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Re: Barn Find Beeza
Allan G #807873 05/04/20 11:45 pm
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Originally Posted by Allan G
Looking good! A quick tip though Is to turn the alternator rotor the other way around. As the strobe timing marks are on the other side. thumbsup
Also, you won't be able to slide the chain tensioner pad/shoe with the alternator stator in place.

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Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #807900 05/05/20 2:58 am
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Hey Marc, keep up....that was yesterday's cockup! beerchug

Got it all done the right way round at last:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Timing marks where I can see 'em blush
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Bolts for the alternator are yet to arrive, I know they're missing. clap

Clutch adjusted adequately until I can get the cable on and the handlebars mounted:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

I put the engine cover back on with just a few bolts. I had intended to get it polished and plated but that will have to wait until after the Great Shutdown:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

I then just offered up the cases on the timing side to make sure everything worked as it should:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Tomorrow that stuff's going back on.

Last edited by Psychopasta; 05/05/20 3:00 am.
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808198 05/08/20 1:42 am
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So today I fitted the gasket on the timing side (needed a little trimming)

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

and on she popped:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

The kickstart spring seems 'good enough' but I'd welcome conformation as it just seems to sit there when the kickstart is not used. It does engage with the kickstart, and hence I think it's good enough, but would welcome comments. The timing cover is all screwed down now and I put the outer cover on with just one bolt for now:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Last edited by Psychopasta; 05/08/20 2:45 am. Reason: Typo
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808201 05/08/20 2:04 am
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The plate holding the kickstart spring needs to be turned 180 degrees counter-clockwise, such that there's tension on the spring even when the lever is not being depressed.

There have been numerous discussions on how to do this; my method is to don a pair of heavy-duty suede welding gloves and twist it by hand. I expect others will offer alternative methods.


Mark Z

'65(lower)/'66(upper, wheels, front end, controls)/'67(seat, exhaust, fuel tank, headlamp)/'70(frame) A65 Bitsa.
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808207 05/08/20 2:31 am
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Sounds like a plan, thanks

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808219 05/08/20 6:49 am
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Looking good, a couple of thoughts whilst the covers are off:-
- might be worth polishing the outer cover before its installed, looks like its been blasted which will make it harder to polish so start with 400 wet & dry paper, working up to 2000 paper, then use metal polish.
- the oil pump should be primed, one way is to install the tank and oil lines and spin the pump using a cordless drill on the tacho shaft, see explanation on the E&V site Here
- I agree with the comments about the kickstart spring, the plate should be reversed and spring turned 180 degrees so that there is tension on the plate. It can be a bugger to install until you get the hang of it.


1968 A65 Firebird
1967 B44 Shooting Star
1972 Norton Commando
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808225 05/08/20 9:20 am
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Tang is correct way round, on some cases it will bind on the inside of the outer cover if it faces outward.

There’s some crap springs on the market, I only buy mine from SRM now as they are the only ones which are actually springs and not just coiled wire. If it looks shiny and plated the. Most likely it isn’t spring wire, the wire takes the shortest path and bends then jams up the kick start.

The locating plate also wants to be a secure fit on the kickstart shaft, I’ve found some that aren’t. I don’t know if they have been filed or just wear and tear but the plate should be a firm fit.

Also fit some fresh screws (even Allen screws) on your points plate. You’ll be adjusting that several times and those screw heads already look a little chewed up.

There also wants to be a screw under the MCD number on the inner cover, whilst it’s not recessed it’s because there should be the points wire clip underneath it as Gavin mentioned.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808256 05/08/20 4:24 pm
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Great photographs!! This is going to be gold for every future rebuild, thanks!

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808258 05/08/20 4:44 pm
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You are going too fast with this build, or I'm visiting this thread not often enough. Anyway as gunner wrote now is the time to prime your oil system, but before that was a great moment to install a Norton type oil filter on your return line hanging from those rear engine mounting plates.
Saves you a few white hairs during a first start, but also proper oil filter is crucial for these engines if you plan to ride your bike.
Next thing to check is a stator / rotor clearance which I don;t remember exactly how big.should be, but you should be able to go around your rotor with a piece of paper between them without any problem.
+1 about pictures.

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808266 05/08/20 5:57 pm
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Ten thou clearance between rotor and stator. Brass feeler gauges won't get stuck.


1978 Bonneville T140E
1974 Trident
1970 BSA Thunderbolt
1971 Norton Commando
1972 Norton Commando
1973 Norton Commando
1974 Norton Commando
2018 Kawasaki Z900RS


Everything will be alright in the end. If its not alright, its not the end.
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808271 05/08/20 6:45 pm
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Clutch spring adjusters looks rather tight to me. Recommended starting point is with the tip of the bolt flush with bottom of the screw driver groove. It is easy to tighten later, not so easy to slacken. Regarding the mentioned rotor/stator clearance, how can that be adjusted? Bending the stator bolts won't do any good. The only thing I can think of, is to enlarge the bolt holes to shift the stator sideways.
Regards


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Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808275 05/08/20 6:56 pm
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Thank you all very much for your comments. I'll take them all on board. I did check the stator clearance and it was OK, but as Ola notes I have no idea what you do if it's not OK, there's no adjustment I can see. I'll loosen the clutch bolts, and take all other advice.

I don't know about fast progress mind beerchug. I've had many mad , several blush , and at least three facepalm moments. More to come, I'm sure.

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808300 05/08/20 11:37 pm
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Here's what your kickstart return spring should look like, when it's properly set up.

Attached Files BSA #31.jpgBSA #29.jpg

Jon W.


1957 6T Thunderbird 650
1968 T100R Daytona 500
1971 TR6R Tiger 650
1970 BSA A65F 650
1955 Tiger 100 - Project
1971 BSA A65 650 - Project
1972 Norton Commando 750 "Combat"


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Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808301 05/08/20 11:48 pm
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Hey Jon, Thanks!

Last edited by Psychopasta; 05/08/20 11:49 pm.
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808351 05/09/20 1:56 pm
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Originally Posted by Psychopasta
Hey Jon, Thanks!


You are welcome. Also, I have my trusty Motion Pro heavy duty spring hook/puller, which makes this a super easy task, Part No. 08-0127.

Attached Files BSA #32.jpg

Jon W.


1957 6T Thunderbird 650
1968 T100R Daytona 500
1971 TR6R Tiger 650
1970 BSA A65F 650
1955 Tiger 100 - Project
1971 BSA A65 650 - Project
1972 Norton Commando 750 "Combat"


"Every time I listen to AC/DC, so do my neighbors"

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808379 05/09/20 9:29 pm
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Replaced all the studs in the rocker assembly:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

The one at the front that looked like it has no threads actually does have threads but lower down in the hole, it's a clearance size at the top. Don't know if that's original or not.

Acorn nuts in place to prevent me losing them crazy

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808380 05/09/20 9:39 pm
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Just a quick note to mention that the rocker spindle spring washers go on the outer side which I guess is why the right hand inlet rocker appears offset from the valve centre.


1968 A65 Firebird
1967 B44 Shooting Star
1972 Norton Commando
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808382 05/09/20 9:59 pm
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Thanks Gunner! I'll fix that now.

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808392 05/09/20 11:45 pm
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In order from DS to TS, Thrust Washer, Spring W, rocker, TW , Centre boss, TW, Rocker, Spring W , last thrust washer which is a smaller diameter than the other 3.
looks like you have a washer missing as well as the order mixed up. Nice new studs. The dome nuts need sealing washers.
see fig B3 on page B6 for the rocker assembly.

Last edited by gavin eisler; 05/10/20 12:32 am.

71 Devimead, John Hill, John Holmes A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
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The poster formerly known as Pod
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808404 05/10/20 1:36 am
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OK chaps, here it is the right way round:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

All washers correct and in place sir!

I took off the inner timing cover to fix the kickstand spring properly. I had a spare gasket. This time, I fitted the kickstart ratchet into the cover, and then fitted the washer and spring. I then used a small pipe wrench to turn the spring to tension

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Little bit of jiggling to get the kickstart ratchet to engage the gear pinion and in it went. Remove the wrench and everything stays in place:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Pleased with that. the kickstart lever is under tension at all times. Then I disassembled the clutch puller mechanism in the outer timing cover, and greased everything and rebuilt it:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Job's a good 'un. Unless it's not. In which case, I do it again.

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808405 05/10/20 1:43 am
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There should be a small ball bearing in the upstanding part of the clutch op mechanism, this stops the push rod binding in the cup, you will have to trim the push rod, there should be instructions with the new pressure plate, once you have the correct length the pressure plate adjuster screw should not protrude more than one thread from the locknut. Heat the trimmed end of the push rod to cherry red and plunge cool in oil, just the tip or you will make the rod snappy.


71 Devimead, John Hill, John Holmes A65 750
56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
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Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808407 05/10/20 2:03 am
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Yep, I'm reading the SRM instructions even as we speak beerchug

Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808419 05/10/20 7:31 am
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That spring is too tight or is the wrong spring. The leg closest to the plate is already starting to take a short cut. It’ll do this if there is too much tension on the spring or if it’s the wrong material (not spring steel) when you use the kick starter that leg behind will jam up.

If you back the plate off half a turn and the kick start lever is sloppy then you have the wrong kind of spring.

You’ve also put teeth marks on the kickstart shaft which might bind on the case when it’s fitted.

Find a steel tube which slides over the shaft, then fit the kickstart lever (obviously the shaft will need to be cut so it’s the correct length and butted up to the lever when fitted.

Last edited by Allan G; 05/10/20 7:35 am.

Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

1 member likes this: gavin eisler
Re: Barn Find Beeza
Psychopasta #808431 05/10/20 10:12 am
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Use a hose clip to hold the spring retainer, not vise grips, thats RAF.


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56 Norbsa 68 Longstroke A65
Cagiva Raptor 650
MZ TS 250
The poster formerly known as Pod
Re: Barn Find Beeza
gavin eisler #808465 05/10/20 3:50 pm
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Originally Posted by gavin eisler
Use a hose clip to hold the spring retainer, not vise grips, thats RAF.


Definitely the preferred method. Seeing those Vise Grip pliers on that shaft is seriously cringe worthy facepalm

Psycho...take another look at the picture I posted of the kickstart spring and retaining plate in their proper position. As Allan stated, you have way too much tension...you went a complete full turn and a half beyond where it is supposed to be.

Also, with my Motion Pro spring hook, I don't even have to use the hose clamp to keep the retaining plate in place. Just tap it onto the shaft and ensure it is fully seated. Then pull the spring and hook it in place on the tab. Easy peasy.

In this video below, this guy is a bit of a barbarian and IMO makes it harder than it is but the main thing to take away is he explains just how very little tension is put on the spring with the small amount of distance it actually travels to be put in its correct place. Oh, and flip the retaining plate so that the hook tab faces inward.



Jon W.


1957 6T Thunderbird 650
1968 T100R Daytona 500
1971 TR6R Tiger 650
1970 BSA A65F 650
1955 Tiger 100 - Project
1971 BSA A65 650 - Project
1972 Norton Commando 750 "Combat"


"Every time I listen to AC/DC, so do my neighbors"

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Moderated by  Allan G, Jon W. Whitley 

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