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Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41738 08/22/08 12:47 pm
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Alex Offline OP
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So I've ridden the Rickman to work a couple of times now, but yesterday I take the last sharp turn into work and the backend just slides out on me. The tires are old, but this was bad. So, when I pull into the parking lot, the oil light comes on at idle and there's oil just dripping from all under the bike. My rear tire's coated and the oil level's down about a pint. I look for loose lines or other obvious leaks and nothing. I clean it up and take it for a short ride and no leaks. Oil level stays the same. I then ride the 20 miles home and at every light, I look for signs of leakage. Nothing until I get home...oil is pouring out. The frame is very hot (OIF) and the oil light comes on again at idle and the oil level is down another pint. So, I thoroughly degrease the bike, take it for a spin to dry off and then let it idle for about 1/2 hour. The oil light starts to come on at idle again and the oil is very hot. I am getting return, but the oil level is dropping again...but still no leak. She starts to smoke a bit. Still no leak. I scoot her around the neighborhood maybe 1/4 mile at no more than 35 mph and bingo! Oil all over the bottom of the motor. This time, though, I can tell it's coming from the breather. I loosen the sump plate and nearly a quart of oil comes out.

So, my question: Why would it only wetsump when it's hot? What are the possible scenarios for the return side still returning but not quite keeping up? One thing I've noticed is that the return checkvalve doesn't appear to be seating correctly since the return line drains back into the sump very quickly when I turn the motor off.

Thoughts and advice would be appreciated. All of my bikes seem to be quitting right before the Raleigh Rumble frown


A smattering:
'53 Gold Flash
'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
sixtyseventy Lightboltrocket road racer...and many more.
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Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41739 08/22/08 1:04 pm
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RGSROB Offline
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Hi Alex, sorry to hear of your troubles.Had a similar situation on a velo once. Turned out that at low running speeds oil made it back through the oilways and filter.At high engine speed the partially plugged filter caused the return oil line to blow off the fitting.
Suggest you Check you have a really clear return path.

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41740 08/22/08 1:08 pm
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RGSROB Offline
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P,S, Alex, Rickmans' are a bit notorious for contaminated(plugged) frames. Might be a really good idea to install a cental oil tank and abandon the oil in frame,
Gladly take all this junk of your hands(he he)

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41741 08/22/08 2:07 pm
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Melbourne Metisse Offline
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I know this is going to sound daft but... are the oil pump connections like those on Triumph? If so it is possible to get the feed and scavenge pipes connected the wrong way round?

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41742 08/22/08 3:40 pm
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Alex Offline OP
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No, no, don't leave anything out. I've done dumber things :rolleyes: , but I did check that. Besides, I rode for about 200 miles without any problem whatsoever...

Nice try, Rob...but in all seriousness, I'd thought of the cloggage in the frame. Problem is, that it would have to be on the return ONLY...and sludge would clog the feed side.


A smattering:
'53 Gold Flash
'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
sixtyseventy Lightboltrocket road racer...and many more.
Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41743 08/22/08 6:00 pm
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still possible to have a clogged return and good feed.Can you rig up a catch bottle and see how much is returned and if it stops chucking it out of the breather. The rockers can live without oil for the short while you indicated that it took for the problem to show up.

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41744 08/22/08 6:11 pm
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kelvin Offline
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It is possible the return rubber pipe has perished internally try replacing this pipe.
Kelvin UK.

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41745 08/22/08 8:12 pm
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aprophet Offline
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OPRV stuck open? beerchug


1964 A65C Rocket (Jeanie)
1971 T25SS
1971 A65T BSA (Lucile)
1965 A65D Lightning Rocket
Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41746 08/22/08 8:42 pm
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Hi Alex, the real puzzler is the reported high heat of the oil in the frame.Obviously the black stuff is returning after being massaged through the engine. Just wondering out loud if there is any chance that the oil has been thinned down by some fuel system fault?
oil and gas mixtures are not easy to return with a gear pump.
Just grasping at straws.
Rob

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41747 08/22/08 8:49 pm
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Alex Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by aprophet:
OPRV stuck open? beerchug
Good thinkin'. I like it. Could certainly describe the symptoms and is easy to check.

Fuel thinning...possible, but I didn't smell anything on the oil. I'm definitely changing it again, though.


A smattering:
'53 Gold Flash
'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
sixtyseventy Lightboltrocket road racer...and many more.
Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41748 08/22/08 10:31 pm
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Melbourne Metisse Offline
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Incidentally Alex to give you a comparison, my frame is just warm to the touch after 30 to 60 minutes of running...

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41749 08/23/08 7:53 am
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BSA_WM20 Offline
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A blocked breather can also cause a similar problem as can oil that foams excessivly.


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Trevor
Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41750 08/23/08 11:03 am
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Mr Mike Offline
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Alex,
Here's a little test to eliminate some things. Drain sump, disconnect return line and feed it into ajar. Crank the bike and run at say 1000 rpms for 5 minutes (you can squirt a little oil into the top end line with a hand oil gun if you have concerns). See if the flow caluclation and amount of oil are anywhere close to matching. Drop the sump and add that to the jar. I suspect that the pickup tube may not be picking up consistently because of a restricted line or something nd you just have to find it.

Mr Mike

Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41751 08/23/08 10:59 pm
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Alex Offline OP
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Allright....thanks for the ideas, guys...the oil did seem kinda thin, even cold but didn't smell like gas. The return lines (three @ 3/16" ea) were old and had kind of shrunk a bit. Nice thing is the front ones run right between the headstock and the gas tank so when they are new, clear vinyl, you can see the oil returning as you ride. Clever. I checked the relief valve, sump screen, tank/frame screen and all were clear and clean. I timed the bike and it was way advanced on the left cylinder. Fresh 20/50 oil...15 minute ride...30 minutes of idling...another ride...no leak. I guess it's good. It bothers me a little that there's no smoking gun, but the bother goes away when I ride the bike. It's a gem.


A smattering:
'53 Gold Flash
'67 Royal Star
'71 Rickman Metisse
'40 Silver Star
'37 Rudge Special
sixtyseventy Lightboltrocket road racer...and many more.
Re: Rickman A65 wetsumping - Aaaaargh! #41752 08/24/08 5:57 am
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Mark Parker Offline
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Alex I once had an oil line running up to an oil cooler that was restricted with a tightish cable tie and a bend at the same location, it wasn't blocked but the line was restricted, when I rode it fairly fast for some time it did that, oil all over the bike!! Fortunately I noticed the restriction before pulling the motor apart. My guess is your problem may have been the same.


mark

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