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M21 hub spacers #727858
03/07/18 6:40 am
03/07/18 6:40 am
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Ian W Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Ian W  Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Good morning everyone.

I'm busy restoring a 1955 M21 which I received in a dismantled state and, as you all know, there are inevitably bits missing.

At this moment I am short of several wheel hub spacers. I could order these and wait several months for them to get through our hopelessly backlogged customs office, or I could turn them up on the lathe at work in 5 minutes flat.
If only I had the dimensions...

So, in the expectation that I'm not the first person to want to make these simple parts, I wonder if anyone happens to have the dimensions of the following for my 7" front hub and 7" rear crinkle (plunger) hub:

Firstly the simple tubular distance collar which fits under the nut on the right hand end of the front hub (65-5890), and
the two similarly shaped collared tubular distance pieces which sit either side of the right hand cover plate on the rear hub. (67-6066 and 67-6077).

I would probably be able to deduce the sizes by measuring the spaces in the assembled hubs, but would always have a question mark about whether I had allowed the correct clearances and so forth.

Thanks in advance (and in hope!)

Regards,

Ian


Ian
1955 BSA M21
Hinckley Bonneville
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Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: Ian W] #728173
03/10/18 2:25 am
03/10/18 2:25 am
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,725
Sydney Australia
B
BSA_WM20 Offline
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BSA_WM20  Offline
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B
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,725
Sydney Australia
Pop over to the M20 forum, Renamed military vehicle forum .
Wm20 web forum


Bike Beesa
Trevor
Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: BSA_WM20] #728188
03/10/18 4:37 am
03/10/18 4:37 am
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Ian W Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Ian W  Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Thanks,

I will give it a try.


Ian
1955 BSA M21
Hinckley Bonneville
Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: Ian W] #728740
03/16/18 6:33 am
03/16/18 6:33 am
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Ian W Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Ian W  Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Seems that nobody has the information to hand, no matter.

After much perusal of diagrams and head scratching I think that I am right if I say that the following stack of rear hub components, from left to right, must equal the distance between the wheel slots on my plungers.

Brake cover plate (thickness), Left hand hub collar, brake drum bearing inner race, shoulder of rear hub bearing sleeve, left hand hub bearing inner race, distance tube, right hand hub bearing inner race, and then the two missing spacers. This should then be tightened to form one solid member locking the axle, bearing inner races and the frame together. It should also define the position of the wheel along the axle.
Therefore, I can figure out the combined length of the two right hand spacers, which is the important dimension I need.

Finally, the only other thing I should worry about is inadvertently putting side loads on the hub bearings.

Whew. Does that sound right?

The front hub seems a bit trickier, as the missing distance collar seems to define the sideways position of the wheel between the forks. Thus I would need to centralize the wheel (not the hub) and then deduce the spacer thickness required.
I think.

Anyway, wheel de-lacing this weekend and then we'll get to it once it's re-laced and the final hub offsets are in place.


Ian
1955 BSA M21
Hinckley Bonneville
Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: Ian W] #728744
03/16/18 8:08 am
03/16/18 8:08 am
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 94
Australia
M
MattL Offline
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MattL  Offline
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M
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 94
Australia
Ian,

Before you do any de-lacing measure the rim to hub offset. the rims are not necessarily centred over centre line of the hub especially on the rear.
I have the offsets in my notes somewhere and will try to dig them out over the weekend but would be good to check with what you already have.

I can get you the front collar length on Sunday and actually 65-5890 is on the LH side as the spindle is inserted from the left. the rear is trickier as I would need to remove panniers to take the wheel out and i'm not to keen on taking them off once again.
we'll see how enthusiastic I am come Sun.

Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: Ian W] #728751
03/16/18 10:47 am
03/16/18 10:47 am
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Ian W Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Ian W  Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Matt,

Thanks very much, I'd love to compare your offset measurements to mine as I have little trust in what people have done to my poor bike in the past!

However, I really don't want you to start stripping things down, I was just hoping that someone might have the info available in their notes somewhere. Going for a ride instead of taking wheels off is a much better idea!

The front collar I think is the most important, as I'm pretty sure the rear spacer lengths will become self evident once I have the hub assembled in the plungers, which I will do once the new bearings are in. Still can't figure out how the P.O. had the wheel assembled though!

Cheers,
Ian


Ian
1955 BSA M21
Hinckley Bonneville
Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: Ian W] #728960
03/18/18 1:48 am
03/18/18 1:48 am
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 94
Australia
M
MattL Offline
BritBike Forum member
MattL  Offline
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M
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 94
Australia
Ian,

Can't seem to find my notes on my rim offsets, have found some for the girder fork model but these will be wrong. I measure my front at 16mm from drum edge to rim using a WM3 rim (78mm wide).
I think that I set the rear offset with the wheel mounted in the frame running a string line from the head stock.

The collar size is OD - 28.5mm ID - 22.4mm length - 7mm.

Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: Ian W] #728977
03/18/18 4:25 am
03/18/18 4:25 am
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Ian W Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Ian W  Offline OP
BritBike Forum member
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 19
South Africa
Thanks Matt, I'll be making up that front spacer tomorrow.

As for the wheel offsets, I decided to assume that the existing wheels are correct, and knocked together a wheel building jig to suit the wheels as they are currently set up.
Let's see how it goes.

Something that has been at the back of my mind for a while. The M21 is such an un-glamorous bike, (and, I understand, so common, in the UK at least), do you think anyone would be interested if I did a build thread on her? Or would everyone groan "Oh no, not another one!"


Ian
1955 BSA M21
Hinckley Bonneville
Re: M21 hub spacers [Re: Ian W] #729140
03/19/18 7:15 am
03/19/18 7:15 am
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 94
Australia
M
MattL Offline
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MattL  Offline
BritBike Forum member
M
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 94
Australia
There aren't many M series bike builds here. I'm interested, I say go for it.


Moderated by  Allan Gill, Jon W. Whitley 


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