricon Switch unless you are going to the effort of wiring in extra relays for the headlight main/dipped beam. These switches are basic in their construction and don't handle the high power needed for a 55/60W headlight very well.



Same could be said for any switch where the main current is passing through it. Unless you have a relay then you will ALWAYS loose something through the switch.

I use the tricon on mine, the only thing I did was upgrade the wires and use the correct colours. The originals would light both bulbs at the same time, in some
Instances this stopped tail lights from blowing. The modern replacements are more like on-off-off when switching between beams, the only problems these normally have is when some nugget has over tightened the locking screw, distorting the body and stopping some of the circuits working correctly.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782576 08/25/19 7:19 pm
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As an electrical engineer, I would recommend using relays whatever the switch being used, it removes potential weakness from the headlight circuit


BSA B31 500 "Stargazer"
Greeves 200 "Blue Meanie"
Greeves 350
Greeves 360
Suzuki GSX1100 EFE "Sorcerers Apprentice"
GM500 sprint/LSR bike "Deofol"
Jawa 500 "Llareggub"
Aprilia RSV Mille "Lo Stregone"
'35 & '36 OK Supreme
Kawasaki ZZR1400 "Kuro no senshi"
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782580 08/25/19 8:13 pm
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Andy, I understand the purpose and value of relays, but... I'm not doing it. If it were a touring bike, I'd consider it, but this is just a little runabout.

Based on my research and everyone's responses, I guess what I want for the kill switch is a two-wire toggle or rocker. Coming up with a universal dipper/horn switch is simple. In fact I have one on my A65 that is quite suitable. So with a dipper/horn switch on the left, all I would need is a single toggle or rocker on the right.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782601 08/26/19 12:28 am
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I've a similar thing to this on my t120, works fine. (Just left hand switch pack ,, headlamp on-dip-main..horn..indicators.) No relays.
https://www.eBay.com.au/itm/Motorcycle-7-8-Handlebar-Control-Horn-Turn-Signal-Light-Hi-Lo-Beam-Left-Switch/264399747366?hash=item3d8f73f926:g:z18AAOSwup9c2S5W
https://www.eBay.com.au/itm/1-Pair-Universal-Motorcycle-Handlebar-Horn-Turn-Signal-Light-Control-Switch-KU/153534628087?hash=item23bf6080f7:g:76YAAOSw~MRdCdup

Last edited by NickL; 08/26/19 1:10 am.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
NickL #782620 08/26/19 2:31 am
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Originally Posted by NickL
I've a similar thing to this on my t120, works fine. (Just left hand switch pack ,, headlamp on-dip-main..horn..indicators.) No relays.
https://www.eBay.com.au/itm/Motorcycle-7-8-Handlebar-Control-Horn-Turn-Signal-Light-Hi-Lo-Beam-Left-Switch/264399747366?hash=item3d8f73f926:g:z18AAOSwup9c2S5W
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1-Pair-Universal-Motorcycle-Handlebar-Horn-Turn-Signal-Light-Control-Switch-KU/153534628087?hash=item23bf6080f7:g:76YAAOSw~MRdCdup


I like it. There will be unused functions (e.g. turnsignals), but maybe that's ok. Waiting on opinions from the owner (my son).


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782622 08/26/19 2:51 am
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https://www.eBay.com.au/itm/Motorcycle-7-8-Handlebar-Control-Horn-Turn-Signal-Light-Hi-Lo-Beam-Left-Switch/264399747366?hash=item3d8f73f926:g:z18AAOSwup9c2S5W

You can run just the left hand switch and wire the unused turn signal switch as a kill switch. Center position is ignition off, left and or right signals are engine run. I recently did this to a 1977 T140 with the original Lucas left side multi switch, no turn signals and an aftermarket master cylinder that eliminated the factory kill switch.

Eric


1971 T120RV (R.I.P.)
1973 T140V/TR7
1993 Ducati 900 SS
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
BikeVice #782639 08/26/19 6:52 am
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Originally Posted by BikeVice
https://www.eBay.com.au/itm/Motorcycle-7-8-Handlebar-Control-Horn-Turn-Signal-Light-Hi-Lo-Beam-Left-Switch/264399747366?hash=item3d8f73f926:g:z18AAOSwup9c2S5W

You can run just the left hand switch and wire the unused turn signal switch as a kill switch. Center position is ignition off, left and or right signals are engine run. I recently did this to a 1977 T140 with the original Lucas left side multi switch, no turn signals and an aftermarket master cylinder that eliminated the factory kill switch.

Eric


This just gave me an idea. You could use 2 Ducon (one button) switches
If you wanted to keep the period look, one of each side the bars, the other side could use the high-low beam switch as on and off. At a couple of amps for the ignition feed there will be less going through it than a light.

Just separate the body and of the 3 screw connectors for the what would be lighting, remove one from one end or the other. That end will be the off position.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782707 08/27/19 12:50 am
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My son really dislikes the black plastic handlebar switches, so here's the current plan:

OFF/LO/HI rotary switch in the headlamp, and one of those donut-shaped HI/LO/HORN switches on the handlebar, where the HI/LO switch will be used for RUN/STOP, and HORN for the horn.

It looks like the donut switch can be mounted on either side, and I think the right side is preferable.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782735 08/27/19 6:00 am
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Sounds like a plan, and won’t cost a great deal to give it a try.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Generic switches for TR5T
Mark Z #782737 08/27/19 6:10 am
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The casing for the switches i suggested are cast alley/monkey metal, not plastic.
Just thought i'd say.


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