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Steering damper #757045
11/25/18 1:34 am
11/25/18 1:34 am
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 56
washington
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brianpankow Offline OP
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Posts: 56
washington
Hello all,
I’m finally getting the time to start putting the ‘66 Bonneville back together in it’s full nut and bolt restoration. The answer to my question may seem obvious to everyone except me. Does the steering damper get grease between the friction disc and anchor plate or is it left dry? Everything on this bike was a dried up powder coated mess when I purchased it (I mean they didn’t even remove small parts. Just coated over the entire assembly in many cases), so even though they appeared to grease this area I’m not sure I would care to trust what they did.

Thank you

Brian
1975 Commando
1966 Bonneville (work in progress)

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Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757053
11/25/18 2:54 am
11/25/18 2:54 am
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,850
OZ
Triless Offline
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Triless  Offline
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Posts: 1,850
OZ
Brian, I keep the friction disc dry as grease would negate the friction ! To qualify this, my girder fork Matchless has friction discs in both front fork suspension disc dampers as well as for steering, and my Triumph '64 framed T140 special has the friction disc steering damper .

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757076
11/25/18 1:51 pm
11/25/18 1:51 pm
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
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Hermit Offline

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Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
As Triless said, definitely dry.

The damper is very good on bad roads and windy days, just be sure to loosen it when you get into town!

My theory is that wind affects the down-road trajectory not so much by its action on the bike, but on the upper body of the rider. The wind pushes the rider, whose shoulders move, and the motion is transmitted to the handlebars. The steering damper virtually eliminates the effect.

The damper I retro-fitted to my 1969 T120R is the earlier version, as found on your 1966 Bonnie.

------------------------------------------
Be careful not to loosen the damper too much or the adjuster sleeve (97-0408) will fall off, along with the star washer (97-0095). Triumph later modified the damper rod by drilling the end and installing a cotter pin.
------------------------------------------
As pointed out by Dave below, there was no Triumph modification to the damper rod as stated. The sleeve nut and star washer are retained by 'locating pin' p/n 97-1286 (1966), and 97-2107 (1967-1970).

www.hermit.cc/tmc/om/manual.htm#stda

Last edited by Hermit; 11/26/18 12:44 pm. Reason: Point out erroneous assertion about damper

Bruce Miller
aka The Hermit
The Bonnie Ref: https://www.hermit.cc/tmc/om/manual.htm
Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757090
11/25/18 4:34 pm
11/25/18 4:34 pm
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,154
Elburn, Ill. USA
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Irish Swede Offline
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Irish Swede  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,154
Elburn, Ill. USA

"Powder coating all over everything."

Ain't powder-coating just wonderful?

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757112
11/25/18 9:24 pm
11/25/18 9:24 pm
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 56
washington
B
brianpankow Offline OP
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brianpankow  Offline OP
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washington
Thank you all. I figured as much, but though safest to tape into this wonderful resource.

Re: Steering damper [Re: Hermit] #757123
11/25/18 11:44 pm
11/25/18 11:44 pm
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 317
seattle
T
tiumphdave Offline
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 317
seattle


The damper I retro-fitted to my 1969 T120R is the earlier version, as found on your 1966 Bonnie. Be careful not loosen the damper too much or the adjuster sleeve (97-0408) will fall off, along with the star washer (97-0095). Triumph later modified the damper rod by drilling the end and installing a cotter pin.

www.hermit.cc/tmc/om/manual.htm#stda[/quote]

I don't think I've ever seen a pre-oif triumph lower clamp (triple tree) that didn't have a set screw to prevent what you describe from happening. "66 parts book calls it a "locating pin - p/n 97-1286".I have seen that cotter pin used on BSA models though.

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757128
11/26/18 1:13 am
11/26/18 1:13 am
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,813
New Jersey USA
Tridentman Online content

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Posts: 4,813
New Jersey USA
On a solo you just need the damper biting but not screwed down hard.
This will stop the head shaking on a long sweeping bend with less than perfect surface.
However on a road outfit you need it screwed down pretty tightly to stop the head shaking badly.
DAMHIK!

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757131
11/26/18 2:04 am
11/26/18 2:04 am
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
H
Hermit Offline

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Hermit  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
Dave, I looked in all the parts manuals from '66 through '70 and you're right about the there being no mod. I think the fellow who told me about that was saying that I should make that mod.

And you're also correct about the 97-1286 locating pin, so theoretically I shouldn't need that mod.

Steering damper grub screw 07-1286 on Ebay

Nothing stopped the the first nut from falling off after I installed the steering damper on my '69, but that could very well have been because the locating pin wasn't installed. Will have to take a look on the bike next time I go over to the Bonnie Castle.

The figures for the TR6C triple trees don't show that locating pin, but I guess they're just showing what's different from the T120 and TR6 trees in those figures so probably they have them also. I saw that the p/n changed in '67.


[Linked Image]


Bruce Miller
aka The Hermit
The Bonnie Ref: https://www.hermit.cc/tmc/om/manual.htm
Re: Steering damper [Re: Tridentman] #757132
11/26/18 2:11 am
11/26/18 2:11 am
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
H
Hermit Offline

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Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
Tridentman,

Interesting observations, obviously from the voice of experience. But what do you mean by "road outfit" ?

Originally Posted by Tridentman
On a solo you just need the damper biting but not screwed down hard.
This will stop the head shaking on a long sweeping bend with less than perfect surface.
However on a road outfit you need it screwed down pretty tightly to stop the head shaking badly.
DAMHIK!


Bruce Miller
aka The Hermit
The Bonnie Ref: https://www.hermit.cc/tmc/om/manual.htm
Re: Steering damper [Re: Hermit] #757142
11/26/18 5:55 am
11/26/18 5:55 am
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,850
OZ
Triless Offline
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Triless  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,850
OZ
Motorcycle with sidecar attached !

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757167
11/26/18 12:49 pm
11/26/18 12:49 pm
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
H
Hermit Offline

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Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
TriumphDave - No locating pin on my bike - will order one in the near future! Thanks for the heads-up - I've made corrections here and on the hermit.cc website.

Triless - thought perhaps so, but wasn't sure. Good to know. Front end oscillations with sidecar attached sounds like it could be pretty scary!


Bruce Miller
aka The Hermit
The Bonnie Ref: https://www.hermit.cc/tmc/om/manual.htm
Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757170
11/26/18 1:09 pm
11/26/18 1:09 pm
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,813
New Jersey USA
Tridentman Online content

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Tridentman  Online Content

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Posts: 4,813
New Jersey USA
Hermit--confirm as Triless.
"Back in the Day" in UK with little money I ran a series of BSA A10 sidecar outfits as my only form of transportation.
On those a steering damper was essential to stop the head wagging!
If you ever have the opportunity--try it sometime--riding an outfit is truly the third way (the others being riding a solo bike and driving a car).
HTH

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757174
11/26/18 1:48 pm
11/26/18 1:48 pm
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,154
Elburn, Ill. USA
I
Irish Swede Offline
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Irish Swede  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,154
Elburn, Ill. USA
I ran a '47 Harley "74" with a side car some years ago. It had an inadequate small friction damper on the steering head

Only twice did the front fork ever go into a 'tank-slapper' on decelleration, but twice was enough!

i never did install a hydraulic steering damper, but I should have.

Another thing about sidecar rigs: People who HATE motorcycles will smile and wave when seeing a sidecar bike.

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757208
11/26/18 6:01 pm
11/26/18 6:01 pm
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
kevin roberts Online content

DOPE
kevin roberts  Online Content

DOPE

Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
i used to own a 1950 hudson stepdown. same thing. everywhere i went i was a one-man parade.


every day you do not take a chance is a day of your life that you will never get back.
Re: Steering damper [Re: kevin roberts] #757219
11/26/18 9:10 pm
11/26/18 9:10 pm
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,850
OZ
Triless Offline
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Triless  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,850
OZ
But in what way , Kevin ? Because it was a cool car, or was the front end oscillating like a clown car because of lack of suspension dampening ?

Last edited by Triless; 11/26/18 9:12 pm. Reason: spelling
Re: Steering damper [Re: Triless] #757228
11/26/18 10:40 pm
11/26/18 10:40 pm
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,444
In a NY state of mind
Hillbilly bike Online content
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Hillbilly bike  Online Content
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Posts: 4,444
In a NY state of mind
Stephen, I have spent time with Kevin,he is a one man parade without the Hudson... lol.......I don't care for steering dampers when drilling through built up areas with sharp turns, I feel it makes the bike fall into the turn more than usual...Triumphs don't steer fast like modern sport bikes but they do, in my experience,get a little nervous at higher speeds so a light damper is ok.. Tapered roller steering bearings preload slightly may offer the same result...


If it was not for bikes I may have been an Emperor
Re: Steering damper [Re: Triless] #757230
11/26/18 11:29 pm
11/26/18 11:29 pm
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
kevin roberts Online content

DOPE
kevin roberts  Online Content

DOPE

Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
Originally Posted by Triless
But in what way , Kevin ? Because it was a cool car, or was the front end oscillating like a clown car because of lack of suspension dampening ?



you have no idea how cool a car a stepdown is, stephen. people would clap and chase me down to take pictures . . . once a punjabi convenience store clerk in gila bend arizona ran out of his store to exclaim that he hadn't seen a stepdown since he learned to drive in one as a child in the old country. they're beautiful but weird:

[Linked Image]

but their front-end construction was ahead of it's time. smoky yunick dominated nascar for three years with them, and it wasn' because their motor was any good:


[Linked Image]


every day you do not take a chance is a day of your life that you will never get back.
Re: Steering damper [Re: Hillbilly bike] #757232
11/26/18 11:34 pm
11/26/18 11:34 pm
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
kevin roberts Online content

DOPE
kevin roberts  Online Content

DOPE

Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
Stephen, I have spent time with Kevin,he is a one man parade without the Hudson... lol......



i'm not completely sure how to interpret that, you know.


every day you do not take a chance is a day of your life that you will never get back.
Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757236
11/26/18 11:57 pm
11/26/18 11:57 pm
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 122
Ontario Canada
B
Bob Buchanan Offline
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 122
Ontario Canada
Had 1951 Pacemaker and never had steering concerns even when pulling away from 1959 Buick at 100 mph indicated in 1960.Just flathead six.,not the Hornet motor.

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757249
11/27/18 1:45 am
11/27/18 1:45 am
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
kevin roberts Online content

DOPE
kevin roberts  Online Content

DOPE

Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,886
ohio, usa
someone took a fourdoor and put a 7X in it 15 years ago and took it to bonneville. did close to 130 i think.


every day you do not take a chance is a day of your life that you will never get back.
Re: Steering damper [Re: kevin roberts] #757254
11/27/18 2:18 am
11/27/18 2:18 am
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,850
OZ
Triless Offline
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Triless  Offline
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Posts: 1,850
OZ
Kevin, definitely a cool car ! I can remember seeing Hudsons over here in the '50's that looked like yours ! I think OZ was a relatively healthy market for Hudson/Essex/Terraplane for a few years !

Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757286
11/27/18 12:37 pm
11/27/18 12:37 pm
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 205
Quebec Canada
H
Hermit Offline

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Quebec Canada
When I was still in diapers my parents had a Hudson. My mother says it was a very advanced automobile. Among other features the transmission could be operated in automatic or standard modes. When the automatic transmission broke down she said they just switched over to standard.

On another topic unrelated to Triumphs, I don't suppose anyone knows what's going on with Admin and S____t? Thread moved to a personal profile? What's happening?

If i'm banned for posting this all i can say is 'Bye everyone'.


Bruce Miller
aka The Hermit
The Bonnie Ref: https://www.hermit.cc/tmc/om/manual.htm
Re: Steering damper [Re: kevin roberts] #757289
11/27/18 2:12 pm
11/27/18 2:12 pm
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,444
In a NY state of mind
Hillbilly bike Online content
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Hillbilly bike  Online Content
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In a NY state of mind
Originally Posted by kevin roberts
Originally Posted by Hillbilly bike
Stephen, I have spent time with Kevin,he is a one man parade without the Hudson... lol......



i'm not completely sure how to interpret that, you know.


Consider it a compliment, a remark about your congenial person and devotion to putting your pile of parts to the front of the pack...

The "Fabulous Hornets " you mentioned were tuned for Nascar by a young Smokey Yunick, about 200-210 HP.The Hudsons had a low center of gravity giving them better handling on the dirt oval tracks used in Nascar then...Flathead development was at it's peak and the new OHV V8 short stroke engines were still in early states of tuning..The Olds 303 OHV "Kettering" design combustion chamber had more potential but hydraulic lifters that pumped up at 4000 rpm limited power. Stock cars were based on stock cars back then and engine modifications were limited..By 1954 the OHV engines began to make power, then in 55 came the Chevrolet small block V-8 and the Chrysler Hemi dominance on faster paved tracks, the flat heads were finished forever..








If it was not for bikes I may have been an Emperor
Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757322
11/27/18 6:30 pm
11/27/18 6:30 pm
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,333
Maui Hawaii
HawaiianTiger Online content
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HawaiianTiger  Online Content
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Posts: 6,333
Maui Hawaii
Cool car, that Hudson. My neighbor had one in the 50's. All the neighborhood kids could fit in the back seat with three in the shelf under that back window. Smooth....

It had a fold up clutch pedal if I remember right.

Cheers,
Bill


Bikes
1974 Commando
1985 Honda Nighthawk 650
1957 Thunderbird/T110 "Flying Tiger"
Antique Fans: Loads of Emersons (Two six wingers) plus gyros and orbiters.
Re: Steering damper [Re: brianpankow] #757337
11/27/18 9:30 pm
11/27/18 9:30 pm
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,154
Elburn, Ill. USA
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Irish Swede Offline
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Elburn, Ill. USA
Any more to be said here on STEERING DAMPERS?

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