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Paint!
#767489 03/07/19 11:06 pm
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Nubie here but have been lurking in the shadows for probably 10 or so years. I have a 67 beeza bitsa Lighting and was thinking of getting the tank and side covers repainted. At Mid-Ohio each year I see paint very a great deal from having an orange tint to almost a maroon color. I remember the paint being a silver over a red of some short. Does anyone have a paint code/kind/brand/ that is a pretty good match that is only 1 color? I am a single dad with a 6 year old so cost is VERY much a concern! The guy doing the painting is a friend, and is doing it probably for about his costs, but said it would get much more expensive with 2 colors.

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Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767511 03/08/19 4:13 am
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... never used this stuff .
It could be snake oil .
But as you are on a budget .

It's candy in a rattle can .... applied over a silver base ... so two cans

https://alsacorp.com/shop/killer-cans/141-candy-killer-cans.html
[Linked Image]
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Last edited by quinten; 03/08/19 4:19 am.
Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767514 03/08/19 7:11 am
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Originally Posted by Bill Evans
Does anyone have a paint code/kind/brand/ that is a pretty good match that is only 1 color? I am a single dad with a 6 year old so cost is VERY much a concern! The guy doing the painting is a friend, and is doing it probably for about his costs, but said it would get much more expensive with 2 colors.


Ha - great minds think alike. Maybe...

I had the same thought, and asked a paint guy about a metallic red as a one coat solution to this.
(not for a bike though, something cheaper in the antiques business.)
He wasn't keen on this, but mixed me up something.
As soon as the fine silver flake went into the mix, it went sort of a shade of pink !
(you can see some of the darker red around the rim, before the flake went in)
I can use it as the basecoat...

I've also tried the 2 rattle cans of this stuff, silver flake base and transparent red topcoat, and it looks quite good as a candy red.
But make sure it is petrol-proof, no good it washing off at the first fuel overspill !!

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Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767545 03/08/19 3:47 pm
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Renault do some reds which is uncannily like the bsa candy red. I keep wanting t find the RAL numbers for it so I can spray a bike up. With any colour (unless it’s cellulose) you will need a 2k lacquer (or unless it’s 2k paint) east woods do some 2k in a can. It sets fairly quickly and gives a great finish, there are other 2k lacquers in a tin which give a lovely finish but they don’t cure fully and a hot day with a tank bag on will destroy it as will fuel spills.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767574 03/08/19 8:07 pm
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Allan--Bill is in Ohio---Renaults have not been sold here for donkeys years so he is not likely to find a Renault color spray can at his local auto store.

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767589 03/08/19 9:43 pm
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Folks eleswhere are raving about Ford Ruby Red Metallic.
Not sure how close this is to the desired color, or how it is done.
Might be worth checking out, its certainly a current color...

Note that red is notoriously difficult to photograph, so who knows how accurate this will show on a 'puter.

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Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767591 03/08/19 9:56 pm
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Tridentman, shall we tell Allen WHY Renaults are not sold in the United States?

The Dauphine and Caravelle were sold here in 1958 to 1962....until all of them blew up or rusted to dust.

Then came the Renault "Le Car" in the 1970s, and those lasted about 4 years, then were turned in for scrap also.

No American will buy one. Renault's reputation is just too sour in the USA.

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767594 03/08/19 10:23 pm
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i would buy a dauphine. i liked that car.

but then i liked the hillman imp too.


I would rather be ashes than dust
Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767595 03/08/19 10:27 pm
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I'm not sayings its not possible, but every pearl/ruby/candy red paint I've ever dealt with has been impossible to do in a spray cay. I can custom mix and tint both enamel and urethane paints and put it in a rattle can but the pearl and candy colors are always a two or often three step process, base red coat, midcoat pearl, and clear coat and they have never turned out well. Results are not awful, but they have never matched the vehicle (Ford tri-coats SUCK!!! no matter what) and for what you spend on it you may as well do it properly. I used a red candy tint from SEM products over a gold base on my Norton and it looks like sample #2 above. Laid the gold down then sprayed about 20 coats of the translucent red pearl and topped it off with urethane clear.

https://www.semproducts.com/product/candy-concentrates


1960 BSA A10
2007 Suzuki Bandit
1957 A10
(Used to be a Triumph here)
71 Norton Commando
17 Triumph Bonneville

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767631 03/09/19 8:08 am
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And if you really want an authentic match for the BSA finish, paint each piece separately and make sure each one is a different shade of red.
Because that is how they left the factory.
Then put 2 pieces out in the sun till they faded because that is how they left the dealers.

Read any review of the bikes from the time, or even better any "bying used bike" review and note how strongly the author complained about the poor finish.
Now according the Mr Mettan the red was 2 coats of translucient red laquer over a gold or yellow slightly flaked base coat .
The blues were done the same way but supposed to be over a silver base however a lot of the USA imports we get here are over gold.
You end up with two totally different "flamboyant" blues.
Then if BSA ran out of new parts they would pinch parts from the spares section.
They were usually painted black
Red over gold over black again yeilds a totally different colour than red over gold over green or red over gold over cream depending what undercoat went under the base coat. and if the part required some body work and had a tell tale rubbing layer of paint.

Way back near the top some one said it does not matter what colour you used bcause every second 1/2 wit will tell you it is wrong ( like they can accurately remember a colour from 50 years ago ).

So pick a finish that makes your heart pump harder every time you open the garage door.
It is your bike so make it float your boat & let the poo pooers sink on their leaking rafts.

Oh & Mettan also mentioned that the night shift forman used to mix the paint for the following day and no two batches turned ot the same colour in the gun, let alone after the differences resulting from the actual person who painted the bike.This is one of the reasons why he specified an electro static paint finish for the new 71 models.
At least all the bikes should have been consistant colours.
The only part that came out the same colour every time was the frame & that is because they were dipped.

And as previously mentioned you can not visually reproducea complex multi layer translucient paint finish with a single coat paint.
In fact you will not even get close to the visual appearance.

Last edited by BSA_WM20; 03/09/19 8:15 am.

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Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767635 03/09/19 11:36 am
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Since you said it is already a bitsa......pick a red you like/can afford and go with it.

Personally I prefer the darker red of the Spitfire over the candy red of the Lightning, but that is just me.

Just get it done and bring it to VMD and Ohio Valley events!



Never underestimate the human ability to elevate stupid to a whole new level!.
Re: Paint!
Allan G #767636 03/09/19 11:39 am
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It just isn’t lack of Renault’s in the US for reference......but RAL numbers don’t translate to US colors very well either. Sherwin Williams does with powder coat, wet paint is not so easy.


Never underestimate the human ability to elevate stupid to a whole new level!.
Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767638 03/09/19 11:58 am
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I guess I need to clarify. A painter will be doing it with a gun, trying to eliminate the rattle can job that is on it. Was just looking for a not multiple color process. Does anyone know how close the Ford Ruby Red Metallic is to the original color. Trying to get the color pretty close. It will never be a show queen, just trying to get it respectable.

On a side note....my father back in the day... did have a couple of year old Dauphine and spent way too much money on it trying to get it to run correctly. He stated that it was the worst car ever made and it left him by the side of the road multiple times. The last time he left a note "free, have to like punishment" and just walked away (early 60's in Iowa). This is from a guy who before and after drove $50 dollar cars.

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767646 03/09/19 2:49 pm
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My friend Walter using a Sikens mix system painted Capt. Jims A-65 Spitfire Porsche code C966B Red

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767671 03/09/19 5:23 pm
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Quote
Personally I prefer the darker red of the Spitfire over the candy red of the Lightning,


I sourced the candy paint for my painter and gave him samples of what I wanted ie 3 to 4 red candy coats over a gold base (I know it should have been silver base but I wanted a warmer effect) but he did 5 coats, when I saw the result I did not complain. It does not match Flamboyant Red but its a good colour with a darker red. So just do the candy with extra coats to get closer to the Spitfire red, pretty sure that's what the factory did to change colours from one year to the next, just added or deleted coats of candy.

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767680 03/09/19 6:54 pm
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I found the candy was hard to judge as it all looks the same when applying the candy. (Flat red) you have to make sure you spray as evenly as you can as soon as you apply the lacquer and the colour pops then you’ll see how deep the red is and how even your coats are. The silver base makes a huge difference also. The bsa silver was more flecked, the Honda colours I bought were more like a pearlised effect. Makes a big difference to the depth of the finish.


Now let’s all have a beer beerchug

68’ A65 Lightning “clubman”
71’ A65 823 Thunderbolt (undergoing restoration)
67’ D10 sportsman (undergoing restoration)
68’ D14 trials (undergoing transformation)

Re: Paint!
Bill Evans #767894 03/12/19 7:51 am
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SRM apparently recommend, as a match to BSA Flamboyant Red (and I do subscribe to Trevor's comments on originality and "what would you like it to look like!")

PORSCHE Brilliant Red ICI Code C966B
or 1989 GM Brilliant Red Metallic Dupont B8947

Mebbo


Moderated by  Allan G, Jon W. Whitley 

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